canceling 4 accounts if one of the 2 new tlp dosent remove truebox

This is an assertion based on facts not in evidence.

Assumption the first: Nobody has a problem with small groups using a few machines.

The fact: If you box even a measly 4 toons, expect to be trained and killed with far greater regularity by people who do in fact hate boxers.

Assumption the second: Truebox is stopping massive armies controlled with 3rd party programs.

The fact: It isn't. AoC's and pickzones keep you from noticing these people, but they are still there.

Assumption the third: Only people who want a massive army controlled with 3rd party programs want Truebox off.

The fact: I always play be the rules, but running more than one machine when my current machine can run EQ 150x over is just stupid. So I follow the rules and just don't play on the server at all, instead of 3-4 boxing it like I probably would have. So while I could have easily just broken the rules and done whatever I wanted to, I didn't. I want Truebox off so I can play on the new TLP the way I want to play the game.

Assumption the fourth: Truebox servers stay healthy longer.

The fact: All servers stay "healthy" until right after PoP, brief spike in OoW for the new epics, then death. Truebox servers will/are hitting a death never-before-known due to the added hurdle of the anti-boxing code. Once healer mercs come out and most of the few healers that've stuck it out get abandoned by the tanks, you'll be begging to get put down, but DBG will leave you whimpering in the barn like so many other abandoned TLP's.

Assumption the fifth: DBG made this decision because of some kind of competent decision-making-process. They did not. A dart was thrown at a TLP wheel.

I will eat that train. Not a threat for me. I will be happy you pulled for me

Man those are some blatant lies.

Here is your SS of the server first kill on LJ. The fastest groups to 50 always have 3+ mages

Yes, there is literally only one level 38 mage in that screenshot. Most importantly, that is not a screenshot of a one or two man mage army. Rather that is a screenshot of a multi-guild effort to down an open world boss in record-setting time, utilizing the highest level players on the server at the time. There are a few boxes there, but most of those people are mains. Nothing about True Box stops that screenshot from happening again.

Nothing about mass boxers prevented anyone from being present at that kill. The narrative that was so carefully constructed about lockjaw and ragefire is fictional. Most of the people at the time that tried to tell the truth about what was going on were shouted down by folks who were too busy posting on the forums instead of showing up for batphones.

It's just wild how much that screenshot shows. Faceless, MM, and MiM. A huge level spread on the participants. And assembling for the screenshot before worrying about loot. Naked toons and bronze twinkage.

Those dragons spawned almost every day, subsequent kills featured fewer and fewer boxes as mains leveled up. It wasn't until MotM made it so a handful of guilds could no longer kill them that they were ever petwalled again. Every guild in the rotation killed every boss without petwalling until MotM. After MotM there were only two guilds on Lockjaw that still bothered to tank as far as I can remember.

So absolutely convinced that huge mage armies were what allowed us to do what we did, so much damage was done to those servers by that attitude. And ongoing everytime a new server is discussed, just the lies about it. 2000 players on a server with no AoC, you were never going to get to the content competing with us. It wasn't unfair, we were just willing to do what you were not. All you needed was AoC. You don't need True Box.

True Box has put the power to monopolize spawns into the hands of those that can afford multiple PC's. You've just lowered the cost of the behavior you despise. Trueboxers will be sitting on the camps farming krono, but there won't be five picks open, there'll just be one, and they've cleared that camp too.

Instead of your guild being able to spawn six picks to force a bunch of clerics through their epic camps in sol a, you'll be lucky to get enough toons in zone to spawn even one pick, and there's no chance you'll /pick over and get the camp before the trueboxer sitting on the spawn for five months does.

It solves no problem, but gives you some psychological feeling of victory or some perverse feeling of revenge. None of the people that you think hurt you are hurt by true box. None of them were stopped from playing on truebox servers. Literally everyone in that screenshot was on every truebox TLP. Zaide is the one that popped into ST first thing, woke the sleeper, and destroyed the loot. The people you hate aren't even slowed down by true box.

It is a random act of aggression benefiting nobody. But by all means keep it. I want every round of TLP to have at least one true box server. It'd just be nice if eventually we got a new TLP that wasn't truebox.

