(Some) of the Current Systems Formulas

How big are Spell Doublecast hits compared to the original ones?

If the rule was just "without AbMod" then - with AbMod over the cap - the doublecast hits would be ~50% of the original value.

But for AA damage parts the doublecast hits can be 100%. (are they always?)

And for spell damage (== as in "learned by a spell book") it seems to be less than 50%. So are spell base value enhancing and spell crit value enhancing AAs (and maybe even food and drink) not calculated in as well?

Here an example (stripped off all buffs and items which would temporarily affect the parse):

Code:

(1389811680)[Wed Jan 15 19:48:00 2014] YOUR Crystal Blast critically hits training dummy for 218323 magic damage.
(1389811680)[Wed Jan 15 19:48:00 2014] YOUR Crystal Blast critically hits training dummy for 222122 magic damage.
(1389811680)[Wed Jan 15 19:48:00 2014] YOUR Crystal Blast critically multi attacks training dummy for 75237 magic damage.
(1389811680)[Wed Jan 15 19:48:00 2014] YOUR Crystal Blast critically multi attacks training dummy for 230590 magic damage.

1st hit is the normal spell hit (normal spell as in "learned from spell scroll")
2nd hit is the Crystalline Destruction hit (~100% as listed green in the Spell description ) randomly available, from AA
3rd hit is the doublecast from 1st hit (just ~35%)
4th hit is the doublecast from 2nd (~100%)

/shrug

Doublecast will only trigger a single additional hit, and I did not think the math changed on the second. I believe, if I'm reading the Conjy Prestige and your comments correctly, Cystalline Destruction was up for all of this so you got two CDestruction hits out of it.

I'm thinking your hits are CBlast (initial), CDestruction, CBlast (doublecast), and CDestruction again.

Not sure why the one is lower though, as it doesn't mention resists or anything and I don't think variance can take this into account. That's about a 300% difference, what's your Crit Bonus and Potency?

Thanks, right, yeah the 4th hit could be a CD for the CB multi hit.
All my other multi hits without crystalline destruction in that parse looked like 1st + 3rd hit.
With the multi-hit hitting for in average 35% of the 1st hit.

It was a synthetical test vs epic dummy where i stripped all my proc items and buffs as well as the pet (debuff).
This parse i did just for verifying the 2nd half of the DPS formula "from-spell-examine-to-parsed value".
So i didn't look at pot / int values. (well i think i have them somewhere in some table ... ).
cb was 423.9 and pot was around that as well i think (slightly higher).

Spell examine showed 32897-38631.
the crit multiplier would be the sum of
423.9 cb / 100
the base muiltiplier of 1.5 for spells as conjuror
food+drink 0.06
AA dragon 0.15
AA summoner 0 for crit increase (just a base damage increase)
AA shadows 0.05 for crit increase
AA conju Crystal Blast only:0.05
AA shadows Crystal Blast only: 0.10
and equal to 6.099.

So my calculation of parsed hits would be (listed * crit multiplyer) = 200638,80 to 235610.47.
The calculated max hit did fit perfectly to my parses, (( but btw the min hits would sometimes be even lower (although my Disruption skill was way above 475 )).

What i am asking is:
Some time ago some people in some other thread explained the lower doublecast hit values by "AbMod is not calculated into Doublecast hits".
But then the doublecast hit would be (with AbMod above cap) - roughly 50% of the real hit.
Bad thing is i measured 35% not 50%.
So some other stuff must be stripped off the spell's doublecast hit value as well.

When i reduce the formula to non-AA and non-food stuff like:
crit multiplier = (4.24 + 1.5) =5.74
and remove 50% ABMod from the listed value (32897 to 38631) -> (16449 to 19316),
the DC hits still should be 5.74 * (16449 to 19316) = 95514 to 110871.
But my measured doublecast hits (~ 75237) are still lower.

SOOO: i guess in order to explain the small 35% hits i have to strip off not just AbMod and crit damage affecting AAs, but all other AA-based "base damage affecting AAs" as well from the spell's 16449 to 19316 (50% of what is listed without AbMod) in order to come closer to the parsed value.

So actually Crystal Blast doublecast hits would hit for crappy low 35% only (and not closer to 50%), because Crystal Blast is enhanced by so many AAs.
Can anyone confirm this please?
( When i look at other spells which are not affected by that many AAs, their doublecast hits hit for more than 35% of the intial hits )

what is formula for Spell damage is it Base X Primary stat Bonus X potency + effective abmod X Crit bonus?

ugh I can never get quoting to work here..

