new expac needs to be geared toward ONLY level 80 group players

Joppa@Everfrost wrote:

Yup, PoP was the great cleansing of EQ. Raiders loved it and it served to get rid of those pesky casual and group only oriented players. Despite Kunark, which was an anomaly, I expect EQ2 to eventually go the same way. It is just a matter of time.

Out of this expansion I'd like to see a new large shared dungeon+heroic instance for every teir from t2.5-t7 plus at least 3 new large shared t8 dungeons and at least 5-6 new heroic t8 instances plus a new raid progression. I'd like to see a few new outdoor zones for solo progression. Perhaps use the teir and a half model of BBM and SFM. Also I'd like to see at least 2 new AA trees and 3 new gods and perhaps a couple new secondary tradskilling professions.
I don't ask for much, really.

Qandor wrote:

who said anything about all raiding. i mean of course raiding would be a part of the expac no doubt about it. But im looking for more group instances like CoA, VoES and Maidens and maybe even some 2 group instances for more diversity.

Qandor wrote:

Cleansing? Your attitude towards your fellow gamer is despicable.

It's not in the best interest of the game to make something for one type of player only. Not at this point in time. You want a trip down memory lane Eq1 is still in service.

Understand that I AGREE with more group content and yes raids, but not to the exclusion of content for other types of players. Realize you are not alone and not the majority of the player base. And IF this game goes how you think it will, I and many others will leave. That's fact and you and your handful of raiders can have the game to yourself. This is basically what you want, which would also mean a loss of revenue for SOE. But with other games coming out perhaps it's eventual, however I don't think we should actually encourage it.. lol.

Cynzielle wrote:

I have to agree here, that post she was replying to did set me off a bit. Everquest 2 is not all raiders. Raider's aren't the gods of game, all they have over the casual people is the gear, just, the gear. If Everquest 2 goes only raiders, they'll loose more then half thier playerbase.

And staying back on topic, I'd loe to see this be an EOF-type of expansion, I actually enjoyed EOF. Kunark was a nightmare.

Well i am just curious, but does anyone try to see through each others eyes?
Having solod an alt recently and actually there are gaps in content, not so many but they are definitely out there.

Having a fed up capped one i can clearly say, that SOe definitely has to remove this "You have beaten the Game" message from my
lvl 80 toon.
What does a lvl 80 do?
Nothing. He just sits and watches his Zonetimers expire.

I am lvl80/lvl80/tinker400/AA140, i am Trakanon flagged and my sole fun is raid and actually RE2. This was my most loved toon and he just sits there. Almost nothing to do, just waiting for raids or RE2 groups.
While the lower toons may need some variance, the capped ones need something to not quit.
It does not in any form help, that about 40-50% of the capped ones just log for raids and the rest is twinking.

BTW: Just give the alts a possibility to enter the 70-79 channels. Please. Master do not always go to the broker, the good ones are auctioned there, and when i am twinking there is no way to lay hands on masters for my main. Thumbs down SOE.

The solution for me is quite simple.
A Zillion Instances and places to go for 70+.
Some timeconsuming way to get to items through some new factions.
A zillion Quests and possibilities for every player to get this faction.
Some gapfilling instances for the lower tiers (Like the godquest progressions just instances where you can do it once as lvl80 just to get to the higher dungeons but repeat it as lvl40 or whatsoever to get factionpoints for items.

Cynzielle wrote:

Umm, yes it was a cleansing and I was one of those cleansed. Your point is? PoP Turned EQ into a raid or die game. As I said I fully expect EQ2 to go the same route sooner or later. It is not a wish, it is a prediction since SOE knows no other way.
You see the hints of that with RE2. Raiders shed bitter tears about the handful of quality items in Kunark instances that non-raiders could obtain such as the Praetors Guard. SOE, always quick to respond to the crying of the raiding community, assured that virtually all loot in RE2 would be total crap. Now the raiders can use RE2 as a master farming area and they will not be offended by non-raiders getting anything worthwhile. Of course, we will see the usual retort that non-raiders do not need that type of gear to do group content while the raiders continue to use their raid gear to triviialize group zones such as RE2 to farm masters. Deja vu. An EQ2 PoP type expansion has to be on the horizon somewhere.

More group material for 50 to 80 is required for sure. Between those levels, soloing is better then grouping and this is supposed to be an MMO not a single player RPG.
If more solo stuff comes out im gonna have to cry. You dont want me to cry now do you?

