Test Discussion GU 57: Light Mid-range Adjustments

Sure as long as its a marginal improvement and I can keep up with kther powersets via chaning any changes are alright with me.

In that specific quote I was simply asking you to provide a rotation where you could not ever reapply Inspiration + Chompers/Spikequake. The reason I asked for that is to illustrate that every rotation can now take advantage of the original buff due to the grace period. Which would mean a general removal of this buff affects the entire spectrum not just the specific combo in question.

Basically every rotation should be able to benefit from +15% Precision now which was not accounted for in the initial midrange adjustments. So show me a rotation that you feel cannot benefit from this buff at all and thus is fundamentally lower in damage.



Also just to reiterate some points. The 1.5 second in combat ramp up has been in place since the original conception (after feedback). It was NOT added during this pass. Second ramp up times BEGINS at the very very beginning of the activation of a tray trait. So if you go from animation A to animation B, both have 1 second animation time and you are using the in combat ramp up time then you get enhanced damage halfway through animation B. Therefore the time it takes for the Might portion of combo to play out you are already contributing to this ramp up timer.

Thank you. This looks what mine originally looked like.

Now if looking at all of those, ram generates the most damage by far even though fan was critting the most. I mean ram is doing 44.5% of all damage, that's huge. That means if you blanket nerf all the powers hl will go to crap, most likely. Then there will be only one loadout and we all know how fun ice is to play.

Though I suspect that if you use the same chomp clip insp clip recharge mechanic during fan>impact phase you will get the same or similar numbers. Then there would be couple rotations to try out, including lb>mg>ram> snap or gh> fan >impact. Those are not as good since they contain single targets. Try it out if you could please because next part is gonna be hypothetical for now.

Of course I could be wrong on that account and the problem is that ram isn't scaling with distance properly and since it's doing the most damage that's how you are getting 40k hits from close range to full range. I think it's highly improbable but better to be safe than sorry.

Now if you can get the same numbers from impact then the problem is chom+insp+rc stacking with AM, or both ram and impact not scaling. Either way a blanket nerf won't fix anything. And since it's 1:30 am I'm going to sleep and maybe try some of the nonsense I just said tomorrow if I get time. Hopefully Tunso thinks of something better than a blanket nerf.

And again thanks for logs.


Ps sticking chomp+insp+rc just anywhere won't give you the same damage, probably.

We don't have to increase cooldowns or decrease overall combo damage. Just remove the grace period since that is what initially sparked these high parses.
And because as stated plenty of times already....we already have a short cut of getting back to combo damage in 1.5 seconds in combat. Like thats way better than what Rage and Celestial have right now and extremely fast. If you doubt this...it's already been tested and working as intended.

Just consider giving a range rotation a 0-7m damage scalar at exactly 35,500 baseline (with Melee being 36k-38k) and move Inspiration to a spot where we can grab both Light Barrier and Inspiration in a single column. That's all that needs to be done.

I had someone request it earlier. After the initial pi use only, just doing the minigun/ram clip in my original rotation i hit 37-39k, starts at 2:00 . the pi just adds an extra 1-3k'ish

That's not what I was getting at. There's no doubt it affects damage. The doubt was with the assumption that there existed a rotation in which you could not clip in all Inspiration + Chompers/Spikequake at all. As in the solution of "not allow Light to be get the benefit of Inspiration" somehow only affected your rotation only and nothing else. I am fairly certain that statement is false and that you can clip them into any rotation now thanks to the grace period. Thus if you don't allow Light to be affected by the buff all rotations are affected not just yours.

this is the fan combo clip that's better than the minigun clip I was doing. If you need the video I can upload it as unlisted, but its laggy to the point I can't upload it for public without getting a few dislikes xD You can still see the rotation and reads and its not bad at some points but still.
Ima use CRI for the chompers recharge inspiration clip

GGJr rotation(minigun clip) ~39-40k:
Step 1: CRI
Step 2: minigun-> ram->fan->impact->lightblast->minigun->ram clip with minigun
Step 3: previous minigun that was clipped>-ram->fan->impact->lightblast->minigun->ram clip with minigun->ram clip with CRI
Step 4: Repeat step 2 and 3 infinitely

TSIJr rotation(fan clip) ~40-41k:
Step 1: CRI
Step 2: fan->impact->lightblast->minigun->ram clip with fan
Step 3: previous fan that was clipped->impact->lightblast->minigun->ram clip with CRI
Step 4: Repeat step 2 and 3 infinitely

TSIJr mid range log -> http://dcuolog.com/?log=ae53071b&view=parser

No my suggestion accounted for more than the rotation provided by Kuroki Honoo, I'm sure there are others discovered or not yet discovered that could surpass even that. I'm in the minority that like the continuous chain AM and would hate to see it replaced but at the end of the day whatever happens so long light is competitive in whatever form leaves test thats all that matters.

I didn't even look at hl before that patch but since you say we would be fine without grace then it's better than a nerf.

Tunso just put the power back to before the mid range change started, so people remember why we needed an update in the first place.

I totally agree with this. I would much prefer to not have a grace period than receive lower overall damage. The 1.5 second shortcut is there and should be enough considering the already planned changes. While I like the idea of being able to use Inspiration its not necessary. It'd be cool but the numbers would have to get worked out. Or maybe it should be the only exception to not stopping AM damage. Regular counters should still stop damage the way they can for other powers.

It would be extremely beneficial if Inspiration and Light Barrier we're in the same column.

