NC scattermax overused

Everyone in this thread knows (cause your NC and have scatmax, or because youve had to defend against, or attack a position with a scatmax) that the NC max is good, too good at its job, its way too effective. i think the NC max territory should be close range, im fine with that, But its effectiveniss is way too good especially when theres 2, rockets, grenades, c4, arent a simple solution now that their being spammed in numbers when we all know how hard it is to take on one.

You know it helps to not contradict yourself within the same thread if you're trying to make a point.

It is not necessarily about who wins in a HA vs MAX scenario, its about how much health is left after it is done. Since there are no test videos out there (highlight reels don't count) of what I would consider a more realistic scenario, I am left to conjecture in my head.

Stick 2 HA against an NC MAX between 5m-10m, say go and *BAM* *BAM* fight is over, barely a scratch.

Stick 2 HA against a VS/TR MAX at 15m-20m, say go and, *RATA TAT TAT* *PEW* PEW* MAX wins, but down to half health.

The sweet spot, where VS/TR MAXs operate at their peak just pales in comparison to NC MAXs.

Actually, from my experience, most of them are straight up stupid. There's the occasional high level player in them that won't fall for bait, but most hear all the commotion about Hacksaws and think to themselves, "Aha! I'm going to go **** face now that I have the ultimate secret." Just make sure your trap has a plan B as well, because although they won't kill max units outside of 10m, as infantry you're definitely in the danger zone around 15m give or take a few.

And contrary to popular belief, our Max isn't complete garbage. It's not great, but it's not terrible, and it definitely DOES have range.

2 HA will easily kill a MAX that isnt a nc in close range, ive been taken down by a NC gauss saw when i had full hp before i could turn around, all headshots i beleive. Even tho its a real B*tch to take down a heavy with mercies when hes in ur face, miss every shot where a nc max would simply take him out in 2 or 3 hits.

It's easy to overwhelm NC MAX. Small magazines+longest reloads of any MAX mean you don't trickle in single file. You rush in, lose some ppl but kill the MAXs as they are stuck reloading for 4 seconds (if they use Hacksaws, Scattercannon is 3.5). Then throw a rez grenade.

Their damage is all upfront and not sustained, so that gives you a clear idea of how to approach a fight with them.

I just hate the fact that NC infantry dominate CQ with their high dps and theyre great accuracy and they cry for buffs or being underpowered, they run face first into TR and VS maxes and, profit. VS infantry arent as scarey as NC infantry.

Get an extended clip nova, serpent, or h-v45

Understandable but there are logical problems with how this test is evaluated. If the NC MAX defeats two HAs within the 10M range and lives with 75% HP whereas the TR/VS MAX lives with 40% HP you're looking a great disparity between the MAXs. When we move out to 20M the NC MAX may defeat one and die to the other while reloading or defeat both with very little HP left, say 10-15%.

Will the TTK and health left of the TR and VS MAX change with a move from 10-20M? Likely very little if at all due to spread because the effectiveness of their weapons are more all purpose, the VS/TR trade higher close range stopping power for retaining medium range stopping power.

What are we gaining from this test that gives any more insight into the current debate? It is already without question that NC excel in CQC and that TR/VS are more balanced in terms of range and damage. The problem still lies in the minds of people that do not accept that balance does not mean equal in all things.

When a primarily VS/TR MAX that has this mental trapping dies within CQC they see this as an imbalance. When they live and win at 20M they don't see an imbalance.

Two rockets to take down a MAX. Now lets put teamwork in play for both sides, the NC and the non-NC.
Team NC: Two ScatMAXs, One Engineer
Team non-NC: Two Heavy Assaults, One Combat Medic

The two ScatMAXs wisely hide behind a corner in a building in a bio lab. the Engineer is sandwiched in the corner behind them for protection, crouched.

The two Heavy Assaults and Combat Medic know exactly where the ScatMAXs are, because the ScatMAXs have been camping the spot for some time.

Lets do two avenues of approach for the 2HA 1CM team.

Method 1: 1 HA bounces a concussion grenade around the corner, which hits both ScatMAXs and the engineer. The two heavy assaults rush up, gib the first ScatMAX with two rockets, then switch to auto-shotties and destroy the other ScatMAX just before it recovers from the effects of the grenade. The engineer, berefit of protection now, is mowed down with the remaining shotgun blasts.

Method 2: the 2 HAs pop their shields and run up, gibbing the first ScatMAX with two rockets to the face. The remaining ScatMAX mows them down. The Engineer repairs the remaining ScatMAX. The Combat Medic revives both HA, which pop up and run away while the ScatMAX wastes its remaining shots on them thanks to spawn immunity. The two HAs reload, wait till their shields refresh, run back up with rockets and gib the remaining ScatMAX. The Engineer tries to switch to its weapon and mow them down, one HA is downed, the other is wounded, but the Engineer is killed. The Combat Medic revives the downed HA and heals the wounded HA.

Either way the 2 HAs and 1 CM succeed in dislodging a duo of MAXs and the pocket engineer, in CQC, a shotgun's prime kill zone.

