[BUG] Overpowered Shotguns?

I got all of my 3 chars on Miller too (my highest being BR 45 or something) and when i'm playing NC or VS i'm getting killed almost exclusively with shotguns, not quite as often when playing TR - but there's a ******** of Claws and Phobos (and now Bruiser and Deimos) as well. You know i think of myself as a pretty average player, i improved from a 1.0 to around 2 - 3.0 KD when using "normal weapons" during my time in PS2 but while using my claw / uppercut i can easily and without any real effort clear a whole room or squad before dying to another shotgun user. And i'm pretty sure its not because my shotgun is increasing my skill.

Atm i'm at the point where it's boring to use shotguns and frustrating not to, so there's not much fun to be had for me in infantry battles and i think many players feel quite the same.

If you what I said equated to 'ignore buildings' then maybe you really should. What I suggested was another way to approach doorways to minimize your chances of getting ambushed. Not just by shotguns. By pretty much every single infantry capability in the game.

And no, I do not think that that range is ridiculous for a OHK IF they were using slugs, which is an inherently terrible idea to do at close range, OR They just got really lucky with a well placed buckshot spread. Based on that picture I would say that you were around 15-18 meters away from that doorway. For a PA that isn't outside of the realm of possibility for them to score multiple headshots.

Keep in mind that assuming it was only one person that shot you, and you didn't get hit simultaneously (we don't have the death thingy to see) taking a buckshot shot like that and somehow managing to kill you in one shot is like 1 in a million. Most other times they wouldn't have.

Now if it was a slug that killed you, then you may as well whine about scopeless bolt actions killing you in close range as well. He may have very well seen you, sighted up and creeped out/let you come into view when he fired.

I'm on waterson and I get killed by a shotgun user about as often as I get killed by a sniper. It seems like most people on that server prefer fast Rof carbines or SMGs to shotguns.

As for your example, since you are also sort of unclear about whether or not your confronting said squads directly before you murder them, that can easily be attributed to player cluelessness/obliviousness. If that many players can't take out one person no matter what weapon they are holding, then something is wrong with that group, not the weapon. If you're running up behind them then yeah, you will probably get 2-3 of them before the others notice you. And again, if none turn around, they are just being oblivious.

no shotgun should ever OHK, unless they give them massive bullets and not small pellets that can be stopped by the shield, that currently is made by VS apparently (broken)

OK just tested it. You're right that under 10 meters it takes 2 bodyshots with semi auto slugs, but AT 10 meters, only infiltrators die in two shots.
However, given how frenetic combat can be at those ranges, buckshot is still a better option.

Anyways, I hope we can continue testing this further in the thread, its been interesting!

You do know that for the semi auto shotgun they use '000' type shells, right? Those pellets are BIG. They would do considerable damage to someone, especially with the 'future' version of those shells that can smash through shields and body armor.

Also, based on how you talk about giving them 'massive bullets and not small pellets', I have to ask; Have you even used shotguns yet in this game?

They already have slugs, which are massive .60 caliber bullets. Also with the technically 'smaller' pellets that they have for PA shotguns, up close it would be even more devastating. Even though technically they would have to be smaller pellets, lets go under the assumption that they have some how made them just as lethal.

Getting hit by a PS2 buckshot blast at point blank range would be equivilant to getting hit by a tight grouping 10 or 11 .30-.32 caliber bullets instantaneously.

You can put it however you want framperton, i couldnt achieve the same results with any other weapon - user statistics speak for themselves. Also even if i could produce the same amount of damage in CQC with an smg or something, i could take down maybe 1 or 2 guys before i have to reload and will get gunned down, a PAS on the other hand can pretty easily take down 7 guys in a matter of seconds when they're rushing a room or something, you can even kill a max with one mag and you wont even be on their "radar" before the first one's already dead.

It's just not hard to do and thats the problem, and don't even dare to compare the oneshot potential to Sniper rifles because this is a completley different story. To OHK people with a sniper you need to get a perfect distance shot on a small target to the head while compensating for bullet drop, hitbox lag and the crazy momentum of the game, while with the shotgun you've got a bigass reticle you need to aim in the general direction of an enemy who occupies like 1/3 of your screen and you can even miss a few pellets without a single one hitting the head and still OHK.

