Can we finally level NC to TR and VS standards?

But the Gladius spends more time firing a smaller number of rounds which are less accurate at each point in time when a round is fired.

"'Almost' weapons" has a good ring to it. Suiting, but I still don't see the Gladius as superior in any well defined niche. Even at barrel-stuffing range it doesn't kill faster than a Cyclone, or Blitz against nanoweave.

I often look at accuracy, damage and degradation, RoF, and magazine size the most, as these are what determines a weapon's baseline ability to kill. Next is attachments, recoil, velocity, and how these factor into effective ranges, then finally less important stats like reload times. If a weapon focuses more on the latter end we get EM1s, and if the former side it's SAWs for everyone with most guns somewhere in the middle. Ask me, the almost weapons are somewhere between the cracks in the floor underneath the table.

Aye, might as well come to an agreement of disagreement. Not like we're ever going to change our minds on this. But every time someone cites the Gladius as "precise/pinpoint-accurate" or "best gun the in game/NC" or "overpowered" to some extent, I'll be there every time.

At about 20-25 meters the Gladius is a 6-7 shot kill with bodyshots, making it easily the worse effective 167/143 gun in the game just due to the RoF alone. At least other guns have their RoFs to keep them closer to lethal at 20 meters.

It has two, one of which I realize you disagree with me on ( and I will respect that), that identify it as "Almost weapon" In my book.

First is it's initial damage drop profile and hip fire. Compared to every other 200 damage gun, it's got superior hip fire, and up until about 18 meters, it's got the same damage profile. To me, that signifies it as being better or equal to basically every other 200 damage gun within this range, but falling short of them for performance outside of it.

The second one is the one we have no agreement on, where some of us feel it's a superior SMG at range then most. I realize we don't all agree on this, but by that assumption, it outperforms other SMG's when range exceeds 20 meters ( which is typical SMG range). Again, this one is up for debate somewhat, so I do respect your opinion.

This is the very mentality I often take when looking at other weapons I consider to be "Almost weapons". I look for where it beats some of it's competitors, and where it beats some of it's other competitors, often by looking across weapon categories. Examples include the Jackal ( Beaten by most other SMG's up close, and most carbines or AR's at a distance, but beating Carbines and AR's up close, and SMG's at a distance), the Baron G5 ( caught between the spamming of a semi, and the slow loading of a pump, while having middle of the road damage), the MKV on release ( best suppressed SMG at the time, but often fell short to unsuppressed SMG's), and various others. Some of these " Almost weapons" become personal favorites for players, while other players shun them. I completely get it.

Again, i'm not saying you have to agree. All I am saying is what most people who stand by the Gladius see with the weapon. Granted, there are few examples of an " Almost weapon" more prominent then the Gladius, Jackal, and the MKV and NS-7 on release. Heck, the NS-7 is probably the most quintessential example. I remember that things release. Always viewed as worse then any other SMG at SMG ranges, but also always seen as better then any other SMG outside those normal ranges where it was beaten by carbines. And it's still considered a pile of trash by many, and extremely good by others.

That is the universal nature of an "Almost weapon". You either love it or hate it, and I completely respect that.

BTW, that cracks in the floor example is pretty accurate. I guess some of us just see a really, really big crack.

EDIT: Come to think of it, I think the TR has the most " Almost weapons" of any faction. Certainly the most in common use anyway. Depending on perspective, the TORQ-9, Watchmen, TRAP-M1, and jackal would all be candidates. Every DMR is basically a perfect example of an " Almost weapon".

I don't really agree. Within about 22 meters the damage values are about the same, at least enough to group them together by shots-to-kill, but the ADS accuracy is still bad enough to potentially cause misses shots, while I don't think the hipfire is good enough to actually use very often. I think at best it's comparable to the other 200/~500s in short range but even with the 22 extra RPM it's never any better than the others. Except for maybe the A-Tross, with its 469 RPM the extra 22 might be notable. But I digress.

Yes, I don't think we have any other choice at this point then to just respect each other's positions.

I do agree on almost weapons, I think you hit the nail on the head with them.

I'm inclined to defend the Watchman and TORQ-9, but then I think of the Carnage AR. Not so much after that.