It might take more than two, after spending 1000 certs for extended clips, the hacksaw can chew through a MAX and 2-3 infantry also at close range. I've taken on 2 MAXs in a 1vs2 fight and won (you can line them up so one is in the way of the other). You have to conserve charge though as the reload will get you killed if not all the enemies around you are dead as your support will NOT follow you into a charge.
It might, it might not. Planetside 2 is a team game and if you can't use teamwork to overcome your foe then there's plenty of games out there more suitable. They had to send in a whole bunch of infantry and 2 NC MAX's to dig this guy out who killed his own share of NC MAX. The Crown, most contested point on the map made look easy.
Any weapon system which can solo a team and take a huge team to counter is a problem. Fortunately the NC Max isn't quite that overbalanced (it still takes at least one Engineer to support the Max, unlike say, ESF Pilots) So in order to prove that TR Maxes are fine in comparison to NC Maxes you post a video of a BR 94 guy who holds a 15/1 K/D? Right, instills me with confidence about how the average player can do with it.
...any excuse to discredit the ability of the TR MAX - starting to get desperate when we have to provide video of average players succeeding with a specialised weapons platform for you to give even an inch. I didn't post it to show how 'fine in comparison to NC MAX', I posted it showing someone who isn't treating it like it's shotgun fodder for NC MAX and that it's a fully capable killing machine in its own right. If I had done the same thing in my NC MAX suit, I don't believe I would have survived anywhere near as long as he did or caused as much carnage.
...any excuse to downplay the OP of an NC Max. Including posting videos of tournament level players who can wipe the floor with average players in NC Max suits. Well, to that I say duh, of course tournament level players can whoop the buttocks of average players. You probably wouldn't have. But then you're not one of the top ten or so players in the entire game the way that Terrex07 is. I seriously doubt I could have pulled off 1/10th the carnage that he did in my TR Max suit either.
Had no idea who he was (still don't actually), didn't even look at the name. Just did a youtube search for TR MAX assault and picked one of the first half a dozen that actually showed some TR MAX gameplay. Though I do love that all that oppose him must be average and we can discredit the usability of the TR MAX because it can only be used by tournament players to beat up on average NC MAX players.
Checking out the name and player stats is the first thing I do when I look at a video which is purporting to show the OP/UP of a particular weapon system. When I see the guy doing the showing off is in the top 10 players I don't count what he can do as a good example of what actually gets done with the weapon. Sure, in theory, anybody can pull that off. In practice, however, there's a couple dozen guys in the game that can actually pull it off and using them as examples of what works and what doesn't for the other 200,000 players is a bass ackwards way of looking at game balance. The top results are going to be the most watched videos, which in turn are likely to be of the top players. And I expect top level players can pull off some amazing ****. Don't know for sure that they are average players, but more than likely they probably are average players because - get this - most of us are average players. This guy, however, is anything but an average player. He can probably do more with a knife than you or I can with an LMG - which doesn't prove that knives are OP. All it proves is that some people have better aim, better tactical thinking, and better luck than other people.
NC doesn't get something very important. We don't give a **** about fights beyond 10 meters as Maxes. Maxes are used in CQC when we need beefy stuff to push bunched up infantry and rarely will you have to hit from a distance. Biolabs are atm the only place where you really need Maxes and guess what ? NC Maxes dominate. Firsts things first tough, buff the VS Max then let's see what happens.
So let's see: 1 heavy assault outperforms a TR/VS MAX because he has accuracy, better range and such a high fire rate, that it's almost equivalent of having 2 AI weapons. The MAXes only advantage being that he has more HP and therefor engineers can keep him alive. 2 heavy assaults with shotguns, have the exact same firepower as a single NC MAX. BUT the NC MAX is actually better than 2 heavy assaults, because unlike them he has charge, which has perfect synergy with shotguns. This is somehow balanced because the NC MAX only works in the tight quarters indoors... OH WAIT, no it isn't, since a TR/VS MAX is just as vulnerable to tanks as a NC MAX out there. And their slow TTK at range means they'll take a pounding if people return fire when they utilize this 'extra range'. But shotguns are so situational! Well yeah, guess what else is situational: MAXes, you pull them when you need to push a point or a generator, because all the MAXes are really good at messing up infantry.. Problem is that the NC MAXes beat other MAXes to a pulp in the ideal setting for any MAX. Redesign the NC MAX in one of 3 ways (or redesign TR/VS in the following way) Greatly reduce the clip size of a NC MAX, but also reduce it's reload speed, giving them a much lower burst damage in trade for having better DPS Make the NC MAX do reduced damage to TR/VS MAXes so that they don't get instagibbed. Nerf the NC MAX down to TR/VS standards IE: They only have the effectiveness of a single shotgun when dual wielding. Or alternatively: Give TR/VS two fully functional LMGs/Carbines/Assault rifles, I honestly don't care which, but when I say fully functional I mean 'iron sight, the ability to cert into laser dot/forward grip, scopes, full fire rate and accuracy. If you get to be as effective in CQC as two heavy assaults with shotguns, we should be as capable as two heavy assaults at range. now that doesn't seem fair.. Exactly, that is how it feels fighting NC MAXes. Right now you have an ability that while nice for TR/VS is nowhere near as good as when it's used with a NC MAX, second extended magazines is the most important shotgun upgrade, it's what everyone gets for their shotguns.. Extended magazine is not nearly that important to LMGs. The strength of rapidfire weapons with big clips is utility and flexibility, yet TR/VS have a crap version of this, NC meanwhile get fully functional CQC weapons.