I completely agree, shouldn't have Truebox.

Remove MOTM because its garbage.

AOCs are a huge blessing.

Lower the player limit required in a zone to spawn a pick

Except that none of the stuff you mentioned actually happened Warzon. It was easier to find camps open on Phinny, Agnar and Coirnav then it was on RF during its heyday. I did my cleric alts epic in era in less than 1 day. No one was camping it. There are still boxers yes, but far fewer, and they box far fewer toons, and no picks don’t hide them. Nor do AOCs. By your own admission you don’t play on the true box, yet you claim these horrors exist when they just don’t.


Again I don’t care if boxers get a server. Let them go box in peace all alone. But there is no need to lie about true ox and vilify it to get what you want.

I did my cleric's epic in less than a day as well on Lockjaw. I'm not arguing that there's a problem. I'm saying that the problem, if it exists, isn't any better on a true box server. When you encountered a single group of people camping something, you didn't have the same visceral reaction that you did when you encountered 3 groups camping it on RF. It was still camped. Or it wasn't. In one situation you were OK with the fact that it was camped, but in the other it's just automagically a problem. On both servers you also found camps that were open, but on one "well obviously that's because true box" whereas on the other "I guess those filthy boxers are somewhere else today."

I didn't run into any issues on true box servers with being blocked from doing content, but that's because I am good at the game and never run into those issues.

Allowing boxing is not what improved people's experience, it was the AoC.

As to vilifying it, look at the posts on the boards from boxers asking to have a server where they can be allowed to box. Making no mention of any true box server, not proposing any proposed server be changed or anything. Instant responses from a vocal minority that boxers are all scum and should be driven from the game forever. Describing identical "issues" found on true box servers in the language true box advocates use to describe "problems" on rf/lj is not dishonest. It's advocating for what I want in a way that I never did before, because I trusted DBG to see all the whining for what it was.

As they clearly were not worthy of that trust, I am trying to point out that there is a sizeable number of players that would like to see a boxing-allowed TLP at some point in the future. And unlike the truebox advocates, I'm not asking that anyone else be prohibited from playing on such a server. You are welcome to join us, we're an inclusive bunch. I would hope they'd release a true box server concurrent with that, because I don't really want anyone to have to deal with situations in their hobby they don't want to deal with. The people who hate boxers, are misguided. I believe many of them to be quite silly. But that is their right. If someone needs to have a group to blame for their own failures, that's understandable.

Giving us our own server, as was given to the true box crowd (this will be the fourth and fifth time in a row?), is a reasonable request.

I'm singling this one little phrase out because it seems to be the go-to insult for those of us who honor the intentions of the TrueBox code.

So, I would post a challenge to you. On the next TLP, create a single character. Play said single character till it's raid ready. Should you want to play another? Create a single alt and play it separately from the main and have no association with the high end guilds till you're raid ready.

Take a walk through in shoes of somebody who won't or cannot box. I'm sure you'll see things that you have been insulating yourself from.

You are literally describing exactly how I play at server/expansion launches. I only start up the boxes once the initial rush is over and groups become scarce. This will be the first server launch that I don't go the full PUG route, just because the timing will be so tight, and I was specifically asked by guildies on another server to help with this push. I won't be making any boxes, I might make one alt. I won't be making boxes because it is a true box server and I follow the rules. I'm going to get trained by plenty of anti-box true boxers who don't follow the rules, I know that for sure. I'm going to be in a guild that gets accused of all manner of BS because we're going to be the top guild, I know that for sure as well.

I don't say that quote to be insulting. I'm just pointing out the actual cause and effect. The decision not to do the crazy playtime/competitive EQ-ing that is necessary to be there for server firsts is a decision. I respect it, and I've made it on most TLP's myself. But instead of owning that, so so many went to the forums and whined that the crazy people were ruining their game. This is nonsense. Classic EQ, Kunark, Velious, and Luclin, are boooooooring raids. The race is where 99% of the game is. To claim otherwise is to acknowledge that you were never really playing EQ.

