I dont wanna be the one to bust your bubble here, but that is NOT amazing DPS. Ive raided with a Brigand that could put up numbers like. While its is true that some rangers will post much better numbers then other rangers. It cant be said that 1.2-1.4 is amazing dps. And let me say this before I go. It pisses me off when I go all out and I still lose to a brigand!
1. I've not seen anyone asking to be #1 DPs on every single fight. Nor have I seen any rangers complaining that we cannot do our pre-LU20 DPS. If that's all you see in this entire forum, I strongly suspect that you either haven't read much of it or you're just bandwagoning. 2. We're fine, eh? What evidence do you have that brings you to this conclusion--do you play a tier 7 ranger? Have you used and compared our T7 CAs (like Hawk Dive, for example) to the abilities of other classes? Have you tried using Stream of Arrows recently? Have you, as a ranger, gone all out on encounter after encounter--only to be out-DPSed by classes that bring stuff other than just DPS to the raid? You are certainly entitled to your opinion. But until you have direct experience, it's not a particularly informed opinion. Of the informed opinions I've seen, the vast majority agree that there are issues with rangers that need to be addressed. If, of course, you DO have the direct experience, then you're welcome to join the minority that think we're totally "fine". Message Edited by Tarryn on 08-18-2006 11:18 PM
Before EQ2 i was playing this MMORPG called priston tale. I played a pladin. There was a archer a healer and a mage also and other classes. As a paladin i could allways out dps that archer. But i allways wanted to play that archer. why? He just set back and did the dps while i had to tank and die a lot. If the mob broke lose he would just run fast to zone. I am not saying that EQ2 is completely equal to other games but what i am saying is that Having a Ranger do as much amount of dmg as Assasin or wizard does not make sense!! And i honestly belive that if a Ranger gets into a sweet spot than he can allways out dps Rogues.
Cept in this game, inorder to do the most dps you can do as a ranger. You cannot just stand back and shoot, you need to stand in melee CA ranger of the mob as well as range CA.. You cant just sitback and shoot.. And, in this game palys heal, ward, tank, and buff.. Rangers do damage, that is all. Please do not compare eq2 to other games if I wanted to go play crimson tale, I would go play crimson tale.. Since im playing EQ2, im am going to comment on EQ2.. And please do not comment on the ranger state if you are on false assumptions. And if you do post and are corrected, make changes to future statements.
Conj's tank pet has 12k hp, 30% mit, 30% avoid. And can have dps/haste buffs/procs from the owner. Raid equipped ranger has 7k hp, 45%ish mitigation, 40% avoidance. Conj can also root the mob and summon another pet(although there root does suck). Hell, even conj's outdamage ranger top end.
Why, in your mind, does it not make sense to have a ranger doing as much dps as an assassin (who is nothing more then our evil half) or a wizzy? And please dont use the arguement that we get to stay ranged and out of the way of AEs, cause any good ranger will tell you thats one quickest ways to lose 200-300 dps, not to mention that brigands have an AE immunity (cept when direct). This "Out of AE range" garbage doesnt hold water, because any good raid ranger isnt going to stand a max distance and mash a few buttons. We are going to joust in and out as our CAs refresh. Next up. Please tell me what you base this statement on. Because I can assure you, that if both the ranger, and the rogue knows what they are doing, the difference in dps is going to be marginal at best. Id venture to say that it might even be a 50/50 split depending on whos CAs are up when. So the question becomes, and I hate to keep rehashing this, but here goes "If a rogue can DPS as well as a ranger, and bring all that utility... WHY bring the ranger? (unless its to fill an empty spot) Something has to seperate us from rogues to make us viable on a raid. That something, should be the same thing that every other DPS class brings... If a class brings nothing to the table but DPS, they [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] well better be able to put up some serious numbers. I'll tell you right now 1.2-1.4 isnt it cause thats rogue dps. Get rangers into the 1.5-1.8 range and these DPS threads will die out.
