[NUC] elusive1: Unleashed

How exactly would he prove that though? If he's not cheating then, voila, the video is his evidence. Any video or anything he'd put up after this would just be met with claims he got caught and became a more subtle cheater. Meanwhile, the accusers haven't proved a single thing, so how about you do that before telling him to jump through hoops to prove his innocence...

He clearly isn't your normal player. The guy has spent a lot of time specialising on a narrow set of classes. Most planetmans are more concerned with Skinner box rewards and other shiny objects so dilute their play time and expertise over a wide range of classes/weapons/vehicles. I mean, getting a purple medal is not an example of skill but persistence.

Like the legendary Bruce Lee said, "I fear not the man who has trained 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has trained one kick 10,000." So why would, or should, you expect him to act like someone who is happy to go "yay, purple medal!" and never touch the weapon again versus someone who has around 35,000 kills with that one weapon? (and he probably has more characters than his TR).

So imma go and assume innocence until proven otherwise.

O people are really that stupid m8.


Im not hackusing anyone!

Lol @ the girl who blames this poor Clara person. xD

I'm responding to his argument with my own, not much more you could ask of someone! If he or others don't agree the arguments still stand.

Ask Demigan.

I'm telling you why the video doesn't make sense and why your statements don't align with what one would expect to see in a recording of legitimate gameplay. You on the other hand are just trying to defame me because I called you out.

I've already stated the clips from your twitch would be irrelevant. They could contain cheating or not, it doesn't change what is in the video.

You yourself say you have "potato aim" and that your aim isn't always perfect. So why is it so perfect and so consistent in the video Mr. Potatohead?

This is the internet, idiot. Respect is earned, not given. Don't expect to be treated like royalty just because you exist.

The video can only suggest he's not cheating, just as it can only suggest that he is. If you or I were to record our own raw gameplay and upload it to these forums the videos wouldn't necessarily prove anything about ourselves either, merely what we might be.

The accusations are backed up with reasoning and logic but again there is not enough evidence to definitely say whether or not there is cheating going on in the video or not. To try to distill what I'm trying to say into one sentence, it's just not possible for anyone to objectively prove his legitimacy or not.

There are enough inconsistencies to suggest something is wrong here but we haven't seen him pull up any cheating software mid-game. Regardless, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

If a cyclist spent five years of his life doing nothing but riding a bike, one would expect him to be good at it. But if he spent those five years with training wheels, he'd fall over without them. 35K kills doesn't mean anything when they could have all come from extra help.

As I said previously it seems strange that he even bothers to drag his shots with a rifle which has no scope sway. This is just less efficient than aiming directly at the head in the first place as one can do fairly easily. Granted, the rifles used to have sway, but not for a very long time. This does not suggest to me someone has been clipping heads for years on end.

You are obviously free to assume so, but given the impossibility of proof for either outcome it matters just as much as mine and others' damnation of him. There are no consequences to our judgement here, there is no justice.

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me this statement is untrue. I have >1000hrs in this game and I drag-scope people all the time. It would not be out of the question for others to, as well. It is the easiest way for me to hit skittish targets.

Drag shooting has nothing to do with scope sway. While it is possible to zoom in exactly on someone's head in the first place, practically speaking it isn't common to do so. In most cases you get "close enough" that only minute corrections are required to place the crosshair over the target's head and shoot. This comes across visually as flicking the scope across the target and shooting at just the right moment.

what is it a drag shot anyway ?

I don't really see the need for it. The low-zoom bolts don't have sway or recoil and ideally the user won't be dealing with screenshot either. Personally I don't ever bother with wasting time aiming away from my target with whatever gun I've got. It's just plain faster and easier.

You're the actual articulate idiot who doesn't understand what a montage is. That not missing in streaks means I never miss a bunch of shots in a row. That you could see that happen many times throughout my vods if you're lazy *** would bother. Demigan also hasn't posted his response to the guy who showed a concrete in game explanation of his "proof" yet. Yeah the scope sway ******* lul I'm not responding to your dumbness anymore.

A synopsis thus far.
"Hey guys heres a montage of killshots made up from my streams"
"Hmm looks like aimbot/hacks/hitmarkers look odd"
"Its not because reasons"
"It is because reasons"

Much of the reasoning has been questionable. For me, Kane put it best around page 4 or 5.
Because Kane might well show he's hacking. Or not.
Speculatively speaking of course.

Don't worry about actually discussing the individual points or anything, you've got petty insults, sure showed me huh?

You pull the cross hair from one side of the screeen onto your opponents head

Let's summarize:

Player A posts a montage showing skills above average

PlayerB (average vet Joe Doe) thinks "I am good, but A is better. It can't be, so CLEARLY he is CHEATING!!! Lazy ****** I will make him pay dearly, he shamed me!!! "

Player B prepares meticolously his "revenge" on the supposed cheater by showing frames and producing wall texts ridden with "proofs". Sadly those "proofs" are vague theories about a complex multiplayer game formulated without knowing its internals and without having written a single line of software code in any known programming language.

Those "proofs" despite the wall texts do not prove anything.

Player B falls back then to another stance and produces wall texts concluding that "it is not possible to prove A is a cheater but it is not possible to prove that A is NOT a cheater. Aha! I win anyway" .. ignoring the fundamental principle of justice common to every country in the world "people are INNOCENT until proven otherwise.".

Welcome to internet.

Thanks! Why should i do something like this ?

