New players - pick a knight if you aren't a boxer

Discussion in 'Tanks' started by Time Burner 2, Feb 18, 2016.

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  1. Flatchy Court Jester

    What you put in the "Bad" category, as seen by you, a warrior? I demand a knight run recount! There must have been a MISTAKE!
  2. Kobrah Augur

    You're looking for someone suggesting adding dp to knights. I don't think that was ever really the case ... the easiest thing for dbg to do without putting in effort .. was to add it to knights ... whether you're happy or not no matter what class you play, this is probably the reality of it. But they have more time now to come up with new things for each class ... even wars ... allowing them to be ahead again. You probably wont be perma 30% mod ahead but .. maybe new tools etc?
  3. Makavien Augur

    Actually I suggested it in that thread the difference being I suggested 15% mitigation DP with hate mods to lifetaps and stuns. Which would of balanced us out along with that flash ability I also suggested they needed.

    And I doubt it with a knight sympathetic developer who supposedly still raids as a shadowknight. Who also nerfed us 4 times since he has taken over and broken our best hate tool (completely in the group game).
    Kamea likes this.
  4. Phrovo1 Augur

    so a majority of Mistatk's posts?
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  5. Kobrah Augur

    I was thinking more around 25% or at lowest 20% dp might be a fair trade to knights. I don't know SKs since I have always preferred paladin but I know paladin discs have a lower threshold of damage when compared to war absorbtion discs that do stack with dp. As far as briefly looking over warrior skills I would much prefer a warrior vs my paladin to tank a raid boss mob even after dp. The higher thresholds and higher % of mitigation on warriors skills is what I thought balanced things in group game.. Knights need to supplement healer heals with taps / self heals .. heal mods .. while warriors are fully capable of tanking the same situations without any mods due to absorbing / mitigating more damage than the other tanks.

    The basis of this thread just seems like " If I'm not the only tanking option, then there needs to be nerfs." You may point fingers at this skill or that skill but there must be a point where you look at your own skills and say .. "ok, I make up for that with this and that and so on. I usually RECEIVE paladin spire and group armor when it's available when I am tanking" if raiding is going to be your focus.
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  6. Battleaxe Augur

    "....while warriors are fully capable of tanking the same situations without any mods due to absorbing / mitigating more damage than the other tanks."
    The fairly distant era of knight soloing/moloing superiority showed that this is not the case. If knights can complain that combat self-healing is not mitigation (and it isn't when a mob could ONE round you.), then Warriors can equally complain that mitigation is not an increase if HP's in your health bar - it's just a rate of hemorrhaging HP's reduction. I'm sure you realize a Warrior's mitigation and/or maximum HP's would have to be astronomical in order to solo mobs a Paladin solo's easily. Lessee, I regen X HPs/tick and each hit costs me Y HP's.

    While mercs certainly helped Warriors solo, we don't get mercs in instanced raids and mercs do take up a player slot Sir 2, 2, 2 Toons-In-1. Less reliance on others, the ability to participate in bumping one's own HP bar (to say nothing of healing others and curing) - pretty sweet.

    "You may point fingers at this skill or that skill but there must be a point where you look at your own skills and say ..."

    "Hold still Cadderly. Bind Wound incoming."
    "Let me die, I pulled half of the room."

    Inevitably those who chose a fighter AND clerical or necromantic abilities will claim that only their fighter abilities count. I order the 20 oz. sirloin. You order the Surf n' Turf and promptly complain that you got less steak.

    (In group content there is tank parity (and knight spellbook superiority)
    Raids are no longer 1 MT in the corner. There are plenty of tanking (and utility) opportunities for classes that can not and should not match the unmatched ability to survive the most brutal battles Class Defining characteristic of Warriors.)
  7. Warpeace Augur

    After almost a day this thread was heading where it belonged finally riding off into the sunset of Cry me a river then look it started back up.

    Really goes along way setting the mind set of several of you Warriors here crying you lost your advantage of full time 30% mitigation.

    Boo hoo that SK dev guy hates us. I don't think that's going to work or get sympathy from Daybreak. Maybe a few laughs. If that's your real belief how about you all start a thread and straight call him on it. Nope you are here complaining item by item trying to get knights nerfed.
  8. Brohg Augur

    Warpeace to the rescue, correcting that shitpost imbalance one ray of sunshine at a time
  9. Kamea Augur

    Funny thing is, even with a 15% DP + 5% innate (I assume they get to keep that too?), and assuming broken absorb/vie disc stacking stays in place with current tuning, this would still be the biggest 1-expansion upgrade to a class, since I've been raiding.

