[Suggestion] Liberators need a Nerf

Well, your logic is not perfect either - libs can not be repaired while shooting at ground while maxes and tanks can.
And ground forces do have places to hide - inside buildings, inside vehicles. Lib is alone on the open in the sky and can not hide. And, more importantly, invisible maxes will start dealing damage to lib, before they even render for the gunner.
And I like, how people conveniently forget about ESFs as the counter to libs.

Well, you would have a lot of problems less if you used your own aircraft against it. But most people use ESF only to fight against enemy aircraft. I really enjoy the rare moments when my faction has multiple ESFs fighting for air superiority instead of misuse them as bombers.
But to solve the liberator problem it is really important to change the base designs. We need more cover against airunits in bases.

Maybe they should add an anti air shield? A shield dome that will protect from enemies shooting from outside. To atack the units inside the shield dome you'll need to enter it. I let someone else decide if only airunits can't shoot through it or also tanks need to go inside the shield. But the matter is that you can drastically decrease the distance airunits have to their targets. This would solve the main problems with liberators attacking bases: them flying too high to shoot them, even with MAXes.

Maybe also add a mobile shield generator protecting tank columns, similar to the shieldgenerator in Star Wars: the phantom menace (but on a tank ). To be fair the mobile shields should be destroyable if you shoot long enough at it.

Like in other post i sayed. Remove hover ability from ESF nad LIB's, it will prevent them hover spaming units below them. ESF's and LIB's would need to do strafe runs and fly overs.
Now its these flying tanks can just park theirs *** near or above enemy base and piss on ground units. And nobody cant do anything to them. (One solution would be all jumping to ESF's, but who is going then defend the base from enemy ground units)

I agree. Something needs to be done, there is libs everywhere, no need to get anything else. Rocket Pods are also a bit strong still, a dmg reduction is required.

it is fair enough what you can do against liberators if you would do it but peoply crying out about are those who don't, my liberator for example is on my server very often under heavy fire after i got some shots to ground. there are tanks possible shooting, guided ground rockets very very rarely, max-units very often and wherever i go it doesnt last long for air-fighters to show up if there are no air-fighters. oh and i forgot about some new tactics came up the last weeks they use aa-turrets very very often now what makes me all in all flying most times with full speed above them give some shots and hide. repeating this all the time and i can't very often do like you describe spaming other people with bombs. it is often very hard to manage for staying alive with my strong upgraded liberator but it is overpowered?

what i very agree is more places to hide for infantry but there is no need to do something against libs except of a little better aa-tankguns

what i still miss and fear are guided rockets against air but since the time from release i was in air i see them more and more rarely, at beginning after release it was almost impossible to get close to anything for longer then some seconds before some rockets started to fly but now it is gone and they didnt change anything to it what could cause this. iam like before able to make much aircrafts ineffective around my zone, they cant stay long if i start to shoot and they die more likely if one or 2 of our air-fighters come in. other people doesnt have to bother about it if just a few people care about air.

That's not true. A lib is durable enough to take hits from 2-3 AA maxes and still kill them without dying. And yes i have tried it and seen it from both ends!

2-3 AA maxes? O .o

dunno how your maxes are fighting on your server but it takes just one on mine, they are moving slow but using their specials to doge and so on. they also hit good but today i saw 2-4 max-suits didn't do anything to me, they didnt made a serious impression to me compared to those maxes i saw in other places. they are able to keep me very busy.

maybe the burster is still a bit too weak to hit but if i think about it needs for the lib to come very close to kill the max it also makes the burster much better to hit. could be fair enough? dunno, maybe they shall improve this by a few points in accuracy

I tell you why no one uses AA rockets. The ESF ones do less than a quarter of a libs hitpoints as damage. But i don't mind since they hit at least. But i bought the AA missile launcher for the Heavy assault and after you get a lock on and fire, less than 1/4 of missiles hit anything. Fighters can dodge even more missiles. They miss on one pass and then explode harmlessly. The worst is the scythe. It gets hit by perhaps 1/10 of G2A lock on missiles.

Also especially against libs the problem is if he has any optics and spots you younare dead before you can get the lock!

Dumb base design that allows for super easy spawnroom camping is not the Liberators fault.

The Liberator right now is a heck of a lot more fragile than fighters. It loses an air battle with a single fighter of equal skill and since the AA gets more and more accurate and easy to use to counter fighters the big slow liberator has nothing but its HP pool to rely on for survival at this point.

i play tr, sure missiles can and will be dodged but i carry 5 rockets and it takes 2-3 rockets on a liberator to make him run away if the first rocket doesnt move him faster which makes it harder for him to hit anything on ground. i also killed them completely from 100% if i moved out from base to a place where i could get good shots.

now about the air-fighters:

right, they dodge and use flares. buuuuut: if they do so they cant do anything else and care more about their own life. it will become frustrating if you are always under fire with guided rockets and you will start to use other vehicles instead if you cant land a kill because you are too busy with dodging or other stuff.

this what i talked about now was one man against air with 5 rockets making them nervous, there will be air-vehicles from your side and sure there will be tanks and other infantrists fighting against air. if you tell me you fight alone against those stuff just as single infantrist then something is wrong.

maybe they shall improve ammo a little for ground-to-air-rockets.

That's a nice idea. Maybe something that could be in a Fortification cert tree for Combat Engineers. Perhaps it could take 4 or 5 Engineers working together to make it happen with different deployable parts?

I thought about having a specialist Engineer cert tree that enabled them to deploy Barrage Balloons like those used in WW2. They would be tough, but destroyable with teamwork. The idea being that they would offer ground forces some brief respite from bomardment from air when trying to get out of spawn rooms and bases.