Which is fine, the great thing about EQ is that you are free to go play whatever game you want within it.

Where the contempt comes in, that is probably coming across in my posts a little strongly, is in, after making the decision that you don't want to compete, finding fault with those that do. I don't have an issue with someone being in a non-competitive family guild, I do have an issue with that same person, having made that choice, not understanding that that means you don't get to see the content (on a server lacking AoC's).

I have a particular brand of crazy that is mine, and I respect those afflicted to lesser and greater degrees.

The problem is that many of those with a different level of crazy want to force the rest of us to play a certain way, because reasons. And then want to falsely claim that those restrictions made any sort of a difference in their outcomes. Adding AoC's was a GREAT change to the game, because it lets those that don't want to compete, see Naggy. Great. You saw it.

What I don't understand is why you're still persecuting boxers. We literally are doing nothing to you. We weren't before, but we definitely aren't now. None of us is even asking for the new servers to be anything but true box. We'd just like to eventually get a new server that wasn't true box.

Because the true box servers will all die. There's no way to take them seriously. They advance to a point where every live server is now, and that is, you need boxes to get anything done, because, for instance, as a person maining a cleric, all the tanks have a healer merc, and just go do their own thing. But the tank mercs are garbage so you load up your tank box. But on a true box server I won't have one, because I can't, because anti-boxers set up the rules so that I can't, not because of any realistic technical limitation preventing me from doing it.

Hopefully that explains it a little better.

outta here with that no true Scotsman bullcrap.

People who don't participate in the neckbeard fest that is cutting edge content clearing "were never really playing EQ?" good god.

I really need to take a break from this forum after the past week.

No friend you're right and I totally agree with you. I think the AoC's are fantastic for that very reason. They changed the game fundamentally, to make it so that if you didn't want to race, the entire game was still there to be explored and experienced at your own pace. They also preserve the open world for the guilds that do want to race, AND provide bonus loot opportunities for those same guilds! It's like the gift that keeps on giving.

But in the game before AoC's, it is impractical to expect you would see the content if you were unwilling to compete. Boxers aren't to blame for this, it was fundamental to the game design.

Agreed. Unless you are part of 1 or 2 prime guilds, it's just flat impossible in the face of the bat phones etc. Guilds will sit on key bosses and deliberately stop lesser guilds from getting those targets. It's just a fact of life. P99 was/is a prime example. There was never any boxing there, but it's really hard to get big targets without being in certain guilds and be ready to respond 24/7 for targets spawning.

AoCs were a fantastic creation! It let somewhat casual players experience content in era without having to deal with the prime guilds. I would just like to experience AoCs in a non true box progression environment.

had fun raiding without boxing in demiplane today,after raid i logged my boxes and we did some blockers turn in with another guildie group so much easier to do then a single group also i help with a ot of epics stuff we have a lot of fun together but after oow the game has not the same feel for me so i will be 2 boxing i will get a mage to maximum lvl then a cleric on second account.

The only person whinnying here is you bud. Your impotent diatribes are entertaining though keep up the good work.

It's weird that you think anyone that enjoys truebox is part of a "non-competitive' family guild though bud. Some of us just prefer our gameplay without box armies, it's more fun that way



I remember when a certain Faceless boxer KSed his guild on Draco(9 mins) guess you guys just weren't good enough, but please continue with telling us how great Magefire and BoxJaw were, tell me more about how boxing 30 mages makes the game more enjoyable.

Then congrats, you have 20 server to chose from. Leave the other 3 for us then, bye

i wonder how many of those people against boxing are actually playing the game and are in a guild,also i remember we would put all the dps in 1 raid and tanks cc etc in the other and there his always the exception to the rule.

Good thing you guys have gotten like 4 new TLPs with Truebox - and will get at least one new truebox server. Like seriously, how many truebox servers do they have to make before you guys will be happy?

They should open a 3rd TLP server for boxers. I do not believe it would affect other servers population much, it does not look like hard core boxers would play on Truebox servers anyway. DBG can shut down Fippy and Lockjaw if they need hardware resources for a new server.