[Vehicle] Prowler may be the worst tank in the game (Slightely in depth, bait title)

Yeah I tried everything and used all the guns.
The Vulcan Prowler is weird because you need to get close and you don't know how many enemies are nearby so you're playing with luck.
It happened sometimes were I decimated over 6 vehicles in a row (yes it was nutz), huddled together with the Vulcan + Barrage but it was more because they made a terrible mistake and trapped themselves so I received little attention. With the Prowler you can randomly get kill streaks but you know....pay that much to maybe do something.

Again, all this can be applied to the other 2 MBT's. Its not as if the Magrider or Vanguard can magically summon gunners for themselves when they are in the same situation. You can even turn it around! Why pick a Lightning if a Prowler out-DPS's it, has a topgun for versatility or more damage, better health for the same resistances?

Also what's messy about it? If it was as fast and maneuverable as a Vanguard would it suddenly be less messy as it has less commonalities with Harassers and Lightnings? Just because it has similarities does not make it messy! The Prowler is a pretty simple tank in many regards. The Vanguard cant really do more than take hits and shoot back so you really have to know what situations you can pull it in. The Prowler is much less messy: want to do a more quick flanking-style play? You can! Want to do long-range artillery? You can! Want to do CQC murder-machine? You can! The Prowler can do just about any type of playstyle you want from an MBT, and that makes it real easy to learn or pick as you wont be trying to make a specific build work that your tank isnt made for.

Size and speed is more important in tank combat than all that stuff. Lightening is so short that it can use any landscape to cover itself perfectly, which the Prowler cant.

No. Quick flanking play-style doesn't exist on the Prowler. I already mentioned this: It's large, has got a speed of a Sunderer...that's not quick flanking, and is always the priority for attacking enemies.
If you flank then you need an AA gun.

The good steering of the Prowler is useless, same with acceleration, and off-road it never helps because of the badly stabilized gun.
Anyways the tank cannot be too fast because its big width will make it unintentionally lose control or flip very often.
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Does TR even need a CQC murder-machine? A tank with only high DPS at close range being its greatest strength. I really don't think so. I'm going to go back to my second suggestion.
In my conclusion I believe the Prowler should be reworked into a Sunderer/transport vehicle armed with a 30mm auto-cannon....it can already deploy, all it needs is at its rear add some animation and effects of some doors opening and behind the doors there would be an opaque TR shield, giving the illusion that there is room for transporting infantry.

And lastly the new MBT idea: A wheeled Light tank with the top gun of course.
Damage like a Magriders main gun with little armor and have better strategic mobility than a Prowler and Lightening!
(It's larger than a Harasser with Slower acceleration and NO turbo btw)
Because this is a tank with paper armor, it desperately needs fast reverse speed.

Just an example images.



This will make TR visually look like the Militarily superior faction, with no more failed, filthy designs.
And it would help to increase faction uniqueness and it perfectly fits with TR traits - Firepower (Top gun already has enough firepower) and mobility.

I am not sure if wheeled tanks are really the future of military technology.
With them you are aiming for more mobility, you lose armour and the shooting characteristics/stability are not as good as with conventional tanks.

If the TR really focuses more on conventional concepts, they were using wheeled tanks, but the main battle tank would probably still be one that is properly armoured and runs on tracks.
Also, a tank on tracks seems more threatening than one on wheels, which would rather fit to the doctrine of the TR.

To my experience with the Prowler I would like to mention that of the 3 main battle tanks it is the one with the worst movement combat.
As a note: I play on the PS4
But the gun barrel swivels so much while you are driving that it makes a moving battle much more difficult. To compensate I have to switch to the third person and lose accuracy. <- It could also be due to my own abilities.
I can't say how it looks on the PC, but on the Ps4 the Prowler is used for longer distances or (though rarely) for Sunderer defense with the front shield.

As far as flanking is concerned, I see this more with the VS Magriders.

@Pikachu
What's that tank? The one with Gattling as its main weapon.

As always:
Since I have no idea if the translator has translated everything correctly, everything down here is still in my native language.