    This is why it's better from a game design standpoint to underball v1.0, then buff later on. If you dramatically highball v1.0, even the so-called nerf will still be OP.

    My problem is that knights pretend that devs gave them nothing -before stance- to deal with mob damage boosts. 3 discs with very high uptime is something. And the stacking of Mantle & Armor/Carapace with DP is completely broken.

    If it were up to me, Guardian (mitigation) would be buffed to 40% (since the 6% benefit over DP is small for this disc's tuning) and the damage penalty removed, and Mantle would be nerfed to 15% (but get the same AC boost as Armor/Carapace) and Armor/Carapace would be nerfed to 10% (yes, purposefully so it doesn't give an absorb/vie benefit over shining.) Funny thing is, if a knight reads this he'll probably think that's an extreme nerf proposal, but in reality even with those low %'s it's still a dramatic upgrade with DP stacking (even if DP is lowered.) The focus on those discs in a post-DP world should be the secondary attributes, and the AC mod on these is a lot more powerful than knights pretend it is.
  10. Mistatk Augur

    I for one don't think this topic is likely to die any time soon, the change to the game is too major and glaring. If this thread ends, people who haven't yet realized what happened will start their own threads as they do the math. I personally would feel bad for knights if they now repealed this partly, and I know the developers aren't going to put any time into fixing warriors broken abilities, so seems there won't be any good end to this change. It will most likely stay how it is, giving knights a huge advantage over warriors, which is bad. Or it will get nerfed, which is bad. Doing something like this with out properly testing it out and thinking it through was quite detrimental to the game, and unless it is the developers objective to kill off EQ in hopes of pushing subscribers to other DBG products, hopefuly they take a better approach in the future.
  11. Warpeace Augur

    Oh look Brohg to the rescue, correcting that ****post imbalance one ray of sunshine at a time.

    SO your point is well taken that you have nothing to say and are just but hurt with the changes, got it.
  12. Makavien Augur

    With the 5% aa and or the 15% boost to self healing I suggested back near the beginning of this thread 15% would end up being pretty substantial and just look at the response.

    The funny thing is you really don't think I called him on it in pms ?

    Are you scared they are going to listen ?
  13. Ghubuk Augur

    I have no idea where you think 15 percent boost to taps will anywhere near match 15 percent mitigation.
    Xanathol likes this.
  14. Makavien Augur

    Well maybe instead of the type of responses were getting why not suggest what would = 15% mitigation ?
  15. Ghubuk Augur

    Maybe the devs already know and that is why they put dp where it is at?
  16. Makavien Augur

    Nope because it was given to us after 3 years of internal testing to balance us with self healing. It was just copy and pasted without any thought into making it paladin or sk specific.Or with any thinking of the stacking unless you believe 70% mitigation was intentional? 20% higher then the best warrior discipline?
  17. Ghubuk Augur

    You do realize that our disciplines and aa's do not give nearly same effect as warriors?
  18. Ravengloome Augur

    15% mitigation is the only thing that would equal the effect. You could boost heal 150% and on the content DP helps us on the change would be marginal since ww are locked into a specific amount of heals we can cast per minute.

    Also my average self heal (what it actually healed for) was around 15k last time I bothered to check parses. I can hit that with group gear focii.

    Now if you want to talk about giving us AA heal options or disc heal options to use during GCD that are instant, you can maybe make a good point, but that's going to make some odd balancing raid v group.

    Most of the times we were having issues was being locked out of casting heals, interrupts, silences, or just not being able to land them (paladin VD and Admonish have ultra low resist mods)
  19. sojero One hit wonder

    You do realize it is not 70%, because of the way the effects are taking off the damage its one at a time, so DP takes the part off of the DI portion then mantle takes off the whole that is left over. Someone else had dont the actual testing and determined it was 52% about the same as warrior LS + SB. Carry on.
    Xanathol likes this.
  20. Seldom Augur

    /yawn That Warrior logic still going. If Mantle wasn't intended to stack with Shielding Profiency, then Dichotomic Shielding wasn't intended to stack with Last Stand or Shielding Profiency. Also, to purposely recommend for Armor disc line to be nerfed to 10% vie, shows further lack of logic. Yes, let's make disc Vie, less than a classes castable spell vie. That will balance things! Recap of thread: A handful of Warriors whining to nerf Knights because they no longer hold absurd levels of mitigation advantage over them.
    Xanathol likes this.
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