As someone else already pointed out, the air problem has gotten so bad that it's not uncommon to find Liberators and ESF's camping at locations that their Empire can't even capture.


http://peopleatwar.org.uk/imagebank/barrage-balloon

The following is going to make too much sense so don't bother reading.

Unleash a few ESF from a near by base to attack the thing. Problem solved.

Rofl what a big pile of bullsht do we have to read in these threads.
- First there is the guy and his friends 5 dual MAXES who can't scratch a lib! (I read this same exact idiotic thing in another thread, I would check the op for multiaccounts)

- Then there is the casual lib pilot which doesn't play libs but when he does he destroys 19 out of 20 ESFs he encounters and only when he is on low hp an ESF can take him down. Haha I envy you dude for the amount of bullsht in a single post ever.

Seriously this forum has become a gathering of whiners and criers making stupid threads, it's the single worst thing of this game atm. Bugs are less game breaking.

That works great with tanks as well.

Makes the game really fun

Let's do the same with MAX'es as well. They're getting buffed soon. Let's make it so you can only take out AI MAX'es with AV MAX'es. That'll make for some awesome gamplay.

Why stop there? The only thing that can kill a Liberator should be another Liberator.

There are enough ESF's around already to stop this being a problem.

What happens when your enemy has all the ESF and all the Liberators and you can't spawn anything because of aformentioned air zerg? Quit?

Thats what a lot of us do, because ground based AA is not capable of taking on a liberator unless its profoundly stupid and greedy.

When I fly my liberator dying is intentional. I choose to do something greedy or stupid and die for it and thats mostly out of boredom. The only thing that kills liberators is ESF and even now its a pain in the pass because they removed the blindspot by moving the tail gun.

The liberator has far too much impact on gameplay to the point where it renders gameplay down into hiding and buildings while endless explosions explode everywhere. I haven't seen a fight in days where at least 4 liberators aren't in the sky with a fleet of scythes.

Vanu aircraft outnumber vanu tanks on Genudine, hell in some cases they nearly outnumber Vanu infantry.

When one vehicle has too much impact on the game so much so that the entire game is based around who has it and who doesn't, that vehicle needs to be changed unless its existence is the sole purpose of the game.

The liberator is that vehicle.

As for nerfing it, it needs less health, plain and simple, and all air craft need to take the same extra damage from AT mines that ground vehicles do (it doesn't make any sense that if you land a liberator on two anti-tank mines it still has 1/3 health.)

The problem with nerfing its health is that AA G2A are so ineffective right now that who knows what kind of havoc they'll do if they actually worked. All these pilots would be getting blown out of the sky with their current tactics of slow passes and hovering.

The liberator should be about making fast passes over a target area with a specific target in mind, not meandering across the sky carpet bombing entire columns of tanks with relative impunity until it reaches half health then banking and zooming off to repair and repeat.

Sorry for off-topic, but are they really buffing MAXes? It makes no scence - NC AI max is powerfull as I dunno what...

Something will get done. We can argue the pros and cons all we want. SOE sees the numbers, they will see when less people play infantry, or those that play infantry leave the game frustrated. While more people play air, more Outfits speak out openly about wanting to boost their air division. Something will get done about it, one way or the other. So argue all we want here, either base/terrain design will change, or air will get nerfed, or ground will get more anti air. What's really amazing is how there were pilots lobbying about how air was "fine" even before this game content update #1, before anti air guns got boosted slightly, before air locking rockets got slightly better. It really tells you how bad things were, and still are, if after the game update #1 we are still talking about air superiority.

People talk about MAX killing this and that, when MAX themselves are easy to kill, and they require dedicated players forgoing xp and certs just to aim at the sky for maybe one or if they're lucky and work together as a team, two kills. While the air continue to reap in the xp rewards of farming ground and laugh about it. Plenty of pilots have even boasted about their leet skills by posting their K/D ratio. We need to be honest with ourselves here, AA MAX are just poor men's air defense. Real Outfits and organized groups bring their own air power, they don't use the lil AA MAX's to counter air, because it's simply ineffective. So we're here telling others to use AA MAX because majority of the players are still without an organized Outfit, many servers don't have a good organized Outfit. When in reality we should be telling people to pilot ESF's.

But then here's the catch, the FPS genre are still filled with people who prefer playing infantry units over flying around. Traditional FPS players and even newer generation FPS players are all mostly used to going face to face with people holding guns. And many who do try to learn flying planes are simply not good at it. We can tell the random pickup groups and unorganized zergs to bring their own air, but all we'll get are just more free kills for those who are already farming ground units. That or we get a lot of FF crashes, which I see happen a lot.

So like it or not, something will get done about air. You hear about it ingame, you hear about it on the forums. SOE will not want to keep losing people and not see this game grow because people get frustrated about getting bombed, farmed, and camped by air units. What will they do, that's the question more than anything else.

I think they really just need to reduce the range of liberator weapons.
They also need to sort out the sound effects. I love sitting in my prowler and hearing a little *plink* that takes away about 60% of my HP.

I haven't read the discussion, but Lib is working fine for me. I was gunning for a Lib a couple of nights ago, we nearly got shot down by AA Maxes. The pilot landed, repaired and asked me if I saw where the fire was coming from. I said I did, so he hopped back in the Lib, climbed way high up. I couldn't see what I was shooting at, but I kept getting exp.

Nearly got shot down, use some tactics, teamwork and a bit of thinking to overcome it. Seems fine to me.

yeah, sometimes it works fine if you got total fools on ground that aren't willing to pay for aa and aa-upgrades but this doesnt happen very often on my server

looks like another non-serious post to push peoples opinion in some direction