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Ich bin mir nicht sicher ob Radpanzer wirklich die Zukunft der Militärtechnik ist.
Sie mit ihnen setzt man auf mehr Mobilität, büßt dafür an Panzerung ein und die Schusseigenschaften/Stabilität sind auch nicht so gut wie bei herkömmlichen Panzern.

Wenn die TR wirklich sich eher auf konventionelle Konzepte konzentriert, so wurden sie zwar Radpanzer nutzten, aber der Hauptkampfpanzer wäre wahrscheinlich noch immer einer der ordentlich gepanzert ist und auf Ketten fährt.
Auch wirkt ein Panzer auf Ketten bedrohlicher als einer auf Rädern, was eher zu Doktrin der TR passen würde.

Zu meiner Erfahrung zum Prowler möchte ich anmerken das er von den 3 Kampfpanzern am schlimmsten im Bewegungskampf ist.
Als Anmerkung: ich spiele auf der PS4
Aber das Kanonenrohr schwenkt so sehr während man fährt das es einen Bewegungskampf erheblich erschwert. Um das auszugleichen muss ich in die 3. Person wechseln und büße dafür an Genauigkeit ein. <- Das könnte aber auch meinen eigenen Fähigkeiten liegen.
Ich kann nicht sagen wie es auf dem PC aussieht, aber auf der Ps4 wird der Prowler eher für größere Distanzen genutzt oder (wenn auch selten) zur Sunderer Verteidigung mit dem Frontschild.

Was das Flankieren angeht sehe ich das eher bei den Magridern der VS.

@Pikachu
Was ist das für Panzer? Also der mit der Gattling als Hauptwaffe.

Das gatling panzer ist ein T249 vigilante!

There is also the chinses CS/SA-5 with 30 mm gatling gun.


There was the prototype stormer air defense with 30mm galting gun.


There was a proposal to put the GAU-8 in the turret of an M48.


If you like ships then there is also the russian AK-630M2 with it's double 30 mm gatling gun.

Again, this counts for all MBT's. Even then there's plenty of reasons to pull a Prowler. Long-range combat, or beating the hell out of a Lightning in CQC, using its firepower to more quickly deal with a Sunderer or when you are stuck fighting in more narrow area's where the Lightning's mobility and size wont benefit as much the Prowler's raw power can take over. Just talk to some dedicated Prowler drivers about it.

Its large, yes, but does that mean it cant flank? On relatively flat terrain the Prowler is arguably the best at it of all 3 MBT's. Even the Vanguard can flank in some situations. And the Sunderer might have a higher topspeed than a Prowler, but the Prowler has better maneuverability. Just the fact that Sunderers require a large turning circle makes a Prowler the faster vehicle unless you play on shallow turns. Also isnt the Sunderer large and a priority for enemies? After all if its a repair Sundy its vital to take down and win a battle against more tanks.

So how is the Lightning better than the Prowler?
Also while aircraft are a horribly balance mess, they are also a horribly balanced mess for the aircraft players themselves. You'll lose more battles not taking an extra AV gunner than from aircraft as there are simply less of them. I've rarely brought an AA gun and have a ton of success, if only because the "top" aircraft players often cant find their A-hole with a map and will not spot enemies close to their ranks while they fly at the same heights at the same places. My point: your "can only bring an AA topgun" is your playstyle, but its not necessarily the only playstyle.

Why? So if we gave the Vanguard the speed, acceleration and maneuverability of the Prowler nothing would change?

Its stabilized gun is just as stabilized as the other two. And as I explained earlier, the Prowler might catch more uneven terrain but it also moves less when hitting uneven terrain of the same height as the other vehicles (excluding Magrider). This is once again a "but this isnt exclusive to the Prowler" comment.

Sounds more like a problem with your driving style than with the Prowler. The Prowler's rectangular frame make it harder to flip. Its like trying to flip a Vanguard: you wont flip it from the front or rear but from the sides.

