[Suggestion] Dalton - the new AA and the ultimate gunship.

do miller even have any gunships left? - br 13 bought on sale, br 90 afk over spawn? br 17 shredder 0 certs.

Is this a freaken necro?

ESF's should come with instructions...

"If you get Dalton'd, please take a moment to reflect on what you can do to avoid it happening again. Do not post on the forums, you little bi*ch"

A competent ESF pilot knows that If he flies close to, or underneath a liberator, he runs a very serious risk of being one-shotted. The answer is to stay at range and kill them with your rotary.

On the other hand, a competent lib pilot knows that he must close the distance on enemy ESF's, so that his gunner has the best shot possible, if they wants to control the sky.

The outcome? A competent 2 man crewed aircraft (good pilot and good gunner) will be able to at very least force a single competent ESF pilot to bug out. NERF THAT SH*T NOW!

There isn't actually a problem. Some people just don't understand how Liberators work.

Didn't think I needed to elaborate.
ESF=AA
LIB= A2G

As has been said before (many times) this game isn't designed as a rock-paper-scissors system where rock beats paper 100% of the time.

A good ESF can kill a Skyguard.
A good medic can kill a tank.
A good Liberator can kill an ESF.

If you're in a Skyguard and an ESF kills you, you f****d up and need to learn from it... not complain that ESFs should be A2A only.
If you're in an ESF and a Liberator kills you, you f****d up and need to learn from it... not complain that Liberators should be A2G only.

Exactly what Accuser said, by your logic that ESF is AA, does that mean ESF's cannot kill infantry or tanks? Or does that mean tanks can't kill air?

Simply fact is you can't handle being out skilled. A Dalton gunner has to account for his movement and position in space and that of the ESF. He then has to also account for bullet drop and travel time to be able to land a shot on a fast moving agile target. Whatever skill you think you have as a pilot. A Dalton gunner has to have double that to match you. A ESF has all the advantages in a dogfight against a lib.

So the fact remains that if you got killed by a Dalton, you got outskilled and can't handle it. If you are regularly getting taken out of the air by a Dalton gunner, then you're a noob. The fact that you have been taken out of the air enough times to come running to the forums and cry for a nerf, only reinforces the fact that you're nothing but a noob pilot.

Suck it up and learn to fly better and play to the advantages of the ESF.

Yeeeeap they should nerf the Dalton while at the same time, they add new ESF wepons including a long range sniper railgun. I mean Libs are currently fodder to AP tank cannons, rotaries,A2A,G2A,bursters and skyguards etc etc oh and lets not forget the Striker, why not add even MORE stuff for ESF's so finally they can really discourage anyone to ever try to fly one again.

If you eat Dalton in your ESF you shouldnt complain at all to anyone but to yourself, you got hit by a 250m/sec projectile that has serious gravity falloff and it took 2 guys coordinating to make you eat it. If the Dalton gets nerfed it will mean two things, for one the amount of ****** handholding by the devs reached a new level, for two they want to completely and finally do away with the Lib.

No. Just no.

Nope. That's skill.

Changing it so Libs can't shoot upside down isn't going to prevent ESF's from getting Daltoned. I fly a Lib pretty frequently and the majority of the time when we shoot down enemy ESF's its because they flew directly at the Dalton. Honestly changing the firing mechanic so that it only fires when the rotational axis is inline with the moon or whatever isn't going to keep you from getting shot. People are still going to fly directly at the Lib so I can fly over top you as we pass and you will get Daltoned or people will chase the Lib from below and get Daltoned. Change your playstyle, learn what works and stop doing the same damn thing over and over again.

I get that its not a fun gameplay mechanic. Its not fun for me to get locked on by infantry 500 meters away when the only render from 300 meters or less. Its not fun for me to have to run flares all the time if I want to fight the TR because 2 out of 3 Heavy's are running the Striker. But I have adapted and made it fun, I will hunt their Sundy down kill it from 700 meters then come down and pick them off as they scramble from the burning wreckage. If you are getting Daltoned, you are still going to be 2 shot from the Zephyr or ripped apart by the Shredder. Its not the Liberator its you.