I also agree that the range AoE cycle's should provide better results if used at 0 - 7 M from the target(s). It shouldn't parse as high as our Melee rotation which is point blank. The Melee Rotation should parse out very well since it is one of the riskiest to use.

The only thing I would add to this is increasing the distance the Melee combo's can do damage from out to 7M for each interrupt type(Claw, Lunging Swing, Boxing Gloves, and Chainsaw). As well as slightly increasing the AoE's width to 210 degree's.

Then its on the player when using this to use the right attack at the right time. Damage won't be lost as much due to natural CC that happens in group content.

My point is, if something should be done about that, it shouldn't be a general HL damage output nerf.
HL user shouldn't be forced to use some super clipping stuff to do damage similar to e.g. Ice. I'm not saying I wouldn't like to do it but it shouldn't be the only way to keep up with the others.
I remember when Tunso said few months ago that all that HL requires to produce max dmg is simple combo chain, no need for 'inspiration', not to mention super clipping. It should stay that way.

Nice try to keep Ice as a weak power.

I'm curious if he used Inspiration prior to starting the AM rotation? That would buff his damage by over 15% given the 15% precision buff and the critical damage and chance increase. .

I can tell you given your crit rates that those are higher than the norm and the only way you get those is with inspiration. Did no one else notice this?

The power point allocation below for Light should be used when conducting Tunso Testing.

Support Tree: Boxing, Impact, Swing, Grasping Hand, and Light Blase
Assault Tree: Light Claw, Mini Guns, Chompers, Fan, Spike Quake, Light Weight, Chain Saw, and Ram
Iconic Tree: Tactical Genius and Weapon Expert

That is the Tunso Light test power point allocations. I'm no fool to the testing you are conducting.

So please redo your test with the Power Points allocation above and making sure you have all the correct mods in place.

oO someone used the forbidden rotation of doom and the wrong power-point allocation? Noone would do this on live...ever Get real...
Also:

The thing with the testing he is doing is similar to the testing that anyone could of done with Ice for its SC - Ice Elemental. The same with Gadgets and Mental 3 MT or EMP hits. These test go beyond the standard AM setup and players make choices that can improve damage but increase their deaths during a run. These test are also outside the AM standard mechanics, just like Inspiration is outside the normal Light Power Point allocation.

The allocation for power points for Light AM is the Power Power Allocation I listed in my post above. That is how Light Power Points should be allocated when testing to ensure players get both Melee, Mid Range and Range rotations. Anything outside of that is not a true test for Light.

I have asked for Light Power Points to be adjusted and to allow Light players to get all combo moves, shield and Inspiration with 13 PP, like other powers. If that was given to Light than yes adjustment to damage should be done. However, if no adjustment to Ability location than there should be no change or modification to the damage as testing with Inspiration is like testing Ice with its Ice Elemental, it is outside of the scope of the standard AM setup.

I like the updates they made to Light. It makes us think about how to build our toon out and how to allocate our Power Points. As a long time Light Player I'm struggling to find the right balance ATM. I like I have options but some hold higher risk than others. Light player who go with Inspiration will be a true glass cannon. With Gagdets AM as an example, you can still reduce or avoid damage with distract, Ice you can use Bitter Winds or use Reflection, Atomic I get Proton Remedy and heals me, Earth I have enough PP to take the HL shield or Gemstone, etc...

There are options for Light Players but unlike other powers we have to pay attention to our powers more so than other power sets.

So using an attack buff is an exploit now? Good grief

Same thing like last what 2-3 times they tried to update HL ppl show numbers HL gets nerf before going live and then another year of doing popcorn dmg.

This rotation isn't similar to ice, this rotation BLOWS EVERYTHING ELSE OUT. On tunso testing, ice is dead at at 30K mid range while im at 40K. On live, I had JR1NC take his 3 sparring targets read and he was at 56K as ice, and I'm at 64-70K. I challenge anyone in this thread that has a high toon on live, beat 64-70K on 3 sparring targets at 152 cr or 33-36k single target, I can almost guarantee it's not gonna happen. The regular chain that everyone uses is what's on par with the other powers if not slightly less, my rotation is 20-30% stronger than everything else. Don't get the situation twisted lol

You know what, I shut my mouth with Ice Elemental, Gadgets Stealth, Mental Invisibility, and how strong Atomic combo AM melee damage is. You know what, all of these perform above and beyond the standard max damage threshold.

Tunso test has parameters and the only way to ensure you meet those parameters for Light is to take allocate the Power Points as I pointed out to ensure you get both the full melee and range rotations along with the Iconic abilities. Anything outside of that is not within the test parameters. Just like when Gadgets and Mental was setup. Invisibility and Stealth are outside of the test parameters and the extra damage they produce did not impact the primary test.

Now if the developers adjusted Light due to the Inspiration mid-range testing, than all other powers will have to be adjusted based on other testing parameters that are not part of the standard testing such as Invisibility, Stealth and Ice Elemental. Would players from those powers, who do not use those ability, want their damage adjusted down? The answer is no, just like the Light players who do not use inspiration, we do not want our damage adjusted down because a few decided to use Inspiration.

Unfortunately, the fix I checked in last Friday didn't make it out to the build you all were playing this weekend. It's not intended for you to suddenly gain the ability to clip all your weapon buffs and then get back to comboing. That will obviously result in higher than intended DPS output.

It's only intended that you're able to continue comboing after interruption. So once that fix makes it out to PC Test, roations like this one will reset your damage like they should.