I have been banned

The second you started talking about me sharing glitches with my leaguemates "not accusing" stopped working.
You can't be a vegetarian and stuff your mouth with beef burgers at the same time, you know.

Exactly. Usually.

Do not guarantee things you can't. You know that "half a league" banning story. Guess what? I have not kept in touch lately, but as far as i know he still works as a GM.

This is what you call collateral damage in business.
Are automated systems perfect? Are GM's perfect?
It's nice to see someone has so much trust into the system, but in reality mistakes happen.
But in general those mistakes are minority of the cases -> collateral damage. The "s**t happens" cases.

I'm a customer of pro7, not SOE. Although i have kept in touch with SOE guys, yes.
As it is pretty ironic, how my case is handled by pro7, but almost all of the more useful information so far has been provided to me by people from SOE side.

And of course when you come around and start providing false information

especially after clearly stating

you are d**n right i get defensive.

Instant permaban sounds really fishy. A friend of mine (that I mentioned before ) got another temporary ban for the same reason they told you. It is probably his lags...

It doesn't add up that they ban some people temporarely and some forever for the same (on the surface) reasons.

the videos you have posted, showed obvious glitches that you are abusing. So whats wrong with getting banned for that?

Do I understand something wrong?

To start with, which are the so called "obvious glitches" i'm using.
I'm only seeing one and it's one handed's lunge.
No confirm from devs, but it's only weapon acting like that. So it is pretty obvious its not working as intended.

And yes, i have used one handed's lunge. I do not even deny it.
I actively used it in solo instances to move between targets every now and then when i got bored of dw/staff.
And on ultimately rare occasions i did use it in couple of rare PvP matches.
(i think ~3-4 short PvP sessions over ~13 month period).
In PvP it would not be hard to point out huge number of people who use is more times in their average week than i have ever used in total.
So in general banning me for something like this would be like banning someone who is saying po*p in general chat and leaving alone the guy who at the same time spams the general chat next to him with every possible curse word known to humankind.

In general i did use lunge, but i used shield's lunge.
Its because shields lunge is just a little slower but it's animation is not glitched.
For what i used my weapon for, Shield is literally inferior to one-handed in every single aspect
(one handed's lunge is faster, you can do quicker blockbreaker support, have better ranged damage, it is easier to clear target as its lunge bugs out your autotarget, it does better damage close by)
And i have used shield...because shield is not bugged.

The problem one is -> i still don't know why i'm banned.
If they strait forward would say in e-mail that its permaban for "glitch abuse" it would s**k, but i would be ok with it.
Their latest version is that i have been banned for hacking. Using a glitch is not a hack.
And if it even was the lunge, it would be ridiculous if i was the only one.

Problem two is -> communication.
Players are not mind readers. It is not hard to send a warning like "using this is illegal" or make open thread about things "things you should not use / being fixed".
And when we are talking about communication...ducking every single question i have ever sent them ban or non ban related...now thats a nice way of treating a customer.

So if you really don't see what is wrong here you really have to open you eyes, mate.

NB! But it is not even important anymore. "Lunge" topic is already old.
They literally banned my new account i made to organize the smokebreaks PvP tournament.
One i created a character on, leveled him to 5...did a legends PvP match on and then who i used to sit on HOD.

So i'm not winning some GM's "best friend of the year award",
or my DCUO files have corrupted over time...so i'm instantly a hacker.
At least those are the two blind guesses in the current state
...but chances to officially test it out, seeing how pro7 GM's have treated me so far,
are smaller than my chances to hook up with Kristen Bell.

@ Aiden Warren, I did notice on another thread you commented about people being banned need to just admit that they did wrong and deal with it. It seems on this thread you are more open to the possibility that there is a such thing as innocence when it comes to being banned. I bring that up for the purpose of saying "That's good." The community needs to realize that all bans and suspensions aren't black and white. So if people have tunnel vision with "You're guilty so deal with it." Its good to see people take a step back and look at the big picture.

@ Talve, I hope the best for you, I am the bf of Gemi (Queenofwar) that Aiden Warren was referring to, I'm back now clearly and I feel your pain as far as not having a reason and knowing that you did nothing wrong. I didn't receive any contact from SOE concerning my ban at all, not in anyway, shape, or form. I called customer support and had the worst customer service experience ever. I hope a higher up listens to that call and that it was recorded. It wasn't until Gemi came here on forums and posted that I finally got feedback. The response was swift, I sent in my data files from my PC that they requested and the issue was resolved. Not as fast I would have liked, but the end result at least ended in my favor. In my case, it was proven that I was not at fault. I hope this is the same case for you and that you're back in game soon.

