[Suggestion] Phasing out 0.75 ADS overtime.

The Anchor has a straight up and Right pull. The EM6 Does not. They both have almost identical upward recoil. So please...make up more statements lol.

And no the MSW-R and T9 Carv do not have the same job as the MSW-r Is superior to the T9 in every way but Mag size. That's it.

I'm not ******* around,Saokeh

And yes,I'm excluding the range engagements,if you have recoil problems with it so you are probably using it at a wrong distance

Your original point was that it was faction related and that the GD7F goes straight up. Which it clearly does not. So please if you're going to try and talk facts then do so. And I think you're just trying to get this thread locked haha. Because people already know how ridiculous 0.75 ads is on an LMG with amazing ttk and it's not a faction trait. Period.

Again with the stubborn attitude,saying the SAME thing and I already explained WHY it's so and how other LMGs are competitive with it

As for that GD7F,I personally don't have issues with it

YOU JUST QUOTED YOURSELF

No you did not explain it as I said, the less accurate LMG is the one with a small mag. If the Anchor was more accurate then the EM6 would serve zero purpose since they share the same RPM and Damage model.

So reasons on making the Orion more accurate than any other LMG while the t9 Carv with the same damage model and rpm sits as one of the worst? Zero logic in that. And no 50 bullets does not qualify the gun for that kind of tradeoff.

Here's the ONLY way you can justify balance with the accuracy trait VS was meant to have. On high end RPM weapons it should not be present. Meaning a 750 RPM and 143 Damage the top end of the barrel. If you want a gun that has amazing accuracy you'll have to bring it down to SV 88 levels of RPM. So that's what I propose. Making the default and BG copy the SV 88 while buffing its accuracy without the 0.75 ADS. And throwing the Orion with SPA and keeping the 750 143 damage model non default, also without 0.75 ADS. This will give you an accurate range weapon that the BG was MEANT for with the Heat mechanic. And a nice CQC weapon to contend with the Anchor and MSW-R. Done and Done.

This thread, is just plain silly. There's bias everywhere, nothing is moving forward. Basically, its turned into an argument for argument's sake. Cut it out.

For the .75 ads. Take it.

What I think is a BS Argument?
1.) It completely mitigates HA shield downsides.- This is just false, as it literally does not. It certainly helps, but it doesn't completely mitigate it. Also, even with a .75 ads weapon, with your HA shield active you are still only moving .6 something. If you can hit someone hipfiring at 1.0, you can hit someone going .6 something.
2.) It completely breaks the game.- Also false, as the game has been around 2 years with .75 ads. A more true statement would be, "it is the next item being observed for balance reasons." It doesn't break the game more than Maxes with shotgun arms, buggies with user friendly AV chainguns, NC having the best shotgun (jackie dearest), or a scythe that hovers better than its peers.
3.) It isn't that important.- Yet again, false. .75 ads is a trait of certain weapons. These weapons were balanced and tuned with that trait in mind. To blatantly remove it would bring said weapons below where they "should" be. In addition to this, .75 ads is still a useful trait.
4.) The weapons are still just fine with how they are on test server.- False, just plain false. Each weapon is basically going to become a sub-par version of its sister weapons in other factions (battlegoose excluded). For example the Orion will effectively become inferior to the Anchor and the MSW-R. And yes, while the Orion on test might be "a good enough weapon", that doesn't mean it is balanced fairly within its "tier". And before anyone brings it up, lets not be silly and pretend the Orion is supposed to be balanced versus different LMGs just because it is a default weapon. This isn't an argument on if the default LMG for VS is fair, its an argument about balancing. After they balance the weapon properly, then make a thread concerning default LMGs for the factions.
4*) As a side note, VS weapons tend to lack in almost EVERY category. They just aren't "best in class" no matter the weapon, except for LMGs at this moment in time. I'm not going to wear a tinfoil hat and call conspiracy, but when the facts clearly show all our weapons in 2nd or 3rd place, it becomes an observation not an opinion. Also, if you really think giving the VS a sub-par Orion is fair because it's a "perfectly good enough" weapon. Then you are basically saying, VS with sub-par weapon is equal fair and balanced with TR or NC with a better weapon. You basically are saying that VS are better players who need worse weapons to be balanced. And don't try to turn this around on me, YOU GUYS are the ones who said it, I'm just pointing it out. I don't really think it is true.

THE ONE, AND ONLY REASON WHY I TOTALLY AGREE WITH .75 ADS BEING REMOVED IS THIS.
1.) This game has so many technical issues it's astounding. Call it client-side, bad internet, latency, fps, whatever. For example, just today how many times have you died behind cover or around a corner? I can totally believe that the netcode is crap, even if I wouldn't have seen it first hand (though I have.) It is the same problem as ZOE I would assume. In this game, mobility in general is hard to balance not because it is "OP" but because movement can't be easily observed by numbers or a spreadsheet (like rpm, damage, dropoff ranges, etc.). Also, because of this game's severe lacking in consistent and reliable functionality, any extra mobility can cause technical issues. At close range, while .75 ads might visually not be much (to a human eye or hand while aiming), the game's coding might have problems for whatever reason. I'm not a programmer, nor have I done any work on this game, but I can theorize right? I totally believe that .75 ads probably has some technical issues that cause too large a problem. And while the better answer is to fix said problems, I don't believe it is either possible with how the game is, or with the employees DBG has.

That is the ONLY reason I am ok with losing .75 ads.

