Stats Revamp 1.4 - Rage Feedback

LOL.

After nearly 24 hours of hemming and hawwing, you finally admit you haven't even tested it yet.

Why would anybody ever listen to you now?

Not going to get into the power specifics but since rage is getting a rework it would be prime time to finally fix the godawful ring trail. Original post here. Basically the player one is clunky and very unappealing whilst legend's one is slim and visually not too messy.

"TBH fatal is right i might as well just test what we have right now on Test"

The clear implication of this sentence, that you wrote, is that you have not tested yet. If that is not the case you would do well to clarify a bit better.

However, having just read this entire thread, it's blatantly clear by your extremely vague complaints, that discuss no detail, and only consist of complaints you could have gleaned from reading the notes and nothing more, that you had not actually tested, before this post.

Like I said, why would anybody listen to you now?

Have a nice day!

ok so my initial thoughts after a brief test.

it feels alot tougher. im definitely missing the 100% heal back but if you hit remorseless its ok.

outrage costs waaayyyyy too much power. i can understand a power cost for the initial hit but why is it costing power for the second and 3rd hit? its too much.

It always seemed to me that Channel Hate should be Rage's finisher. It's cool that Rage gets a combo finisher, but as others have pointed out, channel hate is pretty much useless.

There are 3 main issues with Rage tanking that I'm seeing:

1. Rage no longer gets a per-add bonus, so it's no longer invincible against tons of adds.
2. You're pretty weak without the extra defense from Redirected Rage or Vindictive, and I've already described Vindictive's shortcomings.
3. Rage Mode's cool down has increased from 10 seconds to 12, so instead of being very vulnerable 20% of the time, you're very vulnerable 33% of the time.

The first might just take some getting used to. It's not necessarily wrong, it's just different. Seems to me that your health should ramp up faster with combos though: as a Tank you're not very likely to be hitting 50x on the hit counter all that often.

For the second I think there should be another way to activate the higher defense. Without Mercy maybe? Finally a use for Channel Hate?
Automatically activated when 4 or more enemies are near?

The third seems like the biggest issue and I'm surprised that no one is really talking about in this thread. Rage's heals are decreased, and that's balanced by higher defense. But the extra 2 seconds without a healing mechanic are just gone. Can this possible be balanced with extra healing in due to extra damage out with Rage's secondary damage-out/healing in mechanic?

So the changes to outrage are cool, you can cycle with just revenge no need for a third power. On the other hand, the power cost is huge and you run dry on anything other than mobs that drop blue baubles. Also is outrage only supposed to be ticking once per combo? on live it hits twice on tap and 3 on hold.

Without RA healing i feel like a glass cannon. If it was too overpowered I understand but it was one of rage dps defining features.

Dreadful blast living up to its name, can't even clip with itself. Someone suggested we get Atrocitus rage flail as another range combo and i agree, maybe an extension to E-chain?

Frenzy is still pretty useless, No mobility and the damage isn't worth being stuck in animation.

Lacerate is light weight you can't throw, maybe change to another melee combo?

Definitely a mixed bag but I think rage is showing potential, I don't tank much on live so i'll leave that to the more experienced. As for dps PftT is rough even with a power spec.

That's where i'm at Frenzy got to go and replaced with another ranged combo ability, That and mangle have no serious use in the game at all. While we have the chance we really need to have more people focused on addressing those two powers along with the power cost issues of galling and outrage along side the tank issues.

As far as Mangle go I would really like a rage like entity to come out and deal some damage something like this.

Alright,you keep nagging about how **** rage is on Live,how many times the devs kept nerfing it and that you keep getting rejected as a rage tank in OLYe GOMe runs.I agree that rage can't handle single bosses as easy as multi bosses/adds.

The thing is that,even if you've been rage since it came out,you either underestimate
it's tanking benefits or you're probably not taking advantage of what rage has to offer in single target situations.
I noticed you argued that rage can't out heal a healer on Live.

The only way NOT to out heal a healer is by either not using the rage mode regularly enough or by letting him spam HoTs and bursts like there's no tomorrow.You should consider that the reason people keep rejecting you as a tank isn't because of rage being a **** tank power but because you're not using it as you should have.