Qandor wrote:

I was another of those that left after PoP. Had a falling out with my top end guild at the time and decided I just didn't need to aggravation of raiding every night just to get flagged for another zone to raid some more. Considering everyone in the guild at the time was pretty much already flagged, I was having problems getting enough together to run them.

The only thing good about PoP at that time was instant transport to any city in the game. I wish EQ2 had that.

Stavros@The Bazaar wrote:

50-80 leveling zones? are you kidding me? the entire DoF expansion is for 50-55+ then you can head to KoS and EoF and thats pretty much dedicated from 55 to 70 easy.
there is so much content for the lower levels unless you level lock you will miss some. thats not the problem i mean yeah if you roll 7 alts maybe but you will have that in every game.

I agree, 50-70 does not need filled in; those tiers currently have the most options for leveling in terms of grouping or soloing.

Based on the summer events, we can pretty much rule out the 20-80 content theory. If they were going that route, they wouldn't be offering all of the bonus xp weekends to get people higher to the level cap. We also know that this will be very story driven, so that rules out 50-80 (level 80 players would not be able to play the start of the storyline if it started at level 50). That leaves us 67ish-80 or 77ish-90, so the question is, do we want a level increase?

Mezzmyrelda@Unrest wrote:

People newer to the game that dont have a maxed out toon still has plenty of new content to see. Why do you need more new content if you have not seen the content that is already there. EoF and Kunark both added plenty of new content to lower levels. Kunark only 1-20 but is still new fresh content. EoF add content for every level. In fact it did not add a whole lot for the people that were already 70 for a year. There is plenty for people to do from 1-70 unless you are on your 3rd or 4th alt. However that would mean you probably have a max level toon (atleast 1) and would still be getting plenty of new content.
Either way this game would benefit most from 70 to 80 content if there is no cap increase.

Ravaan wrote:

Wasn't DoF a level raising expansion to level 60? Isn't it the least popular expansion for EQII?

Why do either of these points matter? Because it was an expansion where it focused on nothing else but the level range it was increasing to; IE 51-60. It also didn't come with much raid content that I've seen.

KoS was another level raising expansion focusing on 61-70 but faired better because it had more than just 2 primary hunting zones and had a lot more raid content. Not to mention purty class hats we all love.

EoF so far has been the most popular expansion in my mind because it had something for everyone. I don't know of many people who complained about EoF as much as RoK has been whinged about.


But see, here is the thing. What you're asking the majority of the player base to do is be happy with their outdated, easily out geared (via doing TD progression and the new MC stats) content so that the next expansion can once again focus on nothing but the highest end of the game only this time, you don't want it to focus on an entire tier, only the pinnacle of the tier, level 80. I can tell you now that an expansion like that will not only be unpopular, but it would be even MORE unpopular than DoF ever was.

The proof is in the history and I doubt SOE fails to see this. Why else would they add another 1-20 area along with the new 71-80 content if they didn't realize that single tier expansions just are not liked. They would be making the biggest mistake they could ever make if they took your suggestion and implimented it. A whole expansion dedicated to the smallest denominator (and no matter what you believe, this is a fact, level 80s are the smallest population in the game) isn't how they are going to make money. No amount of arguing the point is going to change that.

shaunfletcher wrote:

LOL i thought similar to you i really did

Diknak@Butcherblock wrote:

For as long as i've played theres always been some sort of bonus xp weekends (granted this time more than usual) even for EoF there was one on the run up to that expansion IIRC.

Now as for the level increase personally i think the game needs it like i need a hole in my head

Miladian wrote:

I'm also one of those 'pesky' types that PoP served to drive away. I came late to EQ1, and never even made it to a decent level before everyone I knew was gearing up for jaunts to the Planes. That left me unable to join them, bored, and SOL. I have Station Access, so I can still pop in (and have, in fact, kept up-to-date on the game...the Serpent's Spine expansion was a token attempt to (slightly) fix the overwhelming raid-fetish-orientation of the game, although it is obviously too little, too late).

I think what was missing from Qandor's post (and what prompted Cynzielle's outrage) was the fact that he (and everyone else, for that matter) is unable to inject the sarcasm and irony into the written word, and I honestly believe he intended it to be that way (and rightly so). Had he concluded the statement with '/sarcasm off', I doubt he would have gotten the negative first response he did. I didn't see a despicable attitude - I saw one that had more than a hint of resignation towards the inevitable fate of the game.

And I have to say I agree. Call me a 'glass-half-empty' type, a curmudgeon, a cynic, whatever. I'm hoping for the best - but I'm obviously expecting the worst. While my level won't be as meager as it was in pre-cataclysm Norrath, I dislike raiding as a pinnacle concept. I am genuinely hoping that SOE does not make a PoP-style screw-up. Having that done twice would be...discouraging.