I don't get what you're trying to prove with the TR MAX videos. BuzzCutPsycho made a scatt MAX video, showing him killing people at the same ranges, even faster.
He laughed like a giddy schoolgirl and mocked all the NC defending the Max because of their slow reload time and short range. Buzz is pretty good though, but still it was either his first or one of his few runs as a NC Max (it was certainly his only time playing BuzzCutter).
While the white paper theory in the video is great, there isn't a max player in the history of the game that wouldn't duck back behind cover while reloading. The issue is about the high alpha and the impossibility of responding, defending against, or doing anything against it but dying.
I havent read all your posts Eric, so excuse me for the question but... What is your final opinion on the NC MAX, and what do you think devs could do for balance the things in game?
Shotguns across the board should have their pellet spread tightened and their damage and recoil reduced so that they become better weapons at greater distances and less of a binary 1-2 hit kill in close range. Right now shotguns dominate sub 10 meter and then are worthless beyond that without slugs. This adds too much randomness to the game, because if the shotgun user lucks out and fights someone point blank they automatically win, but if they get unlucky and have to fight at a slightly greater distance then they have no chance at all. Inside of a building an NC MAX completely dominates - take that NC MAX outside however, and you're lucky if you can get to the next building or cover without getting annihilated with no chance of fighting back.
if you are a MAX without cover, then you have either failed, or took the gamble of running between bases alone.
Honestly I think it's OK against infantry despite the insane TTK - it is wielding shotguns after all - but the TTK vs other Maxes is far to fast; an NC Max nearly instagibs another Max and can do very significant damage even at a a bit of range. Someone commented in one of these threads that maybe TR/VS Maxes aren't the counter to NC Maxes, to which I remarked "then what is?" because other infantry simply get smeared. Due to base layouts it is difficult to impossible to actually push a base held by NC without overwhelming numbers because your first, second, and even third wave wind up smeared by the Maxes before you can take them out. This is because the indoor bases funnel you into choke points where the NC Max absolutely dominate, and there is no viable counter besides sending in wave after wave of men. There are a lot of things they can do to address it's over effectiveness vs. Maxes without significantly affecting it's usefulness against infantry - reducing Shotgun damage against Maxes in general would be wholly appropriate - shotguns are small pellets which should be bounce off of solid armor and Maxes are nothing if not blocks of solid armor. And here, for the sake of gameplay, I don't say reduce it to 0, just reduce it a bit. Smallarms damage vs Maxes in general could also be reduced. Both of these will actually benefit NC Maxes as well. Increasing the effectiveness of Max AV weapons (esp. vs other Maxes) is absolutely necessary as Max AV weapons right now are almost completely useless and there's no reason a shotgun should be better for taking out Maxes than AV weaponry. Beyond that there are a number of other tweaks they can do to help the situation such as slightly lower the refire rate of the NC AI weapons - TTK for Infantry might go up by 0.1 sec, but because it takes so many more shots to down a Max the gain there may be as much as 1 sec. There's probably a million other tweaks that can be done to make it so it isn't instagib city.
Actually if you play inside, you can only use one arm at time, and sustain fire. Unfortunatly, if you are outside and using slugs, you must use both arms, and you cant sustain fire. And outside, there is no cover to hide...
Then you're not playing the NC Max correctly. NC Maxes are indoor or trench weapons and thrive where there is cover. If you left cover to try to chase someone down across a field then you deserve to die. Believe it or not this is true for TR and VS Maxes as well. While longer ranged than NC Maxes all Max AI weapons are rated as "Close" range, and their combination of accuracy, CoF, lack of sights, and other stats means that in an open field at ranges beyond ~50m other Infantry stand a better than even chance of killing the Max before it can kill them unless it can close the range.
So, we share the same opinion. I really think they should buff MAX resistance vs small weapon, it is a necessity.