Back when Oan sm was on live I thought it was impossible to tank r9-10+ as rage just because people said so.It's a little bit harder than other powers but by using RB everytime you get the chance will get the job done.
In case you're going to use that "Obviously you're not playing rage as your main power" excuse, I've been rage since dlc 9 came out.
Like all powers,rage used to be OP both as dps and tank when it came out.

Since you like rage so much I'm sure you're going to adapt to it instead of quitting DC just because the Devs didn't adjust it to your playstyle.

I made corrections to my post on the calculations regarding the Combo Counter health increases. They are working as intended, I did the Math wrong.

I wanted to point out something, since we are in the midst of a rework of the power, that has been an issue on Live and on test as well.

However before that I wanted to also mention that because we only heal 75% of dmg now, the actual Rage crash if you miss is smaller now. Say you took to a total of 100,000dmg on live you would crash and take that 100,000dmg. Now with only 75% healed, and the healer covering the other 25%, if you missed you would only take 75,000dmg. So it does make missing a crash slightly less powerful, however not by too much heh if swarmed by adds.

On to the main issue I would love to see fixed with Rage, the mechanic for Our self-heal.

Now I am not saying to change the animations, or sounds, or how it works except for one change. I think it should absorb 75% of dmg taken, instead of you taking the dmg, and then healing it back.

The main reason I say this is because we are vulnerable to deaths that should never have happened, especially when low health. Even if you look at the current live version of Rage, if you are sitting at let's say 8500 health, and an enemy hits you with rage going for 10,000 health you will die. Yet by the very mechanic you are supposed to heal 100% of dmg done to you. So you SHOULD have lived.

If it was changed to absorbtion then these kinds of deaths would no longer occur to Rage players. Because even with the test version, if you get hit for 75% dmg and it's higher then your current health, you die. What should have happened is it absorbed 75% of the dmg, and you only actually took 25% dmg to your health, keeping you alive in low health situations.

This would go a major long way to helping both DPS and TANK role survive in tough fights, and be able to squeak out a close call win etc.

I was playing around with Frenzy earlier. It's a fun power, but I don't understand why it's vulnerable to block? I thought one of the points was to take out the counter mechanics when using abilities (aside from channels, which can still be interrupted)? It'd be nice if it could also be used to cancel rage crash, although I am aware the animation for it is rather long which might make it too "OP" in terms of it being a better option as a canceler than other abilities.

The Power cost for Outrage seems astronomical. The combos look (I stress the word look) like they cost the same amount as the initial cast, but without a concrete way to see exactly how much each combo costs I can't say for sure, but combos are supposed to cost less than the initial cast as far as I'm aware. That could just be my eyes playing tricks on me, but it does look like the same amount of my power bar is being used on each combo of Outrage as the initial cast.

You are correct, as several of us have pointed out in this thread. Each hit costs 200, which isn't what was described in the light thread, unless Rage is going to work differently. But I'm pretty sure it's a bug, because Dreadful Blast also costs 200, but the combo portions only cost 100 as was stated in the other thread.

Additional feedback: we need either A. to be able to jump cancel Plasma Retch and still get the damage from it, or B. another ranged way to apply the Plasma Burn PI. The reason is that PR is always lunged by enemies, and you don't have time to get to your next power even if you jump cancel it. I don't mind that it's a channel if that's the way you want to go, but we do need a quick way to apply Plasma Burn from a distance. Oh, and the DPS of Plasma Retch is pretty bad if you just sit there and let it run.

Just some tips for fellow Rage Tanks also: don't forget to pick up your breakout trinket from Batgirl? in the WT, that way you only have to run with 1 breakout in your loadout, in case you want to include a SC or RR or something. Also, the Personal Dampening Field consumables do wonders during those 4 seconds (they last 6 seconds and the CD isn't too much). Just stock up on them.

One more thing, nice job to the devs on keeping our hit counter going in tank mode for a while (not sure exactly how long), since I see you can block for a second or 2 without losing the counter. Very nice, smart. Also nice that using abilities doesn't interrupt the counter either. It wasn't too hard to get up to 50 and beyond as long as you're not interrupted every 5 seconds.

Well ****...I guess I'll hop on test. I wouldn't expect anything less for a rage update though.

