Really? I find it wildly low for sustained, for both raid and group for all classes. Had to go to my guild website and look at the parses, but yeah, low for all classes, especially bards, way way undershooting what they actually do. Unless you mean that is their solo sustained.
You're blowing things out of proportion. Name a raid that doesn't want a bard in each melee dps group (and caster group for that matter) because their adps + personal dps is too weak compared to what another class could do. They're a flat out staple. With that said, I think the class could use a bit of a dps upgrade. On the parse given I would say if the bard did 45-50k dps instead of 30k dps no one is going to complain, and the bard will have more fun. So that would be great. But instead, some dev will get wind of a guy saying that bards are negative value and driving the point way too far and then we'll get bards with berserker levels of dps along with bard levels of adps. The new ideal dps group will just be bard, bard, bard, bard, bard, shaman (maybe with 1 ranger and/or bst/berserker depending on the way in which bards become overpowered). In the end that's not what you want since now what's the point of the other dps classes? Ideally each class has a reasonable place at the table. This is why I suggest making mechanics that have complexity to them. If it's just a straight up measuring contest, then 2 days after implementation we're right back here. I bet something good could be done for bards, and bards are definitely a class that could use a boost.
If you look purely at say TBM events yes its low. double the numbers would reflect purely TBM events (on avg). but you factor in EoK T3 pre gaining blockers DPS numbers are very low.. and yes pre CoTF stuff.. anyone raiding in T3 EoK will know the very low DPS in there. Basically the individual DPS numbers on the chart mean nothing.. if they are all normalized to very very low numbers or hugely overly exaggerated numbers it would not matter. what is important is that the all go up and down together.. The ratios of numbers is what is important. None of these numbers where done with diff classes at diff times. Meaning i was not pulling bard DPS in EoK T3 and zerker dps on grummus and so forth. Event by event basis DPS numbers go up and down.. you can not balance anything with random numbers. Averaging is the only way to find out the true state of balance. In fact i have data for each event and class average for each event and for the most part the ratios are always the same. you get some minor flux due to class roles in events.. normally it is always the same. one thing that is always consistent bards dead last (excluding tanking tanks/ Druids?/ Clerics) Zerk #1 Wiz Rog #2-3 (prob throw in necro if parsers catch the dots) #4 Ranger #5-7 BL/Monk/Mage (at times you will sen ench up in here and now assume shm) #Tanks in dps mode #Bard Melee Group #Bard Caster Group #Cleric No idea what druids are doing. I wouldn't even count shm prior to there dot loving which literally gives them insane DPS for a priest.
seriously, you lost any cred right there. No one should ever add in pre blockers dps to anything. As to the rest, dont put #'s next to % and expect people to look at the %. Also, are you talking sustained or burn? You need a heck of a lot more qualifiers before your graph means anything. Right now its just a part of the vast "fake news"
Using numbers from EoK T3 to compare the DPS of classes makes no sense because the Aura of Kor-Sha doesn't affect everyone equally. That is why you see monks doing so well there and zerkers taking such a heavy hit. That aura was never created with balance in mind, it was just an annoying mechanic to add difficulty to a single raid zone. I'm not saying bards aren't bottom of the barrel, but I think anyone that goes back and reviews their guild's parses will know that those numbers in general are really low and not even relatively accurate.
The point of this is to illustrate bard parse are way to low. Yea the numbers are low i can pull up events that would have numbers significanly higher than that it would not matter. i dont care if #1 is 100DPS and Bard is 16DPS I dont care if #1 is 1,000,000 DPS and bard is 160,000 DPS the smaller the window you look at the numbers will be vastly different. How are you suppose to balance anything by looking at a moving target event by event, burn or not burn and so on.
The accuracy of the parse matters. If bards are 10-15% below beastlords, then they shouldn't get a dps increase. IF they are 50% below, then ya, bards need a personal dps increase. The parse given is basically fabricated. It leaves out multiple classes, gives zero context, and apparently doesn't pass the smell test.
Took a couple different class avg dps events here: a burn one (Grummus) and a longer event (EoK T2 Queen) Necro is a wild card due to parsing issues. Monks, well dont have one. Mage and BL show a little lower due to primary pet being excluded. Compare to my weeks of class avg dps yes lots of shifting but the common factor is bards being very low. bards are never competitive to anyone. would be nice if they could be. the argument of them being bastard ADPS/CC should not mean dead last parse.
Even though beastlords give more sustained ADPS than bards do? You still think they should be 15% below beasts? Beastlords are just as much hybrids as bards are... they are part DPS, part ADPS, part debuffer, etc. Oh, and they also have a fairly powerful pet. Now, I'm not objecting to beastlords having what they have. But to try to claim they should be almost 20% more DPS than bards, given what they -do- have, is kinda absurd.
I play bard as my main - i agree bard dont have the great a DPS other classes have. But if i wanted a DPS class i would reroll as a DPS (and not as a bard). Bard have alot of other good stuff going for them, other classes dont have. So in all honesty stop crying and start enjoy your class.
Bard versatility is also woefully overrated in 90% of content. "O they can single pull"... which only helps if you do not have a tank, ranger, enchanter, or myriad of other classes. "O they can mez"... see answer above "O they do ginormous ADPS"... Everyone says this and it's partially true, however I have yet to see any quantify it in such a way that justifies bards being the absolute lowest DPS both burn and sustained in the game. Sure someone has to be on the bottom, but wouldn't it make more sense to raise the bottom in relationship to other classes atleast? Bards are doing DPS that would have been ok a 4 or 5 years ago at best. "O well they can sort of burn" ... Bard burn DPS in 60's is sustainable for some classes nigh indefinitely or near it. Not looking so hot on this point. Hey atleast they can still make you run fast.
feel free to share gamparse html files or links of raids. i would like to see them.. especially bards. Thanks.
Raid night was EoK T2 and CoSul Showing the lead DPS, Shamans, Hybrids and Melee group Bards. So tell me why its ok for a priest to do that much DPS but cant ask for bards to be more competitive with other Hybrids? Actually the sham parse is truly higher than that looking at folks parse that is in range for Dot damage more often. #1 Berserker + pets 767363k@(242760dps in 3161s) #5 Shaman 518645k@(164440dps in 3154s) #6 Ranger + pets 490906k@(155105dps in 3165s) #9 Shaman + pets 463056k@(146722dps in 3156s) #11 Ranger + pets 411734k@(130008dps in 3167s) #14 Beastlord + pets 341592k@(109100dps in 3131s) #25 Shaman 238675k@(76303dps in 3128s) #30 Bard + pets 177586k@(56592dps in 3138s) #31 Bard + pets 163714k@(51808dps in 3160s) #34 Bard + pets 136876k@(43702dps in 3132s)