Put simply, if you do not have a max level toon, reguardless of how long you have played the game, you still have a decient amount of content to see, and thus should not be expecting content to be made and delivered to you, when you still have not experianced all that is in game.
While some people with maxed out characters do like to level alts, and do so frequently, any content added at max level is content they have immediate access to, and thus should be happy to see new content at max level.
People that like to roll alts and get sick of them and reroll again should be ahppy to see any content at all added to the game. While they may not use it now, when the level cap is 100, the current tier will be as easy to level up to experiance as DoF is now (ie, you could get there in about 20 hours /played).
On the other hand, adding in any new low tier zones to the game will simply further split the already thin population at lower levels, and will see a lot less overal use than a max level zone.
The above is true reguardless of whether they add in an expansion with content for all level ranges, or if they simply add on an instance at a level other than max.
Thats not to say lower level content should never be looked at, or should be considered finished, but SoE need to be careful about how they do any non mac teir content. The first thing they need to do, and have done fairly well reciently, is to remember that reguardless of what anyone may think, < max tier content is simply for leveling up. This is its purpose, its reason for existing. once this basic function is taken care of, then, and only then, should things like stories and item rewards be added in.
To the OP.
What I would like to see in the next expansion is a 10\50\40 split between solo/group/raid, assuming no level cap increase.
The 10% solo I would like to see done along the lines of 2 solo instances, one short one with a 3 - 4 hour lockout, with a max of 1/10 chance of a legendary drop that is not as good as legendary from heroic zones, and a zero% chance at masters. The other I would like to see as a 3 - 6 day lockout, be about as long an instance as RE2, offer an ok chance at some respectible legendary rewards, and about a 1/25 chance of a master from the end mob only, whom should be as hard to kill solo as the shaman in RE is to kill with a full group.
The heroic sould include the majority of the overland mobs in the expansion, but these mobs should be placed in a manner as to not prevent travel. These zones sould then have several quest series that can be used to gain XP from 70 - 80 in a group, much like the RoK quests did for soloing through those levels. After that there should be 3 - 4 tank/spank instances in a manner similar to Vults/CoA, and another 5 - 6 instances with heavy scripts.
Raiding I think should be done in about 6 seperate instances, the shortest of which shuuld be the size Freethinkers Hidout was. Raid flagging, although a good idea in theory, should be kept out unless you can make the mobs needed to gain keys easier than the mobs that they open up. This should have been a lession learnt in EoF with the whole Woushi dropping an item needed to kill Mayong issue that happened, and if not then, it should be a lession learnt after RoK (the lession, for those that are unaware, is that it is near impossible to pre judge which mob will be harder for the public to kill when they were desinged by 2 different devs, and not propperly play tested before going live, and requiring you to kill a harder mob in order to kill a mob that is much easier to kill and to get to).
basically, while there is a lot of solo/group/raid content in RoK, they are all missing something that should be addressed.

screw solo content, we have enough of it allready, I'd say add in 5 - 6 heroic instances and plenty of raids, atleast 3 vp sized zones and plenty contested and make the micro raid zones x2.

Noaani wrote:

You can bang that broken drum forever, and it won't improve its sound. The purpose of all content is to be played for enjoyment. Naturally content prior to cap also prepares you for the content it leads to, and the chain ends with the highest level content in the game, but the purpose of each part is to be played.
Some of the time, some of the players see the content as a job they must work through in order to create a character for a later part of the game. That does not make that its only function, and in fact the idea that it is would justify more lower level zones (to reduce the boredom of levelling through it) not demand less of them. Only people interested in playing in those zones would care about your other, contradictory, statement that 'adding in any new low tier zones to the game will simply further split the already thin population at lower levels'. What does that matter if its just a levelling tool?
You could as well say the purpose of all content, including groups and raids, is to prepare you for the last raid, just because some raid guild members use it that way when they make an alt for their guild. Do you not see the silliness in that?
Its an old saw to say they cannot please everyone, but thats exactly what they have to do.. content for all, not just for some please.

All I know is I don't want to be shoehorned into a Pug just to go from point A to point B Grouping and Raiding should be a CHOICE not a requirement.

I'm not against grouping or raiding if I see the need, I can interact with people without expanding my mass-murder status ;p .

I like to explore at times or harvest as I am a master Jeweler as well as an accomplished Monk. Besides for a Monk grouping is expensive (It feels wrong to FD when you are a MT)