Rage...
It was never my favorite tank, but it was my favorite DPS ...
How you revamp things are changing ...
I personally do not like how the DPS is following, but I'm liking how the tank is going ...
I know a lot of people are going to screw me up, and I understand ... I'm not an expert!
My area has always been the atomic and earth!
For this I will listen / read carefully and humbly all the comments made.
However after a time of adaptation where I died several times, I soon got used to the game between arms and power, and I began to feel immortal playing with Rage, just as I felt playing with the atomic!
The fact that I could return power and heal, return power and heal me, was cheering me on! It took a while for this! I died for example when I did Olympus!
But then I got the hang of it!
And I intend to make a video showing what I'm talking about!
However the DPS, this mediocre ...
Very sad...

So I ran the hades duo only so far. The only place I had an issue was the final boss due to "getting caught with my pants down" , so to speak. Like others have mentioned before, the period after you exit your enraged state while severe punisent is in CD is stressful once you have multiple things attacking you. The point of struggle for me was when Ixion lays down his AOE that CCs and damages you. That caused major stress and was the only time in the entire duo I had to pop a soder

All in all I felt pretty durable. I was never at a loss for power , and my health barely moved until I hit the last boss. It was interesting. I particularly enjoyed not having to block unless I fished for a counter. Unless you guys work a miracle with earth and fire, I might be going rage full time. Rage allows me to play the way I wanted to since the game first came out. The Ma and pistol weapon mastery combos are built for this bad boy.

However, my full assessment on tanking will have to wait until I at least try out Olympus.

Okay, so instead of killing off rage tanking foundation, could we get two ways of doing it?
Sever Punishment to remain the turtling option and Remorseless Recovery to be an option for those who want to battle tank? +have both abilities cancel each out. Would be great using an existing concept instead of breaking the power entirely.

New Frenzy animations are awesome!

Changes that I think will be really appreciated:

Replace/modify Lacerate (My pick), or Channel Hate/ Frenzy/Ferocity/Eviscerate for DPS role, so we have another range ability to go with Dreadful blast.

Restore Berserk to the pre-nerf version.

Yes please please do this

Ok so i want to make it clear I haven't run any content with rage yet these are just my thoughts so far my reading the changes, specing sp, and attackng the dummy.

The weapon combining health boast seems like it's doing very little even if I spec full dom. Perhaps increase the percent we get.

Plasma vomit no longer being a dot makes no sense for the power, I mean we are spewing a caustic substance why isn't it doing a dot. Just from a logical stand point it should be a dot. Further more rage has so few range option that removing the dot from Plasma vomit just dealt a huge blow to rage range dps, no matter how much sp, mods and gear you have in this game you can't melee everything.

Removable of the health stacking. I understand why, it was seriously overpowered however - can we have some remnant of it like a static health increase by 2-5% for each add nerby.

Since rage is this Berserker type power can we get rid of the 55% def from RR instead increase our def the lower out health goes(of course of you did this youd have to buff other areas of rage to make up for the need. Saying this so I don't get hated from the polluting this thread)

Channel hate. Something needs to be done - make it apply a damaging aura to those nearby, or apply a dot, or apply Plasma burn in an aoe, or hell get rid of it and give us a new range ability. You want us to have more choices, wel right now we don't have any for range just a variation of what's in love for dps.

Resto. Right now we have a very powers capped by dom + resto which makes little sense considering. We are a Berserker battle tank so can we have them capped based by our dom and might to be more of an actually battle tank - after all out of every tank rage makes the most sense as a battle tank.

Redirected rage. Any chance it could cause the pi? Small request by it would help battle tanking.

Vindicate. The sc cost seems a little steep, then again you are constantly doing damage ao will test later.

The extra four seconds. Can wr have sone residual enrage or whatever ita called, like 10% healed back over those first two seconds whrn you cancel rage mode.

Rage mode. Since you got rid of the dpa one and since rage is meant to be a melee power can we get a damaging aura in dps role. You can bring dont th healing back in dps role as wrll to balance it if you must but melee dpsing without the dps rage mode seems like iy would not be fun - espically since so much of our sp will go towards power so we wont be able to spec that much into health as well

Like i said all tboughts are based on my impressions, ill start testing in combat that is not testing dummy based on monday.

All of this is written on my phone.......dont judge me