Are we ever gonna do anything about the ZOE?

Why would I choose to play on low settings when I spent money on a rig that would run it on higher settings? PS2 is a beautiful game and that is how I prefer to play it.

You ever come across a scat max in a bio farm? I believe ttk is much lower than it ever was with ZOE.

Where did I say I wanted ZOE reverted to its original (and yes OP) state? I don't believe I did.

It is currently completely broken and it needs to be fixed. Maybe being able to turn it off when you want, but keep the current cool down. You turn it off early, you still have to wait to turn it back on. Keep the damage (taken and given) and movement (with momentum) buffs.

It can only under perform if it is used. The general consensus seems to be it is not used. Perhaps that's why SOE haven't looked at fixing it? They don't have enough data to do so reliably?

Most all of those ZOE users don't understand their own ability though.
Every single one I've asked believes it to be doing something it's not, or they don't understand the limits of these "perks".

If you're talking about it only increasing your damage up close, then few people actually understand what that means.

Here's an example with arbitrary numbers:

Non-ZOE: 200@10m -> 150@50m

ZOE: 250@10m -> 150@50m.

The second is still better at range (until 50m) than the first one even though it only increase your maximum damage.

Yeah, absolutely nothing besides the movement and damage increases.

The movement speed is good for dodging tank shells at range while using vortexes.

I doubt you had to fight whole squads of zoe maxes.

Lol but it sure sounds like he was in a ZOE MAX Crash.

Yeah well.. it's only up to 10 meters.
So the only weapon that gets much of a benefit, however small is the comet. But given the range you need to be at the reduced survivability makes it not worth using.
For AI guns, the Shots To Kill doesn't ever change. And when the damage degradation on non/blueshifts goes into play, the bonus is gone, so it doesn't get to act as a sort of SPA even.

No it's not.

This:
200@10m -> 150@50m
250@10m -> 150@50m.

Is the same as:
200@10m -> 175@30m -> 150@50m
250@10m -> 200@30m -> 150@50m

ZOE increases your maximum damage. The maximum damage range for all AI MAX weapons is 10m.

The idea that your bullets suddenly lose all extra damage at 11m is incorrect.

Damage falloff is always linear between the maximum and minimum damage.

Hm.
I'll have to get back about the functionality. Asked someone to see if there's anything that can be found in... whatever he's going to look at, be it game files or API or what.

You can go test it in VR.

Shots/kill at 10m will be better with ZOE, the same at the minimum damage range, and slightly better between.

I really do want to find the % value.
Apparently it's not currently in the API (according to fisu), so finding out would take some effort.

What happened to the ZOE max is the same thing that happened to the TR Striker. Players complained so much about it being OP that it left the devs with emotional scars so deep they can never make it useful ever again.

Except the Striker got some redemption buffs, ZOE did not.

This part at least is absolutely correct.

There is no reason to use ZOE.

Alarox, you may be able to use it to side-strafe at long range, but you'd be better off with Charge, as if a Vanguard or Prowler gets a direct hit, then you can be killed with splash boop - You'll need a "PANICSHYTEOHBAHGGER" button to get out and not die. Plus, the extra damage may even make AP shots an OHK. Does anyone know?.

Not sure what I expected from this thread, but it hasn't really gone anywhere.

ZOE was a flawed concept from the start. I mainly say this because of the agility buffs that ZOE gave. That added agility is not something a max should have (barring charge since it has a short duration and long cooldown). The damage buff doesn't mean much, so I won't bother addressing it. The armor debuff wasn't a big enough disadvantage before the agility was nerfed, but now the agility it gets doesn't outweigh the armor debuff.

My point is that the agility buff is too hard to balance. Either it's OP like it was, or it's utter trash like it is now.

I would really love for them to just rework the VS max ability from scratch. I want them to have something neat and interesting. Most anything I've thought up just sounds OP. Since this game has a lot more verticality than PS1, jump jets might not be a good idea.

Could we instead have a thread about ideas for a replacement or rework? All this thread seems to be is a bunch of arguing about just how op ZOE was and how bad the VS have it since they don't have a decent max ability (worth noting that the NC and TR max abilities aren't really all that great either).

Zealot Overdrive Engine, is the skill of vanu max that was nerfed not to the point of useless, but to the point of combat disadvantage since makes you to take more damage rewarding nothing.

If I remember back to the nerf days, the math done on it means that the shots/kill for the AI weapons is decreased by 1 even at the short ranges. Not 1 volley (both arms) but 1 single shot difference. This was why most ZOE users never considered the damage buff to be the mainstay of the ZOE... in fact, we didn't care about it at all during the heyday of ZOE OP'ness. It was fully the maneuverability and on/off nature of ZOE that was the defining reason.

I remember back during the initial nerf talks that I said that it ZOE would still be worth it if the damage was decreased by 1 STK instead of increased because the mobility was the selling factor, not the damage.

The Max in general trades armor and better firepower for mobility.... and the ZOE negated that inherent tradeoff... that's why it was OP. A ZOE Max could do hit and run tactics against small groups of infantry... run in, flip zoe off... kill,kill,kill then run out. It could also chase down the infantry that it bumped into that tried to run. The major reason I loved it, however, was the ability to change positions in a fight while not under fire. If I needed to get from one airpad of a biolab to another, flip ZOE on and run there, need to use a different door entering a building, ZOE to the other door, then flip off when walking into the room.

Combine that with the blueshift's superior medium-range fighting and you could use ZOE to keep your distance and run away if you were getting outnumbered. With the full nerfs to ZOE, Back to Charge we went... since Charge is sufficient at it, just not as all-the-time useful that pre-nerf ZOE was.



Personally... leave the damn ability in the trashbin... I don't trust SOE to buff/nerf/change/adapt ZOE into a useful balanced ability. I'd rather them leave all 3 in the trashbin than mess up the Max/Infantry balance that we have right now. (The biggest issue right now is resource system based)

IDK, i see a lot AA MAXes using it, anyway, i feel like no one cares about NC except nerfing part

fun fact:
Bursters don't receive the Soft Point Ammo perk from ZOE.
ZOE just changes nothing about Bursters.
it just makes you easier to spot for the airchavs