Perspective time, K/D ratio: What is Good, Bad, Normal??

Where I come from Necromancy is a very serious offense, the dead prefer to stay in the realm of the dead.

Yup, that's the reason for FF and weapons lock.

I also played Goldeneye back in the day. Good times.
Anyways, IMO under 1.0 is not good, between 1.0 and 2.0 is OK, between 2.0 and 3.0 is good, and above 3.0 is farmer john status.

I'm sorry that a counterpoint with examples to back it up counts as elitism. K/D can be irrelevant to you on a personal level, that is *more* than fine, but it still represents a metric to gauge a players performance. You mentioned that people get shamed / flamed for low K/D's when it comes to posting but there is a reason behind it.

The forums, at its core is about game discussion and asking questions / getting information. As I've mentioned before this is a FPS, that while there is a base capture mechanic, still boils down to killing the other dudes so you can take their base and go fight at the next one. So when someone who generally fails at the very base, very basic part of this game (e.g. your low K/D player) tries to give advice its sort of like a junkie living on the street trying to give you financial advice.

Most of us would nod slowly and walk away, but seeing as this is the internet and we aren't in any danger, we'll stay a while and flame the person for it. But at the base level, the advice is still from the perspective of someone who has yet to find success at the core of the gameplay experience.

Don't worry, K/D is without a purpose in a game like this that focuses on teamwork more than straight-out shooting. I have only 0.77 K/D but I am still proud of that because I know I am useful to my faction. Just have fun.

No, I simply didn't need to come up with any more.

Saying "u just sux at shooterz so u say k/d irrelevantz" is elitism, not a counterpoint. And it's just an ad hominem to boot. It's also putting the wagon in front of the horse - maybe the person's K/D is bad because they don't care about K/D... they care more about the actual game of PS2 and helping their team win?

You didn't provide any examples. You just said some judgmental stuff like "well medix has gun so medix shood have guud k/d". Again, not really a counterpoint - just an opinion. And you're missing the point. The point of the medic is to heal infantry. The point of the engineer is to repair and supply ammo. You can take the weapons away from these classes and guess what? You haven't affected the classes ability to do their main jobs at all. Besides, in the armed forces - everyone is armed and trained to use their arms. Even a cook in the Navy is issued a sidearm and trained to use it. Having a gun only increases the utility of these classes. Many times I've been running around as an engineer to go repair someone, and sighted a light assault or a heavy sneaking around - I equip my gun and put some rounds in them. They either die, or they retreat. Either way - the danger to my team is now mitigated. But as an engineer, you can take away my gun, and it wouldn't affect my ability to play the class effectively nor the fun I have doing so. I die countless times while repping a max. The max survives, because I keep his health full and he has more effective hitpoints than I do. I get a res, and continue to repair him. Because I repair him, the enemy cannot advance. If I was not there to repair him, he would die, and the enemy would march over the position.

Personal K/D... is completely irrelevant. What's relevant is the kills the team gets. As an assault class, you're contributing. As a medic class, you're contributing. But even team kills are not 100% relevant, because there are many more factors that come into play.

As I've already outlined, it's irrelevant on the individual level. And it's irrelevant on an objective level, again, as I've outlined before (because of the complexity of the game and the fact that the core of the game is not to get kills.)

Yeah and I pointed it out. Foolish boys, chest-beating, ego, elitism, etcetc.

MMOFPS.

Or making their lives so miserable that they just redeploy. Such as... having a lot of engis/medics keeping people up to demoralize the enemy. You might be an elite FPS guy, but how many times are you gonna kill the same light assault only to see them resurrected and still advancing before you get frustrated and leave? Sure you might enjoy getting the kills - but you're not making any progress in the game and will eventually redeploy, I promise you that. My outfit fights out-popped all the time, but we usually win, because we demoralize our enemy. We don't care about K/D or anything like that. Sure, we can sit in doorways and farm for kills and be "eliteuberfpsplayers", or we can understand the game we're playing, and instead go suicide gank that Sundy, and then the replacement, and so on, until the enemy gets mad and ragedeploys.