It needs it as much as all 3 factions need one, and the Prowler can deliver. So why wouldnt you use such a playstyle? You yourself said you sometimes killed 6 tanks in one go with it! I'm a damn good tank driver who specializes in going the long way around to hit enemies in the rear, but I've never just wiped 6 tanks in quick succession in a Vanguard unless I hit the jackpot and could take out several heavily damaged vehicles in a row as they came back for repairs. Otherwise its a drawn-out affair where I need to repair up too.

You claim these changes need to happen based on things that all vehicles have trouble with and based on bias and bad information. They dont need to happen. I'm all for making the tank ride a more interesting experience, but not just the Prowler and especially not because of bad reasons.

The MBT is pretty much the Lightening and then each faction gets some sort of unique tank called an MBT for whatever reason.


If the wheeled tank would have the double opaque armored glass in the front for the 2 passengers I think it would look pretty intimidating at close range, just like the ANT.

If we got an wheeled tank I assume its mobility would be similar to the ANT. Shooting while moving would be very hard for such a fast vehicle but I enjoy a challenge.
Its flanking ability would be the same as the Magrider. The ANT's got a powerful enough engine to move up some high slopes without turbo. The difference would be that the wheeled tank would be faster and will have fast reverse speed allowing it to move and disengage quicker at a cost of lower HP.

Those 6 vehicles were dead anyways, I just sped it up. I gained little to no attention because of the situation they got themselves in

By narrow area, if you mean lattice bases, well you don't need the Prowler there.
If you mean some stagnating vehicle fight in an alley like for example a bridge, the Prowlers damage is useless there. All the prowler does in this situation is stagnate the fight even more because then no one can push.

Again if you want to flank take out the Harasser, Lightening, Flash. Magrider is best flanker. Vanguard and Prowler are almost on par when it comes to flanking. The difference is so small it's not noticeable in game.


TR's slogan is strength in unity. I believe my concept will unify and increase TR's traits.
My Prowler support concept is a cheaper tank design, with just one gunner required that does more damage than one M20 basilisk. It would be a different type of Sunderer - it will have access to the Proximity repair, so in combination with Lightening it can create a very powerful and cheap force, therefor more in numbers....militarily superior.

The expensive wheeled light tank concept would be a fun tank for players that like playing solo and would be an essential vehicle on the battlefield....A tank is necessary that will cover the flanks or attack enemies from flanks quickly.

Actually yes, something would change. The Prowler will be slightly easier to shoot while in motion
Yeah the Prowler doesn't flip, that's exaggerated, but the point was the Prowler cannot be a fast tank cause of its unusual design.
I can drive the ANT very quickly off-road and have no difficulties. With the Prowler I just can't get used to it, the sides are too wide, it happens too often that I unintentionally hit something.

Evidently you do not. You've been complaining about the Prowler about it, even though the Prowler isn't even that problematic.

I meant more enclosed fights like south-east Indar or Bridge fights. And yes you don't "need" Prowler's at Lattice bases, but they are massively powerful when you do just like all vehicles.
Once again: The fight "stagnates" just as much for all MBT's. The Magrider has the biggest disadvantage on those fights as it's strafing ability is diminished. The Prowler's ability to lay down continuous high DPS is one of the better abilities, and it's even one of the places where the Prowler most definitely outplays Lightnings.

You can flank with a Lightning but not a Prowler?
Let's be clear here, there are two types of flanking:
Flanking out of combat, which all tanks can do pretty well. With the Vanguard I can flank all day no problem as long as I start the flank out of combat. The biggest problem with the Vanguard for out of combat flanks is it's slow maneuverability and speed, making it cost the Vanguard the most time to get anywhere and extending the time that he can be discovered prematurely. The Prowler in out of combat flanking is either second best or the best depending on the situation. If there's rough terrain for Magriders to use the Magriders are best, otherwise the combination of speed, maneuverability, high DPS and the ease at which the Prowler can attack at any range make the Prowler King of flanking.