Respectfully,
Davon

This is about Gems friend got banned for hacks. the other thread he didn't say why he got banned and didn't know why, they didn't tell him, so that was in general speak of breaking any of the rules.

Sorry for the misunderstanding Davon
. But As I said before, I don't know why the devs are to think their detection is perfect and is bug and errors free. All they have to do is play the game themselves, and listen to their customers.

but you used this glitches, that is fact. Permaban without warning is a little bit hard and not fair though.

if there is really a GM who doesn't like you (who knows why, there are a lot of other player with your skilllevel), then it would be cool if everyone who supports you could write a ticket to clarify the situation. And if they give only a short answer without any reason, we write again, and again and again. if there are many people doing this, they have to react.

Its important, because if there is really a GM who is against some player for personal reasons, he has to draw the consequences

Dude whatever.... you r beeing a njerk.

I never said YOU shared glitches with you league ( though you are gonna have a hard time convincing me you never did), i just said that if that happened that could have been a reason for banning you, get your facts straight.

No i dont know that "half a league ban story", never saw it nor did i get any clear evidence on it happening, all i got was some post from a dude i dont know that got permabanned , hardly credible. For all i know you could have pulled it from deep inside your behind.

And yes mistakes happen and get cleared , shiit however takes more work to clear, guess you made the later...

And i still have more trust in the system and gms then in a player i dont know and that admitted to cheating in the past. For all i know you can be the king of glitch and ultimate haxorr!

I do apologise about saying you got warrnings, but i was pretty sure i read that somewhere in one of your posts, must have misread or misunderstood something.

As far as soe/ pro7 goes, doesnt matter, my point was that if you feel a gm did something unjust you should try taking it to his superiors be it at pro7 or soe, but you just have to be a njerk and play all smart.

And you beeing a nice guy and helping out or idk what doesnt make you legit and your attitude sure as hell doesnt make me believe your story, cause no... i am not d**n right you get defensive... guilty people usually do that! Bye

It is only strange, that there are many permabans in the last time on EUPC because of cheating. Also from absolutely newbies, that don't understand anything. So there is obviously something wrong with the ban-system or anticheat-system. although it is not ok for me, if a player look for glitches and there is no excuse for. Not for testing, for solo playing or whatever. If you find a bug, write a ticket and never ever use this bug again!

Again you use it in plural.
Only "glitch i used" was 1h's lunge.
And again if it ever would have been the lunge, i would not be the only guy here, as it is massively used by most of the high tier PvP community on EUPC side.

And again, from the latest information my ban had nothing to do with any kind a glitch, its full on hack (8. and 9. from code of conduct).
This is how far i got with the situation...after literally spamming them for 3 weeks...at least its work in progress and i got somewhere.
Now trying to find out if there is any files/logs i could provide them to see if it was any corrupted files doing it.

I did write a ticked...about half a year ago...a long essay why its bad, how you can use it, how it works and i even included Video examples for everything. All they said was "we take a look at it"...like always...
And its still the same...and in that half a year instead of 1 person using it hundreds are.

It has become one of the things everyone uses, and something i have tried to stay away from.
But yes, i still have used it in minor cases. I don't even deny it.
Its like...clipping used to be before SOE finally said "hey, its ok to clip".
This is what happens when something is found and devs do nothing to give out any kind a fix/info on the subject. Over time people start using them.
(Or well..there is another case where people find something, use it from the get-go and keep it a secret...like usage of instant double blockbreakers to boost raid damage currently is).

I mean a lot of so called "non intended" things have became even part of the balance and e-sports in games before.
For example Vulture's shooting while moving micro via patrol usage. Not intended, completely legal.


So there is a fine line between clever usage of game mechanics and actual breaking the rules. And that's why information from Devs is important.
But again, like i already said. It has nothing to do with my ban. From now on i'm officially banned strait forward for hacking.

And from the get-go you have been a *i*k. So i guess we are even.
I got nothing against any kind a comments, as long as they don't provide strait forward false information.

I have never asked you to trust me more than the company, never.
All i said was "mistakes happen".

And no, i did not get defensive because i'm guilty..or because i am not guilty.
It has nothing to do with that (and this is another case where you strait forward accuse me).
I got defensive, because some guy i don't know jumps in and starts throwing out strait forward false information.