Also consider that it takes several rockets to kill a vehicle in the game - but only the person who landed the killing blow gets the kill - the other person gets an assist. So one person can do 90% of the damage, and then die, while Johnny Come Lately puts that last round in, and gets the kill. Further showing that K/D is irrelevant.

You see what you're actually doing here is formulating a false premise (K/D is the very base, core, etc part of this game) and arguing from that. But since your premise is wrong, your argument is wrong (even if logically sound). Sorry.

You keep saying "core". I don't think you understand the type of game PS2 is. It's a cooperative, team-centered MMOFPS. You keep thinking like it's a traditional FPS game. It's not. The core of PS2 gameplay is coordinated, opposing teams battling for control of objectives. Killing scores of infantry who will just respawn in a second anyway is irrelevant to this. A base is won when the enemy gives up. That is the only condition of winning. Capping points, sure - you can actually hold the base mechanically, but still be fighting hard to keep the base. The battle is still raging. It isn't over until the enemy, or your team, has given up and left. And the way you make the enemy team leave is to demoralize them by outplaying them and making their lives miserable and the game unfun for them. Kills are irrelevant. Deaths are irrelevant. This thread is littered with examples of how a player, making no kills and in fact taking a few deaths, can take actions that decide the outcome of the battle. You've convenient decided to completely gloss over this, and keep asserting, wrongly that the core of PS2 is killing. It's not.

Anyway I'm satisfied that I've sufficiently trounced your position. I might reply to further "counterpoints" you generate if it suites me, but I haven't seen a single solid argument from the K/D Matters Crowd on this forum to really pique my interest. They are in the minority, after all, because the average player understands this game.

while you shouldnt care about K/D, just in case you do, the average K/D is probably .7ish

I heard it was 0.9, before the revive change, on average. Probably a little more than that now.

Well said man.

Shouldn't it be exactly 1.0 ?

Actually, given the revive mechanic (and maybe a few character that get deleted in disgust), shouldn't it be slightly higher than 1 ?

I started to come up with a point by point reply, then I got to this : "but how many times are you gonna kill the same light assault only to see them resurrected and still advancing before you get frustrated and leave?"

And realized that nothing more needed to be said, this speaks volumes to your naivety about the FPS world and this MMOFPS in particular.

You honestly think battles are won and lost by causing your opponent to give up.... from farming the same kills over and over again.

If that is how you play the game and get enjoyment out of it, keep on keepin on. Because I can safely say with around 1500 hours of game time, I've yet run into a situation with an infantry "farm" and not have a smile light up my face. Happy hunting.

When I see someone with a low K/D and very high SPM, I see him/her as a asset and will have more respect for them.

Having a low K/D would make it difficult to have a high SPM because all the time spent staring at the deploy screen. I think it is safe to say 1 death puts you out of the fight for at least 20 seconds and that will add up over the coarse of a play session.

You don't always have to die to get a lot of SPM or even get a lot of kills.

You said 'low K/D and very high SPM". How do you "get a lot of SPM or even get a lot of kills" all while maintaining a low K/D?

He wants to say that someone who constantly repairs tanks and maxes or rez people will have a good SPM but a bad k/d because hes not killing alot people but still contributes to his faction.

Guys, what the heck, this thread is from March 2013. Let it die already.

I get in my skygaurd, I can get an insane SPM, but my K/D doesn't necessarily get much better. Other, night, I earned 300 certs in an hour, no boosts or membership. Just help defending a biolab during an alert.

250 XP = 1 cert. You got 300 certs in 1 hour. 250 x 300 = 75,000. 75,000/60 (minutes in an hour). You were averaging 1,250 XP per minute. Wow, that sure is impressive! I think killing an ESF is worth 400 XP, so you were averaging 3 ESF kills a minute for a whole hour. You are like an XP machine! That is incredible!