It's not funny that you didn't get the point at all. The point was the change was % based. About 50% or more the time because of HP inflation. If your time was 10, its now about 15-20. And for record, I wasn't talking about 1 HA, I was talking about 2.1, I was talking about Hailing the first HA before Lessons, and finishing the other 2. Which if you aren't in a very good group now, 40 minutes is probably about close to correct for a normal to even good group. Point is, again they could take the old values, and new values, and split the difference.
Just did Scouting Ahead HA... **Edit** Wrong HA Level 105 Wiz/Bard/War/J5 Healer/2x J5 wiz. Nearly max AA CotF T1 raid gear. Completion time 18 min Exp 20 AA (no lessons)
Just did Into The Hills HA... Level 105 Wiz/Bard/War/J5 Healer/2x J5 wiz. Nearly max AA CotF T1 raid gear. Completion time 14 min Exp 20 AA (no lessons)
Just for comparison to the simple TBM HA -- In Defense of Health Switched to 2 healer mercs for needed healing power. Level 105 Wiz/Bard/War/2x J5 Healer/1x J5 wiz. Nearly max AA CotF T1 raid gear. Completion time 17 min Exp 11 AA (no lessons)
18 minutes seems pretty slow for raid geared War/Wiz combo with 2 more Wiz mercs according to Ammeren's and others standard of 10 minutes or less for raid gear. That's my point with Ammeren. It's highly subjective and anecdotal but everyone is acting like they found the Gold Standard. I have argued that the Gold Standard is not some purported max skill ceiling but the skill of the average player (average time for all players but which we have no data to glean from). If you want a Gold Standard run an experiment with controls (15 or more different individuals with perfectly same gear, AA - Vet AAs, group make up, pots, clickies, FTP or Silver run with Apprentice mercs) or find a large data sample on times. Don't know why some are insistent on the "git gud" argument with some hubris (just can't see how it takes more than x time) when we have the other half of the posters here saying otherwise? The half that argues "git gud" does so with personal experience and hearsay and - unlike the longer newb/casual time - sets some Gold Standard and can't fathom the other side (because it's so subjective)...
It has been nearly a year or more sense we have done those HAs so we were probably not going as fast as possible im sure. We were just steadily killing.. Pulling 1-3 at a time AE mezing. CoTF T1 raid gear though is quite a bit of a lesser to current TDS raid level gear. My point is that these are really not all that much slower i reckon. and as far as i can tell still better exp than TBM HAs?
The missing variable to longer times could be that casuals or newbs are restricted to Apprentice 2 mercs (FTP) and Apprentice 5 mercs (Silver). If anyone wants to molo HAs with non-prestige T1 CoTF/TDS Group Gear with an average class combo backed up by Tier 2 Apprentice mercs. (no Vet AAs or clickies). I'd like to see the results because it would more accurately reflect the casual, returning, or newbie player. *No boxing programs would make it even truer as casuals don't know how to use custom UIs and key mashing much less [Unmentioned 3rd Party Software].
Not questioning the validity of your observations as much as your claim of a threshold. You bring up great data points. If you are meaning to compare CoTF between TDS HAs then I guess it's a great point to investigate if HAs were scaled game wide. We need to see people simulate a molo situation with true non-prestige group gear and Apprentice mercs as described above if we want to see why there are some claims of above 30-60 minutes.
I've done several gribbles lately (still easiest way to max AA for me, my regular group time is in TBM progression) and they do take slightly longer. On continued reflection the change is nearly useless. Usually I get pretty g-i-m-p groups and thats fine (carefully pulling singles takes time), but last night I had a well balanced group of I think group geared players and we just ripped through them. Couldn't quite get all three done in a lesson, but was real close and we could have done better. Then I duo'd one HA with a raid geared insane wizard and a cleric and wiz merc and he just lit it up (no tank) non-stop. So the changes do nothing to hold back the higher end players, I'm sure its somewhat slower but whatever. All the changes does is punish the weaker groups and those who solo/molo them slowly. I suppose it annoys the midrange groups who could barely make the triplet in a lesson before (I rarely make it). The solution is clearly to adjust the AA reward, not the difficulty. There is a too big a range of player power between the bottom and top end of level 105. That said I am a day or two from max AA again, I think that is too fast. They need something like Heroic AA that goes closer to merc AA speed and use that in new expansions and force people to earn them in the new content. Thats my opinion anyway.
on the other side of the coin, I've been running some alts who started at level 80 though the HA's to get them some levels and I have been finding the HA's very easy.. to me they seem to be much easier then they were before the patch, Even my J1 merc warrior was able to tank everything, including a couple of names with just a J1 cleric healing. Once I hit 85 and got the J5 mercs it is even easier! Have them now at 87 and have not slowed down, burning through them pretty fast with the mercs tanking and healing. not super fast, about 25-30 minutes per .. but I am not trying to rush them either.
Y'all are ignoring the fact that this was a sleazy nerf cause content is so limited. Don't know why peeps are making this a big deal. Almost all are max AA and loot sucks.
Numiko, CotF HAs were only changed with scaling corrected for 101+. There is literal no change for 100 & under. Benito, what you're doing is called "moving the goalposts". If you keep placing arbitrary conditions and handicaps you'll soon enough be down to a solo naked rogue with Potion of Celestial Healing VI. At which point you can certainly declare a version of victory, I suppose. That character is going to have a hell of a time beating HAs in reasonable time. The point of this retuning is that for 101-105s getting great (best?) exp in a group mission, there's no call for the difficulty to suit every possible degree of gimping. The challenge should be suitable not for the bottom of the barrel, lowest common denominator, but for a healthy median. If non-subscriber non-groups ("molo") have trouble, that's, well, as it should be. There's a huge array of alternate play venues that will accommodate their variety of situations. There's even "this venue, but lower expectations".
Just curious, do you have access to some secret patch notes or something, it certainly did not say that in the published patch notes. *
It could be inferred that with the increase in player power (at level 105) expected from the new expac, then the level 105 HAs got the bump.
1) Mind explaining how I am "changing the goalpost" when FTP and Silver players are restricted to Non-Prestige gear and Apprentice Mercs? (Furthermore, if I were changing the goalpost I would first have to contend that T2 or higher gear was valid then disproven which was not contended or occurred). 2) How is a FTP and Silver player restrictions somehow the "lowest common denominator" when it is simply the status quo (hard limit) for a lot of newbie, returning, or casual players? All I am arguing for is running HAs molo under truly casual FTP/Silver conditions (so T1 CoTF/TDS non-prestige group gear and Apprentice Mercs, limited mashing/no box software) then gleaning results from that hard limit perspective...
"All I am arguing for is running HAs molo under truly casual FTP/Silver conditions" Where did molo come into it? Seems all the discussions so far have been for full groups (whether with mercs or not). A couple mentions of two players with mercs. None of the highly skilled/well geared players have been talking about moloing when discussing how fast they complete an HA. Obviously, a single char with merc will take quite a bit longer, if for no other reason that you're now missing some important roles (have tank/healer, missing DPS, so it takes longer, etc). Tat
