Didnt have time to read the whole conversation.... but to the author: please kill yourself and roll a different class, thank you I am MT as a zerker as often as not, even if I'm not I out DPS most of the raid (1000-3000dps, depending on grp) And to say that Guards can hold aggro better than me.... I can't even read this [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] anymore
Honestly the only raids I sit out from are ranged raids against certain contested mobs or raids I volunteer to sit out from. Otherwise I am in the dps group 9 out of 10 times. I'm sorry to see so many people saying our dps is really low. It has dropped alot from what is was before the combat changes but against single target mobs my dps is still decent using dual wielders (especialy after the upgrade to them) or two handed weapons. Against group encounters (quite a few of them in raid instanced zones) I can be in the top 5 for dps most of the time. Using rampage and/or open wounds, plus our other AoE ca's, I can beat out most scouts and quite a few casters on total dps on a group encounter. Plus I can off tank if needed or tank the raid mob for a short period of time should the MT fall. I went as offensive as possible when I re-speced after the combat change because I knew my guild would still be using a guardian as our MT on raids. All my upgrades to my equip are based on STR first and then STA. I look to do as much damage as possible as quick as possible and if I draw agro I don't lose much sleep over it because I can take a few hits until the MT can get agro back. The only thing I do in that case is move to the MT's side so the raid mob is still positioned correctly and if I have to, turn off my auto attack for a second or 2 to help the MT get agro back.
"Sure STR is great in pick up groups and what not, but not when MT'ing, not that much at all. And what your going to say is "Gives you more power, kills mob faster, blah" You count on OTHER classes to do these things..." hello...the whole point of being a zerker (to me anyway) is that we don't have to rely solely on the heavy dps classes to be doing all the damage because we are actually contributing a substantial amount of it ourselves, even moreso when we are the MT. "the MT is there to take hits and press taunts." i disagree. not if you're a zerker. maybe that's all a guardian does but guess what we are not guardians. that is exactly why i chose the zerker class over the guardian. zerkers are the more offensive tanks. we are not supposed to just stand there and take hits like a guardian. and more str means more power for taunts and other useful ca's such as the extra mit and def buffs we get (when they are needed since they reduce our attack speed) as well as offensive ca's that debuff and do damage. "Run out of Power? Mana stone, Mage battery." um...manastone only gives you back 160 points of mana (that's less than 1% of my power pool) and can only be used every 3 minutes? rofl. i still use anyway it but it's not all that great. and you assume that your mages will always be willing and able to med your power every time you run out? come on. "Kill mob faster? Taunt more and give your heavy DPS classes more leash." in most cases a zerker will not be able to keep aggro from any heavy dps classes if all they do is stand there and do nothing but taunt. unless they use IG and/or rescue on every pull which is not practical. you have to use your damage ca's as well, on a regular basis. that's what we are all about. our taunts are decent and we certainly need to be using them as much as possible but we need to be doing some dps as well. Message Edited by infernus006 on 12-05-2005 12:35 PM
I would love to be the MT on raids! At one point I thought I was better than any other tank class, but, I guess I'm wrong, as are all of you, Plz read this thread linked and you will see what I am talking about. its strait from SOE. click this link and scroll down about half way to find it. or just read what he wrote below the link. http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/...essage.id=29477&view=by_date_ascending&page=1 Fighters are tanks. They don't all tank the same, and tanking isn't all they do, but that doesn't change the core role all fighters share. While some might envision a different approach, that role isn't going to go away just because some might prefer a different take on certain classes. The combat revamp isn't just a changing of balance numbers; it is a reevaluation of abilities. For fighters, this means some expanded spell lines, some shifting around of abilities from one subclass to another, and changes to the way defensive buffs work. Right now, guardians are far and away the best tank due to a combination of their buff stacking and the way defensive buffs are seen in combat rolls. Both those aspects are changing. Think of the guardian's abilities as being spread around a bit to the other fighter classes. In no particular order (other than pairing subclasses of the same class), here are a few (but not all) of the ways tanks will be distinguished from one another after the changes take effect. Guardians will have the greatest capability to grant their defense to others. They also have a greater number of taunts. Berserkers will do more damage than guardians, especially when tanking. While they also have taunts, part of their taunting comes from the damage they do. Paladins have heals and a nice array of taunts. Shadowknights have lifetaps and higher damage than paladins. Monks excel in avoidance, and their ability to purge negative spell effects is being expanded. Bruisers mitigate a bit better and do more damage than monks, which again is the basis for part of their taunting ability. All fighters will have useful defensive and offensive stances that they can choose depending on their role in the group. Additionally, each fighter will gain a significant resistance to a particular type of damage, which should make different classes be desirable under certain situations. Again, this isn't about taking away tanking from guardians. I suspect after the revamp, in a lot of raid situations you'd still want a guardian as main tank. However, the changes should give more flexibility to other tank classes, and give situational advantages to each. Personally, I'm looking forward to that. =========================== Steve Danuser, a.k.a. Moorgard Game Designer, EverQuest II He points out that Guards will always be better than us. And honestly I think we were better before the huge revamp of all the classes, We had ALOT of utlity to bring to a raid I was always asked to be in the MT group for my buffs and that is fine with me, I enjoyed tanking in small groups and I was very useful in raids , as it stands right now Zerkers are lucky to get into the DPS group of a raid, and its only melee DPS that we affect, not casters. Take a look again at our utility, its all based on helping melee. I guess we are fine when it comes to just a normal gorup (even though our - group STR buff (melee only), Group mitigation buff (should only be for me or melee only, caster/healer should stay out of range) , Group HP regen buff (we have a healer, why bother) and Group being able to go berserk buff (again melee only) are completely pointless when it comes to small groups, /sigh I really really really want to love my zerker, but SOE just makes it soooo hard for me.
