Tank cleanses - Make tanks viable in PvP again

This happens much more than the Devs would believe. Unless they are only doing Arenas at the low level PUGs.

I am a healer now... I know that if you don't have these serums... You're not considered a great healer no matter how well your skills are. It's kind of ridiculous.

This is one of the first threads I've seen on these forums with nearly everyone agreeing...

I just want to know: Will Tanks ever live up to their PvP description? If not, can we please have it removed, because nearly 2/3 of the description is false and/or semi-true:
Player versus Player:

While in the Tank role, you have a special advantage versus Gadgets, Light, and Mental power users. You are immune to their debuffing effects and highly resistant to their controls. Some abilities provide you and allies total immunity to controller effects. Attacking them may inspire Confidence within you, briefly increasing your damage by 55%.

apparently highly resistant was put in as very subjective, i am stuned / encased / terror / panic whatever just as much as any other role

Exactly...sometimes even after I use an immunity power I still get controlled, that is why I said semi-true because it doesn't happen all the time
I have been noticing also lately, that when I am debuffed my a Mental Controller, just using a power doesn't seem to remove it...I actually have to use a cleanse power or trinket to remove it...I know it wasn't a Healer debuff because the debuff is removed with a cleanse power

a great idea would be to have the cleanse cause the enemies to re-target on the tank. debuff syrums really need to go...all debuff syrums do is reward the players that used the money glitch and therefore have billions in the bank to buy exos. the honest players cant compete with the ability to spam debuff grenades and syrums. at the very least give them a LOOONG cooldown. and while your at it please fix the broken rps combat system. it fails to work correctly so often that i feel its based on a random number generator. if it is luck based (as it seems lately) then why did you bother nerfing our crits?

i dont know if you have noticed...but innate control resistance has gone strait down the tubes. i think they broke control resistance when they nerfed the orbital strikes' ability to control un-controlable npcs (made prime a real hoot if you ask me lol)

ok having targets locked would be going way too far. just make the cleanse distract the target to the tank...that gives healers and trollers ect. to get away from their attackers. a 6 second lock is nearly long enough to wipe a team out useing sc, orbital, henchmen, ect.

trollers arent the problem. tanks are very effective against them. i do think that tanks need a shorter cooldown on the cleans. fighting the arc in t4 inner proves this point perfectly.

im a troll/dps but i would be ok with tanks acting as a QUICK distract to the enemy team. make it hold everyones target for 0.1 seconds. they will find their finisher focused on the tank for a slit second requiring them to re-direct to the intended target. if it was this way then no self respecting pvp team would be tankless

I wasn't taking into account the myriad of extra things besides players that would be in a match. I was just using my experience as a tank in many a mmo. We should have a power that taunts targets. It's a staple.

I'm Nodens, and I endorse this thread.
+1

I don't know if Korrupt plays all that much lately, but being around the same group of PVPers on the USPC I can state that most top level healers can burn through 2-3 stacks of serums in a competitive 5's match. A few (like myself) only use a few up to 1 stack. A common "battery" troller strategy is to use debuff grenades over their powers so they use power to keep teammates blue bar full while still being able to debuff.

At competitive levels serums can get out of hand. Players lean pretty heavy on something that was meant to supplement a missing role instead of replace it (like is happening now.) Tanks have little to bring to the table as their cleanses are mere shadows of what spamming serums can do during a match. While I'm certain most of the players out there do not do this (so data may be skewed) the fact that any players do it should be reason for concern. Something as simple as a longer cooldown on serums and longer duration on tank cleanses would help rectify the situation greatly imo.

Guys dont forget, Tanks should be able to do one of those 2 things aswell: debuff controller's vit/ability to debuff others.
Or maybe remove PoT from all the opposing group (as of today tanks can only remove PoT from controller powersets) so the tanks can remove PoT from healers, and basically create power problems for the opposing group.

Sorry for the long reply, I was pretty upset tank cleanses were not adjusted to a proper level.

In premades, often, every night I run into people using serums in pvp matches. This happens more often than you think. The people that premade regularly, like my league, use these serums because tank cleanses are not so useful at the moment.

It's near impossible to debuff a healer.


I play on USPC at night.


My league does not run with tanks very often in PvP anymore. They have become glorified node holders. Another thing to consider would be to make tank gear useful.


On a side note, a tank, in tank gear, is pretty much dead weight in PvP. I would propose making changes to what tank gear exactly does for a team.

high vit =more power for a team.
high resto = keeps people alive on a team
high dom/more toughness = does what for a team? Nothing. Absolutely nothing.



Also @Captain_Liberty,

There are leagues that have billions to make serums. Exobits aren't hard to farm out anymore. People that have routes have farm out a lot of exobytes in just a few hours. R&D scanners make easier to scan to exobytes as well.

The common number for people to go through is about 2 stack of seurms per a match to stay cleansed.




When we're talking stacks... We're talking stacks of 12.

Hi Cap, it is such a relief to know that you guys are at least aware of this potential issue. I can't speak for everyone obviously, but serums are a big problem for me and the way I play your game. I and many in my league have full T4 pvp gear and we often fight other equally geared leagues. In this crowd, it's simply expected that you have stacks of serums if you want to heal a league premade, especially if you know your rival league is using them AND trash talk is expected if you lose. It may not seem like a big deal to you or for 90% of the game's population, but it honestly is a big deal for that remaining 10%. The worst part is we can't even replicate the benefits of serums by bringing a tank because the tank cleanse lasts such a short duration and has a long cooldown. There is no alternative than to just bite the bullet and make the serums, and this makes healing pretty unappealing in the long term. Some of the best healers in my league simply don't want to pvp anymore or as much because of this situation.

I think what most people would like to see a fix the pvp serum problem that is resulting in tanks not being needed.

My suggestions:
1) make it so you can only stack 6 at a time of the grenades and serums so if you want to spam them you have to allocate that many slots on your belt, or be willing to stop mid fight to equip more
2) increase the cooldown on these things, make it the same as a soda, that way again you can't just spam away all your problems
3) extended tank clears to longer than 3 seconds along with doing some of 1 & 2


- side suggestion
Give us like a base CC resistance while in pvp areas of like 50% or something that way with the other 10% we get from certain powers it would bump us to 60%. Enough that you can tell the difference but still not immune to all effects.

I seem to be getting hit with a lot more CC effects in pvp despite melee weapons natural resistances along with the ones from the movement tree. Unless everyone is using the back mod to reduce control resists, something feels a bit wonky.

what game are you playing? healers have a pot now?

Make Tanks remove pot from the group, not only from the controller or:
Remove pot from troller + debuff his vit (Like controllers debuff heals).

Also, make cleanses last longer, and ... when the tank activate the cleanse, removed the targeting (like distract but for tank + 3 players), that way, at least the cleanses and the small mitigation it can provide with this mechanics, + the pressure over the power generation of the other team would make tanks more viable.