Ofc cuz every fight you have a team that can work that well together in a matter of moments when you need it, in fast action where nothing can go wrong. I forgot we play fairy land 2. thank god everything looks good on paper.
also. tactics to take down a NC max, stated above. tactics to take down VS and TR max? = face roll

Why thank you. That's the benefit of killing campers, you have as long as you want to make it work. ^_^

Edit: Besides, how difficult is it to point at a dorito, hold Q, select tell, and type, "Hey you, spawn a HA and come to me, we're going to kill some NC ScatMAX scum," point at another dorito, repeat with, "Hey you, spawn a CM and get over here, we're going to kill some NC ScatMAX scum." Invite to squad, invite to squad, coordinate over wifcom, get the job done, talk **** over /yell when it's done to make the NC feel bad about sucking at camping. People are rather pliable to the idea of getting revenge on things they perceive as overpowered.

HA's run up to the door and toss C-4 through the door and insta-gib both MAXes, or an AV grenade + decimator.

Complaining about the Scat MAX vs Cycler MAX is like complaining between LMG TTK, and Shotgun TTK. SHotgun insta gibs at point blank, boo hoo, nerf shotguns.

Shotguns are strong, but combine it with the sturdiness of a MAX and you can clear up to half a squad before reloading (if they're caught in a small area).

I think a major problem is that VS and TR MAXes don't shine like the NC does. They need their own compelling weapons to use.

That'd be method 3. To be honest I kinda forgot that HA can carry C4. The point is, there are plenty of options for dealing with MAXs, both the camping and non-camping type. Teamwork is often thrown up to support one side or the other, so I went ahead and threw it out there to get it over with.

Most of the kills I get with Scattermaxes are people who try to run up to me all alone and hose me with a carbine or LMG or something, or try to throw mines or C-4 on me when I'm looking directly at them, or come at me one at a time like they WANT me to kill them. Everytime I find myself caught out in the open with no support, I'm dead, double-time, every-time.

Amusingly enough, I have seen topics of people wanting to nerf shotguns. It's just silly, the shotguns in this game are so ineffectual compared to RL shotguns anyways, what more do people want? They can have the scattercannons and hacksaws. I'll take dual Cyclone SMGs attached to my arms, please, then we'll usher in a new era of fear of NC MAXs.

It just annoys me when I see people paint this picture of invincibility over scattermaxes, but they're expensive, flimsy, slow, weak at any range past 10m, and very vulnerable to rocket spam.

NC has the lowest DPS on weapon. ROF is what dominate CQC. Accuracy or high bullet damage is a non issue in CQC.

Considering TR/VS have higher ROF weapon in general to NC weaponry, that you admit most combat(or important fight) are within small room, the conclusion is that most NC weapon are UP.

Are you going to go in crusade of justice to buff NC weapons? I somehow doubt it.

^ 1 million times this

Yeah except a half-decent HA can actually kill a TR/VS max at their "sweet spot" somewhat easily, without even resorting to explosives, but just by simply exploiting the max's movement speed. I've had it happen to me before. Especially TR against a VS max, they can full auto spam their LMGs with pretty much no penalty at, say, 20 or 30 meters, just ADS and keep your reticle on the VS max's head while you pop your shield, then strafe in and out from behind cover. The VS max will have so much spread that most of his shots will hit the wall or just miss you. The only option for the max is to not go full auto and try bursting for the head which is easier said than done with our weapons.

A HA with, for example, the T9 Carv, can kill a max without reloading. Like I said this requires a fairly decent HA, but it can happen and the max can do little about it. To guarantee the kill you can charge to him but you're still going to end the fight with low HP. And in real situations no HA is going to just shoot you, they will mix in rockets, making this encounter even more difficult.

I don't know much about the TR max guns, but I know the VS ones have ridiculous spread that makes them unpredictable as heck and really hurts our DPS. I haven't shelled out for a dual Cosmos setup yet, this is with Quasars because I got the 2nd Quasar in the max pack a while back, figured it was a good deal but I mostly bought the pack to get the sweet composite armor. VS max definitely wins the fashion show.

Still I can pretty regularly put up stupid K/Ds in a single max life just using dual Quasars, but you have to work for it and more or less use ambush tactics which is very very counterintuitive to the max design. I should be ambushing with a LA or infiltrator, not a max.

Why would this not work on an NC Max? 20-30M is well beyond the effective range of the shotgun and would force a lengthy reload before any kill came about. In fact, that is exactly the strategy people should implement if they wish to take down an NC MAX without using rockets or explosives! In your analogy the TR/VS MAX stand a far better chance of downing the HA than a hacksaw or scatter cannon MAX would simply because their damage drop off isn't impacted at that range and their accuracy is still better than shotguns from a distance.

Because an NC max will dash, and with dual Hacksaws, kill anything 1v1 as long as you have more than 10% health. The VS and TR have nothing nearly as reliable. Their guns are hilariously inaccurate and slow firing - which is absurd given the rest of the flavor on those factions.

Yes, they can get kills. But it's not in the same class of an NC MAX in range. They need to be buffed, and the NC given some drawbacks.