If I could ask the Devs one question...

His subconscious went right to Vodka.... Which just like me is cheap but effective

Overuse of knockback I suspect is their boxing "Fix"

The complexity thing is sad to hear. It's a direction I haven't been overly fond of myself and will likely end the game for me at some point. To be honest I think more of your long term players play to relax over anything else. I could be wrong though. More and more complexity does not aid in such relaxation and sure you will get a vocal minority cry about easy buttons etc but that doesn't make it untrue.

You said exactly what I was thinking. I actually pondered to myself after reading this if I would continue to buy expansions past ROS if the mechanics moving forward are going to be such that I am going to have to make different hotbars for all of my toons for different mobs. I already have a couple setup for various encounters and such which is fine since I know in advance that I will only be using that hotbar setup for that specific zone or encounter. If the mechanics get to the point where I am micro managing my hotbars more than I am playing that will be the end for me most likely or at least the end of moving forward.

Hopefully my post didn't imply that I believe content is designed to support the programs; precisely the opposite - I was attempting to not-so-slyly suggest what you stated: that the game is in some ways influenced/designed to stymie the third-party programs and/or the people using them (which I feel has negative connotations for the player base at-large, as some later comments in the thread echo, re: complexity and difficulty).

Thank you for the reply!

At this point, I don't get why DB doesn't embrace elements of the third party stuff and make it a feature/selling point. There is not alot of oomph in eq these days, and most the naughty things that third party brings is standard in newer games.

*shrug*

I must admit Im not in favor of thirdparty programs at all(Im like Qbert, I like my immersion too), but it is my impression that they really aren't needed in modern raids anyway.

Finding a guild that allows you to play without them can be tricky though, but there are some guilds that allow their members to play in their own style as long as they perform well.

I actually like complex raids that aren't relying too much on audiotriggers(yes ingame AT's work fine!).

Vault is my favorite EoK-raid for example. Stay away from the guardian, keep mana between 30% and 70%, are concepts that adds complexity to a fight, while still feeling like it is your character that has to react to the world around him, and not the player that has to react to the UI!

Thats good immersion!

And expect that there will be differences in raids. Some raids Will be "simpler" while some will be "complex". I use quotes because it is all relative. Some simple may be complex, while some complex, may not be very intricate and is simpler than X raid.

Funny, I hate having to get mana between 30 and 70 percent. I actually have to remove almost all my armor and put it back on to drop my mana below 71% unless I had died.

That does not strike me as a fun raid. "Hey, you have to strip nude in order to kill this guy"

A quick run through the boss aura before he changes form is usually all it takes. If not load up your Alliance spell and cast it on some unsuspecting silk wearers...

Well, my point was just as much, that they made a raid that wasn't just "when your AT goes goes ping, run to spot A". Having to keep you distance to the guardian based on visual cues alone was a nice change.

There are many ways to add complexity, that aren't UI-driven, or affected by thirdparty-tools at all.

I guess the mana requirement affect different classes differently, for me its all about mana efficiency at that event.
Even though my froglok-wizard would look absolutely fabulously, when naked!

They can make emotes that audio triggers don't work on. Just don't give a text message of any sort, and only report it via an overlay emote. Would make raids more interesting or make it clear who needs to be culled.

Just cast a few dots. I hear druid dots are OP for dropping mana quick.

It might depend on what class you're playing but you don't need 3rd party programs in EoK or RoS if you're a caster. Everything you have to respond to is really obvious with the auras and event messages. Even the in-game audio triggers aren't needed. They're nice if you just want to be lazy or have ADD or something. (which I think is 70% of EQ players)

tsk .. tsk ... oops forgot what I was going to post.

I am less concerned with raids then with these mechanics making their way down to the group game. Players who didn't want complexity could play the group game but we keep seeing complexity filtering down to the group game these days. Group missions should not play like mini raids.

You have an aging game population with very little "fresh blood". Even those of us who started in their teens are now in or approaching their forties and many of us were much older when we started playing. I am 56. Many of my players in my guild are mid forties and older.... I am no where close to be the oldest of the players in my guild.

This is why you need to rethink some mechanics in the group game like the skyfire drakes etc. You really really need to know your player base outside of the raiders who test your raids each expansion. They are two totally different set of players. The group game shouldn't require complex strats or doing things perfectly to get through a mission.

You really need to bring this point through to the other Devs please. I want to keep playing EQ and I want my friends in game to keep playing. It really isn't rocket science to develop group content. The challenge there should just be basic fighting not mechanics to any large degree. And lets face it. more of the accounts being played are probably boxes then actual players. Making things box friend makes sense.

You would do better to encourage box accounts to be subscribed accounts though some sort of carrot (not stick) approach).

You need to understand that players like AlmarGuides speak about how Daybreak openly supports third party programs in the forums see the thread buffbots. He also has guides on his site for the use of said programs and claims he asked daybreak if he should take them down and granted he took no response as approval but there you go. When players are opening saying Daybreak is ok with this software on Daybreak forums and no action is taken what are people to think?

If you read the boards and the EULA the party line is pretty much:
At the keyboard
Not circumventing game mechanics

There are a lot of EQ crusaders that think otherwise.
No action taken outside of this does mean endorsement, it just means they are not enforcing it the way “you” think they shoul

Yeah the problem being they may be at the keyboard AND circumventing game mechanics. Otherwise they would just be using ISPugilist.

Kinda of like a lie of omission is still a lie?