No C-4 for LA

Discussion in 'Light Assault' started by Anchor IV, Aug 24, 2014.

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  1. DFDelta

    Accountwide I'm at around 900 pulled Lightnings (I just added together all my deaths-in from all my characters on the DasAnfall stats side, so the number isn't 100% correct).

    Most of them are Skyguards or AV ones. I'd be surprised if I lost more then 50 of them to C4.
    And I have not even used radar ever since they moved it from utility to defense.

    Stop camping on hills, idly firing at spawn rooms. Don't be too focused in one direction in the first place.
    Stop parking next to buildings, especially if that building contains enemy soldiers.
    Practice your situational awareness. (Look around while reloading if you're in a fixed position.)
    Stop standing around for 5 minutes.
    Stop rambo~ing solo.

    Basically the only thing you can not defend yourself from are people jumping out of ESF, and despite when people thend to think that is not unique to the LA. The LA just saves the certs for the ejection seat.
  2. Corezer

    I remember when people used to always complain about LA C4ing sunderers, little did they know it was mostly engies squad deploying on it with the necessary 3rd brick.
    • Up x 2
  3. Bankrotas

    AT mines did job better. Few had mineguard on their sundies, few still have.
    • Up x 2
  4. Alarox

    Threads like this polarize the community even more. Really irks me. It just reinforces the infantryside crowd.

    C4 on a LA is fine.
    • Up x 4
  5. Posse

    I offer you a trade, we make C4 more expensive, but HE or HEAT MBTs and Lightnings now cost 750 resources, otherwise, if you want to farm infantry, you better learn to aim.

    Or, we could remove C4 from the game, but we also remove HE and HEAT cannons ;)

    Apparently, it's called "the real world"

    And C4s are not automatically guided to the tank from who knows what distance btw, would you prefer dealing with Javelins instead of dealing with C4?

    Also, learn to play, if you get C4'd too often it's because your situational awareness is just crap. Do you want to know what's the counter to a LA with C4s? Pressing the "S" key for just one second.
    • Up x 6
  6. Pat22

    Here's a funny story.

    It began at a biolab with two angry NC players. They pulled a vanguard to attack the VS-owned satellite. Biolabs always having jump pads to and from their satellites, I took the jump pad and use my jump jets to land on the vanguard and blew it up.

    The NC players, being stubborn, pulled a second vanguard and came right back, only to befall the same fate. And not too long after, a third vanguard. As I was about to land on the vanguard to once again deploy C4, something magical happened: the tank started backing up and the gunner who now manned a Kobalt rather than a Halberd, started turning in my direction. It was then I noticed he had equipped a proxy radar. The vanguard moved out of range, I ran out of fuel, got shot dead.

    I never managed to get C4 on that vanguard again from that point on. ( Blew him up with an AP magrider two bases down the line though )

    Point being, as was said before, a tank that doesn't want to get C4'd won't get C4'd.
    • Up x 10
  7. lilleAllan

    Just equip a Kobalt if LA's are such an issue? It's 100 certs.
    • Up x 3
  8. Anchor IV

    PS2 is not the real world. War in real life is not balanced for fairness on both sides but games are.

    Also I think the arguments that say "better situational awareness" and "you are just bad" fail to grasp the point. I'm not saying LA+C4 works all the time, everytime. It doesn't. If you catch someone flying towards you with detonator in hand then it's easy enough to move away or kill them. The combination of highly mobile LAs plus the limited deployment of C4 plus the overall weakness of all vehicles is an issue.

    Also the situational awareness argument doesn't wash with me. Nobody has full 360 degree awareness at all times, especially not in vehicles where you are limited to slowly rotating turrets or prefixed driving positions. Not to mention third person is a joke.

    Furthermore, I may have given the impression that I am suffering wildly at the hands of lights with C4. I'm not, but I have used it, had it used against and seen it used enough times to know that there is an obvious problem.
    LAs not having C4, C4 being nerfed or vehicles being buffed would fix the issue.
  9. MikeyD

    When I get c4ed in a tank/lightning it kinda feels like getting jumped by a rocket primary Heavy. Both OHK, unless certed appropiately, both take advantage of a lack of movement or awareness. They both kinda piss me off, not because they are unfair or broken or whatever, its just they dont happen very often and the shock mixed with a small amount of guilt is enough to irk me.

    You say that LA are like locust's hounding anyone in a tank, well what does that make the herd's of MBT's spamming any structure that might hold a infantry inside.

    My point is in PS2 there are lots of things that feel unfair. This many people with this many different ways of killing you, how could it not.
  10. Copasetic

    Nobody should expect to be completely safe from C4 at all times either, that doesn't hold true for anything in this game. Doesn't matter how well I pay attention I'm still going to be instagibbed by a tank shell now and then, or get my tank blown up by a Tankbuster Lib out of nowhere, or lose a MAX to C4 without warning. It's normal.