Thand, that more or less sums it up.

((baseDmg * (1 + Potency/100) * (1 + PrimaryStatBonus)) + effectiveAbilityMod) * (innateCB + CB/100)

Interesting.

My understanding of doublecast is that it would not consider ability modifier. Assuming a base damage increase of 50% from ability modifier, this would result in a damage rating of 66% of the original value.
Doublecast Damage/(Normal Damage) = 1.0/1.5 = 66%

But your data shows a value much lower than this... It is possible that double cast does not consider AA enhanced critical bonus/potency/etc. modifiers in addition to ability mod, and no one noticed before as these values are typically very small. Does this theory align with your data?

go-go-gadget koko!

The critical bonus/potency values from AAs would have to be huge (e.g. 1k+) for this to hold. Theory debunked!

New theory: base values for CD are shifted when the spell double casts.

If the spell doublecasts are summed then redistributed, the doublecast damage is approximately 69% of the initial hit which would align with our current understanding of ability modifier and doublecast mechanics (est. 66%). Do you have spell data for Crystal Destruction when it does not obtain a double hit, but does doublecast?

Crystal Destruction happens only about every 10 times i cast Crystal Blast. There is a red message about that in chat window when it is active.

And every multi hit in that parse were 70kish.
So nearly all my doublecast Crystal Blast hits in my parse the look like about 1st + 3rd of above log snippet:

YOUR Crystal Blast critically hits training dummy for 218323 magic damage.
YOUR Crystal Blast critically multi attacks training dummy for 75237 magic damage.

Oops, you meant the other way around?
CD without double?
That looks like 1st + 2nd of the above parse lines.

YOUR Crystal Blast critically hits training dummy for 218323 magic damage.
YOUR Crystal Blast critically hits training dummy for 222122 magic damage.

This is really weird to me. I'll do some digging and will get back with you.

thanks a lot

mabey the 75k was a partial resist is it possible that the Destruction skill is not being accounted for the minimum damage thus a larger spreed. I will have to check but it seems that the Dc second cast seems way lower on higher level mobs

Any possibility in getting some statistical information regarding the Accuracy stat?

What would you like to know about it?

How exactly the % figure works.

If 10% of my attacks are missing, with 0 Accuracy, if I gain 50% accuracy, will only 5% of my attacks miss?
Is it on a linear curve?
Does 100% accuracy guarantee no misses (Ignore avoidance blocks ofc).

All testing I've done previously shows big gains from 0-20%, but hardly any gain above 20%.

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to be wrong.

First off, most forms of avoidance (parries, ripostes, shield blocks, deflection) come into play before accuracy is even considered. Then, we have what's called a Weapon Accuracy Mult; for melee weapons this is just 1.0, for ranged weapons it includes the hit bonus from your ammo. Accuracy is then added onto this. So if you had 20% accuracy for example, your mult increases from 1.0 to 1.2. Then we calculate your chance to hit based off of your target's defense skills. These are modified by what they con, any base avoidance bonuses, and so forth. So, using your character and a level 100 Commander Corpsemaul as a test, when you've taken a swing at him and made it past his other avoidance checks, you have a 87% chance to actually hit him. We then multiply that by your weapon accuracy mult, so:

your chance to hit = 0.87 * 1.2 = 1.044.

Then we roll between 0.0 and 1.0 and check that against your chance to hit. Obviously 1.044 is greater than 1.0, so you successfully land your hit.

Where, if at all, would weapon skill come into play? Does it factor into determining that 87%?

Does this same process apply to other 'swings' such as riposte or flurry?

kono

How about helping all of us who are just not good with numbers, formulas, etc. (I actually get a panic attack the more I try to figure out all the stats.) Give us colors on the 30+ stats similar to conning a mob. Green way low, blue low, white is okay, yellow is high and red is way over cap. That way the number folks can have fun tinkering to their hearts content but those of us who's minds don't do numbers can still have an idea as to how to progress.

Thank you!

So I take it the % chance to hit a mob based on level is constant throughout? As level 100 is 87%, I'd estimate level 104 is 80% ish. Or is this something you'd not share?

Also - Is there a cap on how much % you can increase a chance to hit, by defense debuffs etc?