^ omg...i think it's hilarious you know how to copy and paste but not how to read. check this out... "He points out that Guards will always be better than us." um no. actually try reading what he said: "Right now, guardians are far and away the best tank due to a combination of their buff stacking and the way defensive buffs are seen in combat rolls. Both those aspects are changing. Think of the guardian's abilities as being spread around a bit to the other fighter classes." he said "right now" (as in before the combat revamp when that post was actually written). duh? furthermore he goes on to say that is changing (in the combat revamp). "Think of the guardian's abilities as being spread around a bit to the other fighter classes." how did you miss that? "Berserkers will do more damage than guardians, especially when tanking. While they also have taunts, part of their taunting comes from the damage they do." exactly. this does not make us weaker tanks than guardians, just different. more offensive. the way we were meant to be. "Again, this isn't about taking away tanking from guardians. I suspect after the revamp, in a lot of raid situations you'd still want a guardian as main tank. However, the changes should give more flexibility to other tank classes, and give situational advantages to each." yeah. the whole point being they watered down guardians a bit in the combat revamp so they wouldn't be as overpowered and gave new abilities to other fighter classes to help them be even better tanks than what they were before. in other words so guardians wouldn't be the only choice for MT anymore, and that includes on raids. honestly i think some of the so-called zerkers who post on this forum should really have been casters instead. get yourself some in-game int to make up for your severe lack of it in rl. Message Edited by infernus006 on 12-05-2005 02:20 PM
^ yes druids (wardens and furies) get a buff that they can apply to a single groupmate that ups their offensive melee skills (crushing, piercing, and slashing). the zerker dps buff is a group berserk buff that applies to every member of the group and allows them to proc berserk the same way that we do and it not only increases their offensive melee skills but also their attack speed at the same time. and i see no reason why the skills would not stack with each other. the only thing i'm really not sure about is if they have to get hit for the berserk buff to proc like we do with our personal one. Message Edited by infernus006 on 12-05-2005 03:59 PM
"um...manastone only gives you back 160 points of mana (that's less than 1% of my power pool) and can only be used every 3 minutes?" You sure about that?
well then. All i gotta say is that your journey from lvl 1-60 has been meaningless. The reuse timer on Manastone is 60 secs. Good-day.
^ oh yeah you're right! i double-checked it tonight, it gives 150 health points back and has a 60 second reuse timer. wow my mistake...my life is totally useless now...i guess i should just go and commit suicide! but guess what...that's still pretty darn crappy lol. so shove it. it is a gray item from a lowbie hq so what do you expect? oh yeah and don't forget it takes away a lot more health than the amount power it gives back so in most cases it's not even remotely worth using in combat. i use it between pulls to help with out of combat power medding and that's about it. Message Edited by infernus006 on 12-06-2005 11:10 AM
Wow, congrats on your 16,000 point power pool! :smileysurprised: Of course, I'd probably still run out of power if I had that much. My Manastone is hotkey #1 for good reason. najena.konk Message Edited by konofo on 12-06-2005 08:54 AM
"Wow, congrats on your 16,000 point power pool!" ok first of all i was the one that posted that not him, he was just quoting me. and that is a corret, 160 is less than 1% of 2700 (the amount of power points i normally have). do the math it's not that hard. but since in reality it only replenishes 150 points of your power hmm let's see...that is almost .06% of my total power assuming that it is exactly 2700 (when in reality it is a bit more than that so really the percentage is even lower since the bigger your power pool is the lower the percentage will be). and in raids i have closer to 4k of power so um...rofl. another thing splint, maybe you forgot the fact they changed the effect on manastone after the combat revamp so it used to be different than what it is now. so screw you!
Thanks, I fixed my quoting oversight. I knew who the quote was from, but neglected to fix it. Since I'm feeling helpful today, here's some percentage assistance from Dr. Math. najena.konk
^ ok you are right, i appologize math is not my strong point (forgot to move the decimals). so i was wrong about the exact percentage. but anyways, like i said, i still use it but imo it's not all the great. it's not supposed to be at higher levels. but the whole point was that splint keeps trying to say that str does not matter one bit for the mt in a raid so a zerkers group str buff is totally useless. he says who cares if str gives you more power because you can rely soloely on manastone and the mages in your group to med your power all the time. i still disagree with that very much. Message Edited by infernus006 on 12-06-2005 12:01 PM
Yeah, I'd say strength does matter in that role, but it's not the top priority. Being able to mix in more attacks along with your taunt cycle is a good thing, as is getting more damage (and aggro) from the attacks you do. najena.konk
I MT virtually all the time, and virtually any setup we use, I have well over 400str (usually 500, occasionally up to 700). As the cap for str at level 60 is 440 for effecting both damage and power pool, it doesn't do anything at all for me when tanking. However, it does benefit other members of the group and Berserker buffs are very nice for melee DPS groups.
Ok and your the one talking about INT in real life ohh let me quote: "honestly i think some of the so-called zerkers who post on this forum should really have been casters instead. get yourself some in-game int to make up for your severe lack of it in rl." and if you cant tell I was being completely facetious in my post then your the one who need RL INT. Don't be a male reproductive organ!