    The best defense against C4 costs no certs and takes no real effort: just keep moving. C4 is absolutely useless against moving targets. Even if I manage to land a brick on a moving tank it'll just bug out and explode on the ground where the tank was. In fact, the only tanks I can C4 reliably are the ones sitting around a base shelling infantry for minutes on end, and sorry but I've got no sympathy for them.
    • Up x 1
  11. Posse

    You asked in what world a infantryman can kill a vehicle, I answered.

    As it is right now, tanks still are much easier to use and get more kills than any infantry, so if anything, this game is not unfair for tanks, lol.

    Then move, if you stand still shelling mindlessly, then you deserve to get c4'd, it's so easy to avoid C4s... one time 3 guys tried to C4 me at once from different sides when I was in an AP lightning, I had them dancing for a minute trying to C4 me before wiping all of them out, that's how easy it is.
    • Up x 2
  12. Thrustin

    And I spend resources to get the advantage of blowing up a tank. What exactly is the difference?

    As long as it requires only one guy to man a vehicle, it should not require any more to remove it from the battlefield.
    • Up x 5
  13. Shootybob

    As a professional drifter, I have to point out that it is not "easy" to kill something that has experience or an "instakill" because it requires a high degree of positioning.

    There is a fair bit of tracking, everything kills you PDQ if ANYONE spots you. C4 bugs are absurdly abundant. Vanguard gives anyone who spends any time in third person an instant out.

    Going after skilled tanks requires a much higher tactical level and more risks to be taken to get the kill.

    All in all, even doing well, you can only realistically expect to take a tank, maybe, 50% of the time tops. 25% of the time you die before you get into position, and 25% of the time you just waste the C4 to bug or simply missing. Newer tank drivers are much easier to take consistently, but those aren't the ones you want.

    Light assault C4 simply isn't THAT efficient, but it's heck of fun to play.

    Play better, learn to spend time in third person, pay attention.
    • Up x 1
  14. Teshrrar

    The problem is that die as infantry haven't any cost, what show why we have so many kamikazes.

    If at least when you die you waste the consumables you are carrying, instead of lose it just on use, I would stay fine about the C-4 kamikazes.
    • Up x 1
  15. Thrustin

    Yeah, but the argument can be made that C4 can only kill a maximum of one vehicle, whereas a vehicle can kill without limit. So we trade off the fact that we don't have any cost for failing (which is not entirely true, as if we miss a C4 drop, there is no way we can pick it up), for the ability to only kill at most one vehicle.
  16. Lethal_Sting

    Kamikazes? You mean free kills. It takes at least two seconds for the c4 to arm before it can be detonated. By that time you have to decide to try and throw the second or just det the first. Usually end up just blowing yourself up in the process.

    Or even better a friendly heavy comes along and fires his/her free rockets, blowing up said c4 and you at the same time.
    • Up x 1
  17. nubery

    Good tankers don't get C4'd. Your entire point is that it's unfair for inattentive and bad players to be killed by something they can EASILY avoid and CERT to counter.

    On top of that C4 is a one trick pony, you miss you have to go resuppy and spend more nanites. Vehicles do not.
    • Up x 6
  18. Corezer

    I got the solution!

    First make tanks free so this kid can stop whining, then make players pay 100 nanites per shell... members get 75% off.
    • Up x 1
  19. Corezer

    Drives sales lol
    • Up x 1
  20. MongooseTwoFive

    This thread again.

    I personally have very little issue getting C4'd in tanks. It's pretty rare that they get me, and when they do it's usually at a tech plant or some place with plenty of buildings for them to jump off of without warning.

    I find it much more agitating in indoor fights like biolabs where you see LAs just floating around the rooftops dropping bricks. It's extremely high reward for very little risk.

    The other problem I have with it is the kamikaze gamestyle it encourages. He risks a 5 second wait to respawn if I spot him first, but it costs me a max, vehicle, or offensive push if he succeeds. So you'll see plenty of suicidal light assaults who very often die by their own C4.

    C4 itself I think is ok where it is. If somebody can sneak up to me in my tank and slap a brick on the hull, they deserve the kill. Same goes for if somebody plants one around a corner and I step right into it on my max, good for them. It's when you give it to somebody who can fly around and just drop deathsticks with unlimited attempts and hardly any risk (especially with how cheap C4 is now) that I call shenanigans on that type of gameplay.

    Some solutions? I think taking it away from the LA completely would be a mistake, although not entirely out of place given SOE's tendency to overnerf things that only need some tweaking. My ideas would be any of the following:
    • Require C4 to be planted, not tossed/dropped. This would stop the C4 fairies, and require more skill and risk to be involved with C4.
    • Add a bit of an arming time to it. This way if you manage to drop it on their tank, they're already gonna take that damage either way, but you cannot just sprint into a room and toss the brick for a smooth 7 kills with a click unless they fail to react.
    • Some sort of penalty if you suicide via your own C4. Honestly it's one of the most annoying things I see in planetside, but it works well because death has no consequence in the game for infantry. Maybe lock your C4 for a certain amount of time afterwards? *shrug*
    But that's just my two certs.
    • Up x 1
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