( NB! Sorry, i don't have any information to provide to you on the ban. It was ~11 years ago in game called Tibia. So sorry i could not provide any more information )

Its not the same like clipping. clipping is much easier to perform, e.g. the 1h-lunge-glitch isn't that easy to perform. There is a natural feeling for it, that it couldn't be intended. And yes, maybe a lot of player are using glitches in secret, but sooner or later they will be uncovered and banned and then they are coming here into this forum for whining why they are banned.

currently there are a lots of bans on eupc

don't use bugs, end of story

Because holding down up arrow hurts fingers? xD

You would be surprised how long some of the things have been abused for and for how long people have been getting away with them.

A huge part is probably fault of players like me. What i mean is i (and i know multiple people who have done the same) have actively stopped reporting bugs / bug abuses for quite a while now.
It's because we never got any actual feedback (other than same copy pasted response), neither has most of the stuff actually been fixed (you would think half a year is long enough duration to fix something).

The problem with "not using bugs" is that devs almost never say what is intended and what is not.
If literally everyone lunge around for half a year and nothing happens, of course more and more people start doing it.
And myself i actually don't blame people who do it. Even though i try to find other ways to do the same "legally" (the shield), i do not run around with a torch and a pitchfork. :>

But in all seriousness, one handed's lunge is still a glitch and needs to be fixed.

Meh not much else to see here, it is becoming pretty obvious, we have an abuser and a company that is bad at telling what abuse was done. Simple matter, case closed.

And just because others are using a glitch doesnt make it ok, maybe you were just the first in line.

funny how this "accident" bans always happen to someone from those top leagues that know all the glitches but never use them... from all my casual leagues where people dont even bother to recreate bugs and dont know about them no one has ever been banned like that yet this is not the first post of such kind i have come accross.

what I mean is, that it isn't that easy to find out like clipping. I didn't even know how to perform it, before you told me how it works...

And again: thats no excuse. Even if 99% of the players use it, it is obviously a bug, so don't support these players and don't use these glitches. So many people abuse the moon-stone-bug, but thats also no excuse for me to do it the same way!

Btw.: I don't think the devs log where you used this bug, so it doesn't matter if you were using it in arenas or raids or only solo-instances or jff. I think if you use it a good few times the anticheatsystem detects you.

You, sir, fail with your logic.
I have already multiple times stated, that i have not been banned for any glitch what so ever.
In current state i have been banned for rule 8/9 on the conduct, so "strait forward hacking".

I love how you blindly shoot out words like they are "facts".

Like BadHansel already said
If

And lately there have been a lot of threads about them as well.

You would be surprised how small is the % of people who actually strait forward abuse glitches on daily bases as their general gameplay and actually get banned.

And again, when ever there is so called "accidental ban", they seem to be about "hacking".
Personally i do not know a single person in 13 years of playing MMOs who has been banned for "glitch abuse."

So what you are pretty much saying is that if a glitch is easy to find, its ok to use it?

I have never stated it is ok to use glitches, neither have i never given any support to people who do use glitches.
I am ok, when people do use some of the stuff like 1h lunge as on that case it pretty much makes weapon perform almost the same way as some of their counterparts (shields lunge cancel's its own animation without having to hold down anything).
And that is pretty much only thing i'm currently ok with.
Current lunging situation here is pretty much like Vulture usage in SC1 was.
And again, i do not support usage of glitches. But like i said - i do not hunt them down with my pitchfork either.

Moon's rock and moon's door and moon's double speed glitches are a whole another beast, as they strait forward break the gameplay.

There is no "automated system to detect lunging".
If there was
1. There would have been massive ban waves.
2. Pro7 would probably do nothing, as banning hundreds of people does not really work well for their wallet.

Why i ever though it may be the lunge that got me banned was very limited information pro7 provided me together with information a lot of people digged out for me about people "who reported me".

clipping is not a glitch, it is so supereasy to find out, that it is obious that it couldn't be a bug but is intended. And yes if it is more difficult to find out, then take care, the chance is big, that it is a bug!

glitch is glitch. Doesn't matter if it is more or less helpful.

And looking for those things, no matter why, is not ok.

Wow... no you obviously lack logic sir, or are you just trolling me.

If you care to look my previous post again i also said it is a case of a company that is bad at telling people why they banned you.

And since this whole post is about you asking WHY you got banned, how can you now state that you have not been banned for glithcing.

Anyway this whole post lacks logic. You first say you never glicth, then you only glitch when you figure them out but dont use them, now you only use one glitch, then u say you always report bugs but now you havent been reporting. Get your story straight fam... and specially for the future your game as well.

Wherefrom do you have these information?

