Mr. MAX asks: do you expect C4 to increase in cost as well, or not? Currently a single C4 can kill a MAX outright, certs in flak armour not taken into account. Many people consider this fair: 100 for 100, with the possibility of a MAX revive tipping the cost slightly in favour of the MAX. If MAXes cost 350, what are the Light Assault community's thoughts on C4 costs? Still good? Needs to be more? Kind Regards, Mr. MAX.
C4 is fine, what needs to be buffed is MAX armor. It needs to be able to survive an entire HA's total ammo from his LMG, plus a rocket from his tool or so. MAX never was the tank it really should have been.
Tripling the cost of a max is going way overboard.. There are some people that play only that class and your forcing them not to, which will lead to them quitting. I have no idea how these new resource costs got approved.. They need to buff maxes to live through 1 block of C4 if they are going to cost 350. They don't have to live with much HP, I would be fine with 10%, but they got to at least give them a fighting chance to run for cover... Or they need to make C4 cost 200, which would also suck for my LA, but at least I can stockpile 40 of them..
Well, MAX is not intended to be aviable all times (you can't repop as one!), it's a sort of one-shot loadout for peculiar situations... If someone likes to play galaxy only, it's their choice, but this doesn't mean galaxy has to be changed to allow them more playing with it... If a MAX would be capable of surviving one rocket + 100 hits, than how would you down one in a biolab helped by a decent engineer? This game would become a MAX vs MAX conflict....wait, it could actually be the case, now that they nerfed (sorry, DOUBLE NERFED) the hell out of NC maxes...come on, shotguns being killers in CQC, that needed a nerf for sure!!! Who cares if they don't have a midrange option? If they win at the range their weapon are supposed to be superior in, they for sure needed a nerf!
While tripling may indeed be a bit overboard. It isn't really that bad that maxes will cost more. You have to remember that medics can still revive them like any other infantry. Meaning, in theory, a good team can keep you in that max for hours. While on the other hand, Light assaults spend this 100 resources to kill you temporarily. You get revived, you get your max back, and he gets nothing but a little xp. So consider that someone "that plays only that class" will not be spending infantry resources on anything -but- spawning maxes. Between current resource gain and the fact that you actually gain resources by doing something productive near infantry resource bases. A good and focused max player can play max all he wants and only has to sacrifice getting explosives for classes he may or may not care for. So while a max may seemingly cost as much as a tank. It really doesn't. It's in a seperate pool of resources that doesn't have to compete with as many large ticket items as ground or air vehicles, while being revivable. The simple fact is Maxes, while not as tough as max lovers would want, can and have already have trivialized the use of infantry when they become too easy to pull. Like back in beta, when people could pull them with no resource cost or timer. You literally saw nothing but maxes loaded up in gals taking bases. (it's why maxes can't cap points currently, which could do with being rescinded) If the devs decide it's still too much, then at the very least you can use this difficulty of pulling them as a reason for more durability and more buffs. -----(yes, I partially played devils advocate for a lot of that)----- ok now that all of that's been said. I won't completely argue that explosives, without using max cost as part of my reasoning, could do with cost increases. All of them, not just C4. But this is mostly based on my and some other players' feelings towards how easy they are to get and the tactics they encourage. I don't want people to be able to point to C4 when people ask for the Light assault class to be revamped. Because it's a genuine retort to say that LA jetpacks allow crazy tactics with C4, even though it's not as easy as people think. I don't want to see people casually throwing down an explosive for any situation, because I'd rather see thought put into the use of explosives. The costs are low enough for me to horde during battles where I don't need them. I have 40/40 on a half dozen or more different explosives on different classes and even if I'm lazy for a day. I'll never burn through all of it before I get it back. I want to see frag grenade cost greatly increased so that we can reasonably buff them to be a little scarier and a lot less throw and forget. Overall, I wish the pool for explosives was lowered to 5/5 along with what's currently on your character so that it's harder to horde and spam freely for half an hour. Short version, I disagree with your views on the max cost and availability. But I wholeheartedly agree on C4 as well as extending that to my thoughts on other explosives. Please limit all of them more.
C4 was fine until now. I don't see a need to make them more costly. They are the best way to get rid of the 20 sunderers attacking a base, by running/flying to them and trying to blow them up. C4 doesn't even kills sunderers right now (which is a shame) so I really don't see the need for highr costs. It is used a lot since it is strong, but it is the ONLY viable option for LA atm. I think the cost of 350 is too much, but the massive MAX-Spam atm is more than frustrating for everyone who wants to play PS2. Infantry is frustrated because of the huge amount of MAXes and don't want to support the fun-killing MAXes of their own faction, while MAXes are frustrated because they get no support and when they die they won't help other MAXes since they are pissed that noone helps them. This is how I understood some conversation at an attempt to attack a base, which failed horribly due to no teamwork betwenn MAX, medic and engi. MAXes (and Tanks) should be expensive and not avaible at any time. They are strong enough to be priced with 200 - 250 inf resources. When the costs of C4 are increased the C4 shouldn't disappear after respawn. Perhaps it should just no longer belong to you, laying where it is waiting to get shot by someone. But throwing a C4-Brick worth 300inf resources just to die because it takes 5 sconds to explode the ****** things is a wrong mechanic...
lemme guess you drive tanks into amp stations and complain that you get c4ed? : ) A tank worth 200 mech resources should be killed with 200 inf resources -> looks like balance to me since C4 is a one way use/kill while tanks can so much more infantry for 200 resources it is not even funny perhaps C4 is not expensive enough, but the same applies to tanks.