just thought i would laugh at this seriously misinformed post :] I dont know any time that an assassin can drop a mob that isnt a \/ or maybe green/very weak to redline from ranged.if we get a positional ranged attack we can get 2 attacks off before the mob hits us, otherwise we are stuck with just one. as soon as you hit a mob it faces you, so you only get 1 positional off. I dont know anyone who can actually get all their stealth attacks off using concealment (which is 10 seconds, not 7) added to the incredible lag you get with concealment (especially on raids) which sometimes means you dont get any attacks off at all, as the server doesnt register you as being stealthed until most of the timer is up, and then maybe the mob has turned, or there is a new target.... On topic of brigands outdpsing rangers.. equal skill and equipment, as well as being in the right group and this shouldnt really happen.. Brig's do nice dps tho
You seem to be a little slow, so Im going to try and explain this to you Nirav. First off, if I have a repair bill in the 50+ gold mark, so does everyone else in the raid. Though I dont know how this equates to why a ranger shouldnt be on par with an assassin. But since you want to talk about the finacial aspect of being a ranger (and where you think rangers get off on repair bills is so far off the mark its a joke) but Im sure you've seen more then one thread about how much it costs a raiding ranger on a nightly basis. I wont even count the poisons, just because all preds and rouges can use them. So that leaves us with arrows. Yeah we can summon 60 arrows every 10 mins at M1. However, more often then not, rangers have to fork over hard earned cash for more arrows. I could be wrong here, but I believe even cheap vendor arrows cost about 6g a stack. You know how long 99 arrows stays in a rangers quiver? 1 trash fight, 2 if you're lucky. A ranger can easily burn through that whole quiver (what 22 stacks of 99?!?) in one zone. If all the arrows were purchased, you are looking at over 1plat for a full quiver. So you want to talk to me about a repair bill? get real. Second, you must have misunderstood what I said. If all the combat arts for both the brigand and the ranger are up, then the difference is going to be very very slim at best, and could swing either way. However, how many times have you gone on a raid and told the Tank, or the Raid Leader to wait til all your combat arts have refreshed? Thus making things situational. But its very clear that you dont have a clear understanding of how rangers operate, and have even less of an understanding on what its like to raid. Until you can come up with some real reasons that actually make sense as to why rangers shouldnt be on par with assassins. Keep your trap shut! Message Edited by TerriBlades on 08-19-2006 08:58 PM
Playstyle preference...as it should be. Neither class should be clearly better than the other, it should be just a question of preference. When the only thing each brings to the table is damage, for one to do significantly more damage than the other is unbalanced.
If you are going to highlight my posts please explain your reasoning and what point you are trying to get at.. And.. OHHHH THE COLOURS!.
I highlighted because i already mentinoed sweet spot and you said that the ranger has to stay in both melee and bow range. And i already said that i am not saying EQ2 is like everyother games. But every MMORPG have something in common. Hence the name of the Genre Message Edited by nirav21 on 08-20-2006 12:25 PM
Then go post something like.. "I like the way rangers were in this game, and would like to see changes that would benifit the class - yada yada" The way you are going about this is flawed and your going to continue to get pounced on.. If I wanted to play a hunter in wow - id accept less dps because of util, if I wanted a game compleatly based on itemization, id play eq1, if I wanted a game where rangers were top dps and had to pay a huge price id play final fantasy online, if I wanted to play a game where archers were top dps in the end game id play maple story.. - But im playing EQ2, dont try and bring drizzt, legolas, what have you into a ranger combat discussion. If you enjoy seeing rangers a certain way in a diffrent game with diffrent structure.. THEN GO PLAY THAT GAME. The reason we have this discussion in the first place is because of the STRUCTURE this game provides and it is because of that structure we can debate, call out underpowered etc.. Btw - Morts in a really bad mood today, my posts will lighten up later on.
It looks like you dont want to play the Ranger as it is in EQ2. So maybe it is you that should go play other games.
Then you don't know any good assassins. Every assassin I know gets off almost every BS. On average I get Killing Blade, Eviscerate, Jugular, Cloaked Assault, and Slaughtersault, and even have time for one more BS most the time. Sometimes I won't get off Slaughtersault (leave that for the end since its longer castin time). Let me add up all that damage 1 Concealment can do, which also lowers aggro by 40% at Master 1. Killing Blade: 4K - 7K listed damage, and can crit to 13K Eviscerate: 2K - 3K listed dmg, and can crit to 6K Jugular: 1300 - 2K listed dmg, and can crit to 5K Cloaked Assault: AE CA, 700-1200 listed dmg, plus a 214 point dot. AE can crit up to 3K and dot at 350. Slaughtersault: 1200 - 3K dmg. AE CA. Can crit to 5K. So adding all those up: 9200 - 32000(all crits) every min basically, and time that with a brigands dispatch (1 min timer also), and you are more likely to hit towards the high end of all those skills. So where in the ranger's arsenal is any skill that can compare to that?
Aim line- SniperShot 13kdmg crit Rain of Arrows hits mob of 5 doing 7k dmg each 13K+5*7k = 48,000 dmg in 10sec Message Edited by nirav21 on 08-20-2006 03:32 PM
assassins is more usefull, hitting mainly one mob...doing most of (ranger) your damage on the other mobs in the group isnt gonna help kill the current target any faster, specially since the incombat regen of the epics will easy replenish the rains damage ps. and it looks like the assassin added all his damage up as if it was against ONE target......rangers need 5 in order to compare?..... Message Edited by Drainlock on 08-20-2006 12:43 PM
