The tr skill ceiling. The myth or grim reality.

To me TR has the highest skill floor and ceiling, because even though the recoil and CoF can screw you if you just go full auto spastic mode at 50m you're going to miss 80% or more shots, but everything I can do with VS or NC guns I seem to do better with TR guns... probably due to me usually playing LA, Combat Medic and Infiltrator and guns being better at CQC.

VS has easy recoil, but when I got my pants down and a LA wanted me to have a bad day there's usually no escape, also seems to be worse at CQC. It's easy to get started and good with VS guns, but beyond getting good there's not a lot else to master or improve in.

NC has meh recoil but due to good bullet economy and lower shots fired you actually end up with better accuracy if you burst properly. The higher damage per bullet can also let you pray 'n spray. All in all medium skill floor and ceiling.

TR... I don't know what it is that makes me a top notch player when I play TR. The higher rate of fire and mags are such a benefit at any range and recoil is suprisingly easy to compensate for with a 1x reflex sight I found usually no need for a forward grip considering the ranges where TR guns are the most effective. T5 AMC, T32 Bull and SABR-13 just murder people at any range.

For vehicles I found all factions to be equal (Yes, even the Vulcan for Harassers, but for some reason Enforcer has higher KPH than the Vulcan) except for ESFs. Banshees now suck and there's no real A2G option except for LOLpods, and to me Mustang AH seems to be a bit over the top in efficiency (Where you have to stay on target for Light PPA and Banshees in order to kill your target for at least a second, while AH is just a point and click cert farming adventure game).

What I would add is that for VS weapons the high first shot recoil on a lot of guns makes burst firing pointless. Your actually better off just continuing to fire. As anything other than heavy then your going to be reloading after each kill.

Statistically speaking; TR has the potential to do more damage with each magazine than do the NC or VS, but our weapons are innately difficult to control when trying to keep our DPS up(full-auto) this means that a skilled TR has more slaughter per reload than anyone else while an inexperienced TR will spend more time missing and reloading. This suggests a higher skill ceiling.

if you give more bullets to a faction you will have to compensate in other departments. having less accurate weapons is a limit to what your skill can achieve.

well after listening to all the whining i decided to switch to TR, spent about 2 hours last night fighting my own outfit as TR and frankly it is very obvious why they cry.

there was zero over head strategy we fought at defending the same two bases for an entire alert. all we did was defend.
there was a few calls for a max crash that took forever to get organize, i never saw a single galaxy be used, and there were no attempts to flank or engage indirectly, we simply went where the VS went.

it was ******* painful to watch and play. i dont want to **** on the guys running the platoon because they did a great job with the basics, but what was lacking imho was tactics of any real kind.

some things i noticed about us (the VS). we use very very little air support, usually there would be 2-3 scythes floating around target armour but that was all really, the TR also did not seem to use much AA (i was running my aa sundy though) they had a lot of mossi's in the air but very very little AA on the ground which was surprising given how strong TR burster max's are. the magriders were a constant pain but unlike most TR complain it wasn't to do with the magriders so much as our (TR's) inability to call them out and deal with them, a magrider that got behind our line was pretty much ignored while it wiped out 3-4 sunderers and even then there was no real response to it.

there was a tremendous amount of wtfh are we doing while i played with TR, im going to stick with it just to figure out exactly why it seems so bad. even on a low cert char i was racking up more certs as a TR than i usually do as vanu

Blame Forumside for the RNG. I made several requests and posted several ideas on how to remove RNG from weapons and everyone came in and said how it would be terrible to take the dice rolls out of the game.

They want to play Dungeons and Dragons instead of relying on skill with their weapons. You'd be better off asking for tab targeting to replace aiming with this community.

Imo that is just about the worst example you could have chosen.
I switch weapons when I get auraxium so not all my experiences may still apply, but the Rhino and the TORQ are the only two guns that made me think "awesome". Because they had/have controllable recoil.

Most guns seem to have horrible horizontal recoil. I mean my ******* SABRE has so much horizontal recoil that it is possible to miss a guys head with the second shot (Its a two shot burst weapon for those who don't know) if he is about 10m away.
People told me its a headshot machine. If RNG wills it it sometimes is. A lot of the time it is only in CQB where a burst weapon is ... not an advantage, at range I'm often better off firing single bullets.

I don't have ALL weapons aurax either, so there might be some good ones I simply haven't used yet...

To the people saying "TR is disorganized" and "TR has bad players", I'll explain it again slowly and using small words.

TR guns bad.
NC guns hard and good.
VS guns easy and good.
VS win lots.
Smart players like win. Leave TR. Get good VS guns.
VS get more players. VS outnumber all. VS win more and more.
TR players say: "Dev-gods, fix our guns!"
VS players say: "LOL. You bad".
Dev-gods drop NS weapons from sky, count dead TR sacrifices made to them.
VS and NC players say "Thank you for fixed TR guns!"

VS say hello and l2p
TR victim complex low skill faction

You forgot the "TR players that forumside are absolutely terrible with terrible opinions"

I mean really Citizen, what is wrong with you personally?

Seriously...? You are complaining about horizontal recoil on the freaking SABR? The only assault rifles with less horizontal kick are the burst variants and maybe the Corvus. It's statements like this that fuel the #trvictimcomplex jokes.

seeing as there is a definite ceiling on the depth of my weapons. i think I need some really good weapons. I think I'll have to go vs.

The TR "skill ceiling" concern is not one of being unable to handle TR weapons. That's a low-level complaint cited by people who are over-estimating their experience with TR weapons and it has no bearing on the actual argument. What is actually being expressed is a frustration that can described with the phrase "that's the best it does?"

TR weapons are incredibly straightforward. They either work the way you are using them or you are not using them correctly, and the middle ground for working in some situations while failing in others is small. Once you actually learn how to use the weapon, though, that's all there is. There's no second wind, no hidden functionality, no finagling with the fringe behavior to milk more utility out of what you have to work with. There's no surprise. That's the skill ceiling. Compared to flying, where the challenge of staying a good pilot involves constantly inventing new ways to manipulate one's arsenal, you can only use a weapon in the TR's ES arsenal as well as the weapon performs. Once you hit that wall, there's little more that can be done individually.

The Striker 3.0 and the HEG Pounders are two rare examples of weapons that push that mold but, yet still, not in ways that are versatile for any reason other than being assisted or being powerful, respectively.

link us your toon so we can see just how different it is.

Which one? All my toons get the same name.

Fix for TR weapons?

Buff magazine size and fire rate, reduce the CoF's size, and then, for good spray 'n' pray measure, make TR weapons bloom slower than all other weapons. That way, suppressive fire using ancient weapons becomes an actual thing.

I'm sick of intellectual dishonesty from VS munchkins and developer cowardice.

That involves facts. youre bad at facts. Youre now a hypocrite, AND stupid. Feel free to link your VS and TR toons so the world can see your hypocrisy; of course you wont though because you couldnt stand to prove yourself wrong.

It IS a ******* burst rifle you dolt.

And I don't believe that part about the low horizonzal kick. If the RNG thinks its funny I'm not even hitting the body after the second tap - not even the TAR on sustained fire drags me around like that.
Where did you get the data about the horizontal recoil and what is the FSM?

The problem with your argument is that bit isn't true - or at least it is no more or less true that it is for the other factions.

There's certainly specific TR issues (as there are specific VS and NC issues), but for example take Carbines, TR Carbines tend (on balance) to outperform their competitors, ARs aren't quite as good as that, but still perform well. With LMGs things are generally on-par still, just TR there don't have any specific overperformers.

When you look at statistical performance "TR guns bad" just isn't the case.