Nuladen@Lucan DLere wrote: Oh man, now that's either: 1. Amazingly good news 2. Amazingly evil messing with our minds Either way, 10/10 to Rothgar /crosses fingers
Curious, when and where were Rothgar's comment posted? Given Rothgar's comments about it not being his area, I am sure the arrow part was just because he didn't cull the quoted material, but it is a straw to grasp at, you are right.
Wish I could have faith in this tinyest bit of hope, but I feel as if I have lost faith with the devs having a clear destination for our class.
Yes, it really does seem like he just didn't cut off the bit about arrows from the original quote. If anything, this post is an indication of just how desperate the Ranger community is for a solution. That alone should spur some action from the devs. Personally, I'm giving it til GU43, then I'm either betraying or cancelling my account. I've played a ranger since the game released and this is prehaps the most frustrating thing I've ever had to deal with in any MMORPG I've ever played.
Nah, it was meant as a tounge in cheek post, I think it's pretty obvious that Rothgar included it by mistake, I just like pointing out daft stuff like that
Amenti wrote: It killed me the other night I was having a conversation with my Guild's highest lvl Necro and Swashie. They were trying to say we weren't broken. The swashie of course spoke of "balance" until I pointed out the arrow mechanic issue. Now even though clearly she isn't going to say "yes Rangers should be able to out parse me" even she had to say it "well thats silly" but still insisted everything else was about "balance". The necro INSISTED that we were just the scouts Necro or Conjuror got all Quiet like when I mentioned that she at least has spells like Eternal Chains. She finally said "you have a root" and I said yeah "trap" which takes 3 minutes to recharge if I don't take an AA, I need to lay it where I stand AND thats it. Then I pointed out her pets, "well they are my dps"..."or tank" I responded. Things got a little quiet. Then I said "how about the group buffs like Favor of the Infernal or your Rez? ALL I have is dps, you get that and more. On equal levels you also have a decent chance of out parsing me if I don't spend the gross national product of Guatemala on poisons, arrows and have some raid gear on TOP of the arrow mechanic issue." Positively crickets at that point. I do think that Rothgar's appearance and comments on our forum followed by the apparently reluctant appearance of our dev, gives me a little bit of hope. Whether it will be GU 43 though I don't know. I'm going to give it until 44 myself. Just the arrow mechanic being fixed would do wonders at this point but if they are going to fix that issue with a new recepie its not enough. They still don't seem to get the fact that having to spend money of poisons and arrows to do your damage is a long term liability. How many people would play Assassins if everytime they used a Combat art it took 1% off of their dagger and it had to be repaired?
Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote: Anyone who disagrees that rangers are broken after being educated on them, is a moron and knows nothing about class balance and MMOs. Either that or they cannot see beyond their own overpowered (in case of the swashie) character to see the health of the game. Everyone in my guild agrees (and most sane and rational people) that rangers are broken and not working as intended.
Inclusion of that was just an oversight. GU 43 has some nice new features but from a balance perspective there are just some minor changes. The most significant for you guys was upping the range of some of the bard songs so they don't drop when you are behind the large dragons in vp. Your concerns are pretty broad from weapon scaling to ranger utility and desirability so its not something I can do in the short time we had between epics and gu43 but that doesnt mean its not on the radar either.
Aeralik wrote: Careful, Aeralik, this might actually start to appear as if we are having an on going communication with a dev... sets a bad precedent. That said, I totally agree that in the short time between epics and GU43 means that you haven't had enough time. Has there been a single new issue brought up, though, since the release of KoS? While I agree that rangers have gotten louder- I, for one, never bothered to post on this issue prior to the pain becoming excruciating under RoK- I don't think any of these issues is new or recent. So please don't put forward that there hasn't been enough time since epics have been released as being a good reason, unless you are suggesting that when Rothgar said these issues (such as arrow mechanics) were being looked into over a year ago was just something to hopefully shut the rangers up and make them stop bothering the obviously overworked devs. I do thank you for your response, however, and wish to express my appreciation for the forewarning that attending the dev roundtable will be a waste of my time and that letting my subscription not renew on March 1 won't cause me to miss out on anything. My toon can go into suspended animation until something meaningful gets done and, if Warhammer hasn't stolen your ranger business out from under you, maybe I will be back later.