For In combat flanking the best traits for flanking are the ability to relocate while under fire to get into a flanking position. The most important features to do this are acceleration, speed, maneuverability. Two of which the Prowler scores the best at and due to it's maneuverability it won't lose a lot of speed during turns either.

So because the Prowler is master-of-none according to you and therefore not worth using, you want it to be more like a Sunderer?

Yes, as an NS vehicle. Also doesn't the Lightning fulfill this role for the most part already?

Why can't it be a fast tank? Hold the W key and you go fast. As for shooting while on the move: That's hard for all ground vehicles except the Magrider and Harasser. Why do you think that most combat happens from a stand-still?

I'm asking for a new tank but the Prowler doesn't have to be trashed. It can very easily be remade into a Sunderer style vehicle armed with a 30mm auto cannon in the turret, instead of the double 120mm because it's for supporting.
Why? Faction uniqueness and it would help increase TR's traits.

"An authoritarian government that leverages military might to maintain strict control over the colonial citizens."
-This means that they have mighty military production.

"Loyalty and fealty are core to the Terran Republic ethos and from that grows a spirit of total camaraderie and brotherhood amongst its proud and mighty warriors."
-Strength in unity basically.


The Prowler can already deploy, all it needs is at its rear add some animation and effects of some doors opening and behind the doors there would be an opaque TR shield, giving the illusion that there is room for transporting infantry.

My Prowler transport/support concept is a cheaper tank design, with just one gunner required that does more damage than one M20 basilisk - 30mm cannon. Because it's a Sunderer but with the tank design, it will have access to usual Sunderer upgrades like the Proximity Repair, so in combination with Lightening tanks it can create a very powerful and cheap force (Strength in Unity), therefore more in numbers....Militarily superior.
This combo of auto cannons and Lightening cannons will provide sustained firepower...again another TR trait.

The expensive wheeled light tank concept perfectly fits with the trait speed and mobility. You will be able to say that it's the fastest tank on the battlefield and it would be a fun and challenging choice for solo players.

....No.
And why, it doesn't even go with the other 2 factions traits.

prowler doesn't need to be replaced.

instead add a nanite systems APC with a default autocannon primary while giving the option of using ES weapons like the vulcan as a primary. secondary weapon slot for missles (G2G Dumbfire, G2G lockons, G2A lockons)

give it 5 seats, driver controls the weapons, with 4 slots for passengers.

give it HP between lightning and MBT since it will have a larger vertical profile.

What's that going to do? Hey everybody, have this APC. Or on Reddit I'm guessing some anonymous PS2 dev posted some new weapon for the Lightening. What's giving everybody an artillery rocket launcher going to do?

Why is the Prowler this type of tank where all TR traits are forcefully shoved into it, making it an average, disgusting and stupid mess?

And if you try to give a faction an extra empire specific APC or IFV (and keep the MBT Prowler) then all factions would need another vehicle as well and at the end I'm guessing it would turn out that VS would get another busted one, NC would receive some fun and tough vehicle, and TR would receive another "firepower" mess and we'll go back to where were before.
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I'm just asking for a replacement and rework, nothing extra.
And the remade Prowler into the Sunderer design wouldn't cause much of a problem cause we have the Router.

i said nanite systems APC, anyone could use it, but each faction would be able to equip a faction specific weapon as the primary from existing ES vehicle weapons (vulcan, saron, enforcer etc)

there's nothing wrong with the prowler it doesn't need a rework or replacement.

Yeah I know, but if every faction got pretty much the same vehicle what will that do? It will add something, nobody knows what.

But lets say if TR received this unique concept I suggested, then in a simplified way staying together will be their strength. If sticking together is TR's main ground strength, then the 'Calliope T-8' Lightening turret on Reddit could be uniquely a VS and NC weapon (Artillery rocket launcher). If it could deal moderate indirect damage to vehicles within for example 15 meters of the blast, it can be used to counter or disperse the TR tank convoy....An intelligent and unique counter.

This way the game can be refreshed and at the same time factions become more unique.

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Btw if the Prowler is perfectly fine to you, then why do you want an NS APC?