1. Why? I don't know many people who are using this bug, and using it by fault is another thing then using it more often ;-)
And how do you know that there aren't more people banned because of this? Not everyone come to the forum to tell it everyone.

I never said clipping is a glitch. Devs already have stated it is not. I said i don't think it was intended to glitch out and cut every single animation in game. But because it is something that quickly became general part of the game, of course it becomes legal.

And no, i cant prove you wrong. And no, you cant prove me wrong, unless you somehow gain access to developers notes from the get-go, which show the intention of clipping.

And you completely missed the point.
Your only argument why lunge is a glitch and clip was not was "one is easier to find out than other".
So in general, what you said was "If glitch would be easy to find out, it would not be a glitch".

So what you are saying is that you rather have a buggy game than have people, who find out bugs and report them (as i don't know a single game which has been completely bug free from the release by "magic of developers").

And you also stated i'm a glitch abuser and how glitch abusers get banned...
even after i clearly stated that by current state have been banned for hacking, not glitch abuse.

OM*G...because it has been like 3 **ing weeks and a lot has changed in that 3 **ing weeks.
I have been in constant talk with SOE @ pro7 gm's and community managers from both sides.
Also, there is a whole another thread about the case already
http://forums.station.sony.com/dcuo/index.php?threads/prosiebens-support.7429/
neither has even that one been updated, because latest information is still not completely clear.


Maybe i can say that i have not been banned for glitching, because GM told me
According to our logs you have violated article 8. and 9. of the code of conduct, which results in severe sanctions, like a permanent ban:
God sake...

Please, quote me, where i strait forward say "i have never used glitches".
Not supporting usage of glitches and not using glitches are two very different animals.

I have used glitches in my gaming history in certain situations.
I have never used any glitches in competitive matches.
I have always tested things and found out glitches on the side.
I have also always tried to reproduce glitches i hear someone else using to find out how to do it, so it could be fixed.
I have longest period of time actively reported glitches via tickets.
I lately do not do it anymore because nothing ever got fixed. Neither do i abuse the thing i have found out recently.

That has been the story from the get go.

The only glitch i have even in some ways used myself is "one handed's lunge".
Aka if it is safehouse and someone throws the generator and lunges after it,
no i'm not going to lose.
Yes, i'm going to lunge myself to stop him.
No, it does not make it right.
But yes, there have been situations where i use it.
Yes, 99% of times i use shield instead.
But yes, there have been situations in PvP i have used the lunge.
Also, yes there have been situations i have used it in solo instances.
Yes, it does not make it right.

And finally no, i have not been banned for this.

And in most cases comes in the question
What actually is a glitch and what is clever usage of game mechanics.
Before devs have given any information on the subject, nothing is officially a glitch.
So when saying it all, i assume that 1h lunge is a glitch.
Because currently, arguably it is.
No, there have been no official information on the subject.
Yes, Mepps has all the information about it as well as videos.
Yes, supposedly devs are looking into it (like they have for half a year now).
No, Mepps has not given any feedback on the subject yet.

I could literally make a list of 100+ people from EUPC who have ever or are currently in any case or any amount used the lunge on One handed to test or are actively using it.

Also smokebreak keeps in touch with almost every bigger league from EUPC, from hero and from villain side.
We literally have tons of TS servers from leagues from hero & villain side.
It is because of the even council in work right now as well as the events we have done in past.

And my information relies on the fact that not a single person from that community has been banned.
Also, like mentioned "i'm officially banned for hacking". So neither did i get banned for this.

No I did not missed the point. the point is: if someone don't look for tricky things, but play normal, never will be banned for cheating.
I am not afraid of being banned in the future. You know why? Because I am completely aware of what I am using and what not.
Like I said: there is a natural feeling in all of us, that shows us, what is wrong, what is ok.

You said you used glitches, you said you looked for them, so what exactly is your problem now? You go in circles. The more you post here, the more I think, you are not that innocent you want to look like. That doesn't mean, that I think you are an unfair player. I can't say that, because I played only one or two times against you with your leaguemates and I didn't see you playing unfair. But you used glitches and you were aware of it. That you know more players that are using this glitches doesn't makes you less guilty.

Any game will always be buggy. Its impossible to program something without bugs, especially something dynamic like a mmorpg!
Its good that player who find bugs by accident reporting it to the devs. And you never ever will be banned because of finding a bug or reproducing it once! but if you are using it more often IT IS NOT OK! If you share it with other players, IT IS NOT OK!
Thats the bitter truth. Deal with it. Learn from this experience!