What I am not ok with, is getting sub-par weapons in exchange for losing one of our positive benefits in our weapons. Take if it you must, but at the very least buff something meaningful in return. The proposed changes on test are unacceptable. They either buffed something arguably useless, or they buffed traits on the weapon...that it was never made for in the first place. It would be akin to making a bolt action sniper rifle, and buffing it with an attachment that lets it shoot more accurately in full auto...even though its a bolt action. Get my drift? All the weapons should be equal, if they aren't now then feel free to take .75 ads to fix them, but again make them equal, don't just nerf the .75 ads weapons lower than their peers. Especially considering those are basically the only competitive LMGs VS currently has at the moment.

congrats, you have summed up ever arguement on .75 ads in one post

I try

1) No, so very no. At what point does survivability AND accuracy have anything to do with hip fire while using overshield? The guns that are extremely hip fire capable aren't found on a HA for a reason. And the ones that are, well those are SMG's and they don't have just 1 damage tier drop off. That's just nuts. So saying you're able to overshield giving you effective health and be able to move as fast as one that doesn't use it because you have to shoot at targets that Don't get that health who move as quickly or faster is suppose to be an equal trade? I laughed a little there.

2) Yes is game breaking in balance as 0.75 mid range capable accuracy was never suppose to be on a weapon, on a class that typically can soak up almost twice as much damage as any other to be able to perform outside of CQC. When you think Tanky in any other game for balance issues, you think of slow, inaccurate, and lots of ammo. At what point does more movement and the ability to dodge better than another with equal damage = tanky? There's a real reason why this is considered unbalance.

3) Also false as the Orion was tuned with better hip fire and ultimately pretty good accuracy only to outshine guns like the T9 Carv post nerf for years even though sharing the same damage model.

4) And also No. Guns like the T9 Carv isn't even a sidegrade it's a straight downgrade in every sense of the word. VS perform amazing in ESF's A2A, easily win A2G. Magriders fight for the top with Prowlers month to month. Gun performance their direct guns are on par with the top or THE top in every category. But apparently you aren't familiar with making variations of guns with similar damage models. Here let me explain it to you. if you keep steady unchanging models like 750 143, you're going to have slight variations to make them different. But ultimately one will be better at whatever variation they received. You're going to get slightly higher performing weapons than the other. But you should never get drastically different like the T9 Carv and the Orion.

Arguing the point that you don't want sidegrades in a number locked game is just silly. It's like taking a 750 RPM 143 and making it a 750 RPM with a 135 damage model. It will take just as many shots to kill but to make the coding and hit detection easier it's all set to the same. Now its a function check. Which 0.75 ADS on a weapon that can hit just as hard as any other gun at MID range while being able to strafe at the speed of a CQC weapon is unacceptable. And you say like the issue was brought up yesterday or something? Go look it up, its been on the forums for over 2 years.

Buddy........

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/ps...peed-difference-between-0-5x-and-0-75.230894/

So, your reply was blatantly insulting, just putting that out there. What are you even arguing for anymore? I'm agreeing aren't I? I agree to remove .75 ads. Or, do you just want me to think like you? Are you just obsessed that I agree with you on everything? I mean seriously man, that whole post was basically you flipping out because I disagree with what you think. Point of the matter is though, I agree .75 ads should be removed as long as there is a proper trade for another beneficial trait.

What's your deal?

Hrm, alright. Truthfully I personally don't find this too large a "thing". But seeing this I can understand how some might. I think that's fair. I still think the rest of my post is fine and fair though.

I listed your points of why you think it was a BS argument. Because it isn't and it never was. Yes it should be removed, but there are only so many ways you can improve a gun with the same damage model and RPM and not make others with the same inferior. That's where the sidegrades and copies you don't like come in. It's not the compensation people are complaining about, it's the sidegrade feeling, which is literally unavoidable. Unless you want to still have the strongest gun in the game, which by your words of VS not getting anything that's the "Best" so you do. Also unacceptable. The game's numbers are balanced with variations of the same numbers in most cases. Go back to my solution of fixing this ADS problem. Give the Orion the SV 88 stats or making SV 88 the default. Make it a little more accurate, and give the Orion or the SV88 the 750 143, with SPA. This will give a unique gun for the VS as it presents an accurate 143 damage gun without SPA to counter the Bull and give a better reason to use the Heat Mechanic to its full potential. And give the other CQC capability to compete with Anchor and MSW-r.

Changing those 2 guns and then give the Pulsar a little better hip fire with a little less accuracy. And essentially giving the starter weapon a compensator on what the Pulsar already is (That's actually not attached) and slightly tweak the accuracy of horizontal shake or tolerance if needed. This gives VS viable options in literally every category. How would that not be fair?

Based on how irrational you act, I deem all your opinions irrelevant.

Because your points are biased, I act irrational? I think you have your words mixed up there. Should have said "Based on how Biased I am, I deem all your opinions irrelevant" That would make waaaay more sense. As my points revolve around actual gameplay and weapon design. Your passive go ahead and remove 0.75 ads but Woe is Vanu, we have the worst guns and need to be overcompensated for the loss of the single most overpowered addition to a high ttk mid to long range capable gun. Yep, acting irrational over here. Haha

I actually presented a logical and unique design for the Vanu. Since it would bring the Accuracy they were built on in Beta back to the table.

I would even consider doing essentially what the Devs did with the the Torq 9. Bringing it down a damage model, but giving it amazing accuracy (keeping in VS theme) to compensate for the damage. meaning it will be 125 at all ranges with it's still 750 rpm (Making it more like a laser/plasma gun). and essentially boosting the SV 88 up to 750 as well with SPA but remove compensator. This gives a very viable cqc to compete with the already MSW-r. And gives Vanu a flavor of gun this isn't a copy of the already T9 Carv or MSW-r in model and rpm. Also great for the heat mechanic.