Bold text; If you go by the first notion you must accept that the outcomes are not either or but an infinite other explanations. It be easier to just say, "I don't know." I don't see any evidence he is cheating and similarly cannot definitely say he isn't. However, if we go down that road then everyone is a cheater or should be treated as such. Perhaps not a blatant one but a scary out of sight subtle cheater. Might not cheat all the time either, no no, he's probably got a switch, yes yes yes, dirty stinkin' cheaters.

Standard text; Constantly going in and out of scope would feel very unnatural, be disorienting, and actually take longer to acquire targets.

When you break it down a drag shot really isn't any different from how he otherwise behaves, it is just more reflex/muscle memory + it is very useful when you are already in scope and has to react a new threat quickly such as an enemy pops out of window A instead of window B or any other unexpected places. Also, the sway doesn't come into play as much (especially at these distances) and it is something you're used to dealing with anyways.

Search for "drag shots in FPS" on YT. Some of the tutorials are 8 years old. This isn't new and strange behaviour. That's probably one of reasons Elusive1 has lost it with you guys, not only do you ask him disprove something you cannot even prove, but also force him to educate you on FPS fundamentals while being dismissive of anything he has to say.

Quoted myself because I just mentioned it in a previous post.

It is by its barest form a trained muscle movement to make extremely fast shots. This is one of the many many reasons high end gamers tend to favour one mouse + their own config file over anything else. Some can easily adapt and feel their way into new things but most of us are creatures of habit + there are times when new hardware can replace the old.

Search for the term "drag shot in FPS" on YT and you'll get a better answer (and also learn how to do it!).

You're misunderstanding, it isn't done because of sway or recoil or because it looks cool. If you could always zoom in exactly on target every time then it would be faster. The problem is that usually you aren't exactly on target when you zoom in, and most of the time you're off by quite a ways. Dragging the scope quickly to compensate for your minute imperfections in aiming is simply the quickest way to get back on target.

Its normal aiming and shooting that most people do.
For some reason a label has been given to it here to make it sound super skillful and uber cool.

Haha think the others explained it well enough xD

It is a fallacy to simply degrade an opponent's position down to "he's better than me therefore he's cheating." Plently of other players upload montages of awesome moments and yet they are never called out. The video in the OP is full of inconsistencies which whether caused by technological fault or merit cannot be known with 100% confidence. You and I cannot prove anything. You cannot deny that.

Firstly, this is a public forum about a videogame, not a court of law. There are no legal or financial repercussions for the accused if proved guilty, and so there is no need for a "protection by the state" clause such as "innocent until proven guilty." At worst if proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the defendant is guilty the sole consequences are that of a social nature only.

And secondly, this is probably a rather controversial opinion, but I personally support reasonable cause over the assumption of innocence. In the majority of court cases things are so cut-and-dry, open-and-shut that the court just wastes everyone's time and money and delays the application of justice.

Here's an example of a local case which happened a good few years ago: A man and his business partner got into a disagreement over the design of an oil pump and the money which was involved. (It wasn't very much). Eventually things escalated and the man broke into the home of and murdered his elderly partner and the old man's wife and young grandson. There as a stupid amount of evidence involved, but here's the three most fun bits:

• The suspect had a flash drive containing a detailed plan of the murder
• The suspect had a detailed documentation, photographs and research on the exact lock used by the victims and how to pick or destroy the lock (who even does that?)
• The suspect's land was searched and human remains later confirmed by DNA testing to be bone fragments pertaining to each of the three victims was found in some ash in a firepit

The trial was occurred about two years after the initial disappearance of the the elderly couple and their grandson. Surprise, surprise, the suspect was found to be guilty on three counts of first-degree murder after a month-long trial.

There was absolutely no reason for the man to be protected by the state, there was no conflicting or contending evidence, no other suspects, no alibi, no reason at all to even remote assume his innocence.

Bit of an unrelated tangent, but it's not like this thread's going anywhere anyway.

I don't know, but I do see evidence to suggest he's cheating.

It would, but he's not using a high-powered scope, just a regular sight. But why wouldn't he be not aiming and going out of ADS all the time? He even does so in the video, so I'm not sure what you mean. These sights don't have sway anymore, haven't for years.

I understand why drag-shooting is and how to do it, I just don't see any need or practicality in it.

Elusive has "lost it" because he doesn't want people challenging his ego. He's not "educating" anyone on anything, we're all just arguing why the phenomenon in the video indicated what. He refuses to even acknowledge his opponent's arguments and falls into the same old trap we all see all the time: He cannot grasp the idea that he doesn't know everything and that others may know something he doesn't. By refusing to see an argument as valid or legitimate, he's tricked himself into believing the opposition doesn't understand the game we've been playing just as long as he has.

Hehe, sorry, *screenshake, not screenshot.

I really don't have this issue at all, but even if a player zooms close to the head but is a very small distance off, wouldn't it still be faster to correctly align the sights for a mm away than an entire torso length away?

But regardless I still maintain it's not very hard at all to get used to pointing right at the head prior to ADSing.

I caught your drift, no worries.

My most commonly used optic is 8x. I use it pretty much everywhere no matter the distance. Consequently my "small distance off" tends to be rather further away than most. If I ever use the CQB guns my habits carry over. As pnkdth pointed out above, consistency is important.

Personally I think it's faster to get zoomed in quickly and adjust where the sensitivity is lower. Different strokes for different folks, I guess. At any rate my only point was that drag-shots aren't uncommon even with significant time invested into the game.