Once it spawned a MAX can kill infinite amount of enemies/vehicles. That is why 350 resource is still ridiculously cheap compared to a C4 brick (which cost 100 resource) which on a good day can kill 2 MAXs, if you are lucky and sneaky enough. edit: also let's not forget risk vs reward in the case of C4s compared to the vehicles/MAXs and that C4 bricks cost 700 certs just to unlock it, while i can hop into a vehicle/MAX without any certs dumped into it - Mr. Light Assault
Ok let have a quick run through of what you're getting for your resources with either item: For 350 resources (MAX) you get: A suit of armour that will take around 70 bullets to kill. Weapons system with a lower TTK than the majority of weapons in CQC to close range The ability to survive a C4 brick with the 3rd tick of flak, gain an extra 3000HP vs bullets (I know it's more but I blow at maths) or auto regening health Can be used for an infinite amount of time until you die Empire specific abilities than can significantly boost you offense/defence at the press of a button Most versatile unit in the game than can be fitted to deal with any threat on the battlefield Can be made much more lethal with a pocket engi(s) and can be rezzd just like any other infantry For 100 resources (C4) you get: An explosive with a largish blast radius that can be used once per 100 resources spent Can get multikills that are heavily dependent on the awareness of your enemies and their certs (infantry and MAXes can't be OHK with a certain level of flak armour) Balancing the two units in a resources to resource manner is silly. One makes you the best infantry unit in the game and the other lets you kill that unit (not even a certainty) in an effective manner once per resource cost. One is good in a single instance per resource cost for a split second only and the other gives you the best armour, some of the best weapons for every role and survivability as an infantry unit, for an infinite amount of time until you die. The numbers are fine if you ask me. A more reasonable cost for MAXs is 300 though imo.
in all honest truth I prefer playing MAX non-stop if I can, and I have no intention of spending 350 on an Infantry class I believe the costs got approved by someone who is a complete moron
I feel that if SOE want to limit the number of maxes out there then they have a mechanism in the spawn timer certification tree. Making Indar even more fought over (infantry resources) won't help this game at all.
The OP fails at logic. If you use 2 C4 on a MAX - you only get 1 kill - a MAX can potentially unlimited people. 2 C4 are often used on turrets and infantry which cost no resources. 3 Attempts to use C4 on MAXes fail more often than not resulting in wasted C4.
There are too many MAXes out there and still you can revive them. I don't get all guys that thinks MAX should have even more health/resistance, MAXes are OP because many players use them now like regular class and still they can't deal with that someone can kill them. Spamming rockets from cover is 100% fine to MAX users, but if you put effort too get close and use C4 make all off them whine in forumside. I don't get it
i believe that part of my response on the C4 topics can be reused. when they remove the chance to revive a max suit, then they can change the cost, that would also force the maxes to actually be mindful of their game unlike now where you see max crashes used so often as a "tactic" the way i see it and i hope others can follow this idea. if you're a max in a max team, (max, engi, medic) then you're not using the small arms fire suit or the repair option, you're using flack to combat explosives, because everything else can be handled by the rest of the team. So claiming that a single C4 block can kill a max is 100% true, but somewhat unlikely these days. so a change of cost to the C4, not before the max suit can't be ressed, sure res the player as the class before max, but leave the hunk of metal on the ground.
I'd like to see a "Revive Max" infuser as a utility item (costing inf resources) for Medics. That would help a lot I think. When Medics have to pay something around 50 inf resources to revive a MAX, they will think about it. (And results in MAXes getting less rezzed in random squads... damn)
No way i don't expect a C4 cost increase to happen with LA direct and indirect nerfs being a trend. But (as said before by several people) : 1_ Using a MAX has no risks but reward the user easily. A LA has to flank using the high ground (and usually deal with enemy LAs in the process) then get into C4 dropping range and drop the C4 hopping not to die while doing it and that the max won't charge/ZOE to run away (this two actions will cause the C4 to be wasted) 2_ A MAX can cert into a +50% explosive damage resistance while a LA has no way to mitigate the damage from a MAX. 3_ A MAX can be revived, C4 vanish on respawn and can't even be picked up once dropped. 4_ A MAX isn't tied to any time/use restriction and can change loadouts at terminals meaning the resources used last for a period of time while the C4 cost is for a one time use only. => As long as the All_Mighty_Nanite_Overlord makes MAXs able to be revived it doesn't make any sense to try scaling any infantry consumable with the cost of a MAX, especially if said consumable can't even be picked up if not used. That's not even taking into account the huge difference in risk/reward between a MAX and C4. As said at the beginning i wouldn't be even remotely surprised if it did happen though, the LA has no tool and people will keep whining until even our utility slot is removed. Pretty much a lost cause until the promised LA revamp which only the Nanite_God knows the real ETA.
It's not meant to be an even trade. It never was. Resources are spent for what you get, not what you can kill with it. Consumables should never EVER scale in comparison to what they can destroy. HA rockets are FREE, grenades do not cost resources because you COULD kill 6 people with one, and C4 is well balanced at a cost of 100 (they could actually stand to be made cheaper in all honesty, but there isn't enough of a case for me to push it).