I'll address the second paragraph first because this is the second time you somehow misinterpreted what I was saying.

I was saying that if the person killed you from that range with a SLUG and had any sort of optic, a bolt action with the same optic would have achieved the exact same result. You don't need to compensate for any of that at such a close range. Just like you wouldn't need to for a slug. The thing is, both those combinations are very risky options at close range. You don't have any proof to show us what the PA user had equipped so we only have your word to go on.

A 'bigass reticle' is actually more of a disadvantage for slugs than a sniper anyways.

But strictly speaking about buckshot: Please stop your exaggeration. You already sound incredibly biased, and your scenario of still managing to OHK someone who is only 1/3 in the reticle is just flat out wrong. It's just not possible. I know because like any weapon, if your aim is that off, you will miss with pretty much every shot.

Now to address the first part: What user statistics are you talking about? As far as I know SOE hasn't published some graph showing weapon usage and what weapon type has the most kills. In fact, if there was one, I'm almost certain LMGs would be at the top. Or are you going off of the odd picture people randomly post where they get exceptionally lucky and go on crazy kill streaks?

Also there you go again with terrible comparisons. A shotgun produces a large burst of damage that is really only viable at close ranges. An SMG fires single projectiles consecutively, enabling it to reach out to further ranges. The TTK for an SMG at 15-20m would almost certainly be better than a shotgun at those ranges. Also, your exaggerated example about taking down a max 'without even showing up on their radar' does not lend you any credence. That must be the world's dumbest MAX, coupled with some sort of weird sound dampening technology the PA user must have to not show up on the mini map the instant the fire.

I never said anything about Slugs, never, just wasn't me.
Also i said the guy you are shooting takes up 1/3 of your screen, nothing about being in 1/3 of my reticle. (a guy in cqc is bigger on your screen and far easier to hit than a guy 1000 meters away) .
Then, the argument "its only effective on short range" is just stupid because everything thats worth a damn in this game is happening in close quarters (otherwise the NC max whine and the nerf etc. would be also unjustified). I'm not exaggerating anywhere its all based on things i already did in the game and i know others are doing, i took out several maxes myself with the PAS because its really easy to dodge VS or TR maxes bullets in CQC while bunnyhopping around and still hitting them with your shotgun.
From my personal experience with shotgun wielders (myself included, i used shotguns frequently) there are 2 options: Either i'am turning into a god when using my PAS and get super skilled by any sort of miracle, OR there's something wrong with the weapon like being stupidly overpowered.

PS: Aside from what others were going on about, i was talking about the PAS in general, not about some Slug Ammo or range issues.

It is true that Shotguns are supposed to dominate CQC, but you also have to consider HOW MUCH they dominate. Like someone else said, I also feel that Shotguns in general and SMGs are "balanced" for CQC (meaning dominating but not invincible), but I dont agree on the Pump-Actions (which are actually unbeatable).

I find myself completely avoiding tower and biolab fights these days since there's just no point, sadly they make up for probably 30% of the games bases... In close quarters I would like to be able to use some of the more fun weapons like the MCG for example, but since the average crutch shotgun user can kill me 3 times before I even get a chance to fire my weapon, there really is no choice. Full auto and pump actions should never have been released, they just take too much out of the game for what they are worth in my opinion.

I've ignored it for a while because this whole game is just die and respawn but yeah I'm across the room and a guy has his back to me. I fire first, he turns and never comes any closer and does 69% dmg from 1 shot from the hip If I were closer I could see it or if it were a closer head shot it accept it being a kill but this stuff is way off. I wish I had a more accurate distance than saying the full length of the room.

Got 1 shotted by a light assault on his way up to me. I fired first with my solstice but 1 shot was more than plenty for him.

I honestly don't even see that much dmg from my jackhammer when I play NC

I see the target, he is trying to knife a fellow Vanu....I open fire (Orion)...he has time to kill the other guy, turn and one shot me...

Am is supposed to run to a safe distance before engaging...?

I do not want to capitulate and join the shottie club. It reminds me so much of the USAS12 Frag round debacle in BF3.

Simply not balanced.