Only place where the lib might be OP is against galaxies, and even that's not for sure (my battlegal has had some luck against libs today, my 3 man crew got some nice kills)

The developers have stated they want ESF's to be the counter to aircraft and not so much ground, specifically max suits. Thus your counter argument. I don't care one way or another, just felt you should know. So thus if equally skilled the ESF SHOULD win out over the liberator 100% of the time.

People admit their esf get shot down by liberators? That's like almost as embarrassing as getting beamered.

I agree with OP. Liberators are supposed to be a air to ground support gunship. Not the ultimate AA weapon. It would be weird if an apache was shooting down F16's.

Lib needs a massive health buff, decreased agility. Buff to tail gun. Make it terryfying to ground units.

Muhahahaha have been doing a lot of solo libbing lately. I'm fairly new to Miller, and ask around who some of the better esf pilots are. And his name came up amongst others. I had the honor to take him out today after he shredded 4 previous mossies that attacked him I'm a matter of minutes. I kept my distance and studied him a little. Then went in for the fight. Came out swinging and chuffed with myself. . See he and Asnari each soloing their own lib all over amerish today. Crapped myself when I took out a scythe and as I turn around the 2 of them came over the hill at westpass checpoint.

If you die to a Dalton round in your ESF, it's YOUR FAULT. You don't have to engage a Liberator, you don't have to get close enough to get picked off with a Dalton round, & you don't have to die. You CHOOSE to die if you get that close to a Liberator. You're 1 guy in an ESF vs a flying tank w/ 1-3 crew and you expect to just get kills with impunity?

You sir need to get better at flying and change your bad attitude. You're getting shot out of the sky from a moving aircraft by a round with low projectile speed and a decent amount of gravity. Your SA (Situational Awareness) needs to improve.

The Liberator has no choice but to fight you if you engage. You hold all the cards in the ESF vs Liberator fight. If you don't want to die, don't get close to one. You can run away at ANY time, the Liberator cannot. The Lib is forced to fight based on your decision so I don't see why you have ANY room to complain about being shot out of the air with a Dalton.

Lets not forget that hitting an ESF with a Dalton is the single hardest thing to do in the entire game and there are only a handful of people server wide that can do it with regularity.

By your logic, tank rounds should do very little damage to aircraft. But that doesn't make any sense does it? No it doesn't because it's hard and if you have the ability to do it, you deserve the reward.

You say that Dalton is an anti-tank gun, Liberator crews say it's the anti-enemy gun. We use it how we sit fit. Don't hate the skill of the player just because you got killed.

Your ideas for implementing Dalton limitations are absurd and careless. The Liberator needs to be BUFFED in its current state to keep up with the ESF nose gun changes that were just implemented.

The ONLY issue with the Liberator right now is that it carries way too much Dalton/Zepher ammunition and it should be decreased to 1/2 of what it is now. It is very easy to re-arm in this game and ammo management should be a skill in this game. That much ammo just promotes spamming and I don't like that.


I really can't believe these threads keep popping up. I figured people would understand that die'n to a Lib in an ESF is their own fault, but I guess I expect too much.

You must love listening to yourself talk. You're just bleeding from the eyes from this thread as you're obsessively biased towards Libs and Daltons. You clearly didn't read what I wrote since you say "Don't hate the skill of the player just because you got killed." Derp Derp, did you miss what I put in RED? That alone makes me dismiss your entire post, you're desperately trying to defend libs and their dalton via the wrong means, by ranting, saying I need better skills (laughable) and saying the same as I have (buffing the llib - for me: via the tailgun, it's freaking AA turret / ESF deterrent).

So you're a laughable lvl 100 whose probably spent most of his PS2 playtime shooting a dalton and now scared to potentially losing it. But I really don't care.

can we start with tekuila?

I 100% agree with the OP on this.. Its kind of ridiculous when a Lib starts flying upside down to shoot you with its Dalton instead of using the tail gun which is apparently supposed to be the Aircrafts deterrent.. Clearly SOE ****** up the balance of their weapons because most ppl nowadays don't even bother with the tail gun and would rather just shoot at you with a Dalton.. All they need is one lucky shot anyways! And of course.. you have those who have played far too many hours and who are actually proficient using the Dalton to blow up ESFs.. wether its skills.. or aimbotting.. it shouldn't happen as frequently as its happening. This is another thing that they could have had perfect had they stuck to PS1 libs.. where they dropped bombs instead of having a huge ugly ****** ret@rded looking turret under under the lib.