Aeralik wrote: Good to see a post even concerning us, but I must ask, this has been 'On the Radar' since the very start of RoK (hell even before then if you consider how long arrows have been the way they are), so when is someone going to take note of what's on the radar and do something about it? Pushing this off in the same way (it's a tough problem, it's on the radar..I forget what other excuses have been used to be honest) is only making people more irate, and giving them reason to just quit. Just a list of possible fixes would be nice, we're being left in the dark here, a candle would be nice
Aeralik wrote: Well thanks for responding and letting us know that something (small as it may be) is happening in LU43, but again these issues are not new, so to say that the only time you had was between epics and LU43 just isn't true. These problems have been around for a long time. What is new is, as others have said, rangers becoming louder about the problems due to them becoming that much more intolerable in RoK. I strongly encourage you to, in the future, deal with such underlying problems before they become soul-crushingly crippling so that you're not in the position of having players needing you to urgently deal with them at the starts of expansions (i.e. points of major change that can bring underlying problems to the surface) when there are also going to be many other issues that need to be addressed even more urgently at these times. Basically, I really think you guys need to be more forward-thinking in how you handle combat balance and what you do about player concerns and when you do it. Again, thanks for posting with some details of small upcoming changes (it's a good change, although you really, really ought to reverse the nerf to the ranger epic's minimum range, as well), but significant action is long, long overdue at this point. -Azleya, Ranger and Officer of Strike Lucan D'Lere
lilmohi wrote: Agreed. I don't need rangers to be the be all and end all of DPS, but if the majority of Rangers aren't going to have a fighting shot (meaning they actually have to be good at their class and understand there is more to this game then button mashing) at being right at the top of the parse against even lesser geared toons of other classes most of the time, then we need utility that makes us more desirable to have in raids AND groups other than just being a body to fill a slot. I am willing to accept either direction. I will even check back in and read the forums to see which direction they choose to take in the future.
Azleya@Lucan DLere wrote: Had to single this post out for the simple fact that this problem has been exactly that a problem for a year plus now. This only goes to further prove that devs dont understand the ranger class, and that the loud are the only ones to get fixed in EQII. : ( : (
Why not just grab 3 or 4 rangers, both raiding and non raiding, and copy to test with some lvl 77 arrows and just see what they can do. Test rangers in full VP fabled with M1 spells and mythical eagles talon, then test a ranger in legendary with A3s with fabled eagles talon, then test a quested only ranger with A1s and A3s mixture with something like the faction bow from tarrens grasp. Try against even con solos, heroics and epics, yellow con solos, heroics and epics, and orange con solos, heroics and epics. Lets find out just how much more DPS they can do. I would recommend taking someone who plays the ranger class so you can use auto attack to its fullest. Maybe the fix is as easy as making 77 arrows. maybe the fix is lowering the damage of all arrows, and making 77 arrows.
Shaulin Dolamite wrote: Nah, if that were the case dirges would have manaburn by now, since I ask him for that every time he comes by my office. He's even proved immune to cookie bribery! Darn you rangers taking priority ... one day dirges will get manaburn ... /shakes fist
So, extending the bard's epic range helps us now? I sure hope that means you fixed it so the dps proc works off ranged.. along with all other item procs.
....................... He's talking about the range of the gd bard buffs. You know how when you have to back way out on mobs like Xygoz and Phara Dar to get minimum range, you lose bard mana regen, crit buff, double attack buff, and cast haste buff? Well if he gets it right, you shouldn't lose any of those anymore when you do that. Btw Aeralik, you should also look at the ranges of things like enchanter mana regen (which does not reach far enough) and procs from the mystic and illusionist epics (I'm not sure if these reach far enough).
Aeralik wrote: mmmm, way to try to lay the blame back on Rangers for supposedly asking for too much. /sigh I don't understand why this is so hard to fix. Rangers are asking for 1 simple thing. Fix T8 ammo. *If* you can't do that for whatever reason, then yes give Rangers something else like better utility, but to be honest Rangers don't want that - they just want their DPS fixed in T8. It's nice I guess for the bard buffs to get this "fix" which I assume is just a larger range (?), and yes that will help the 1% of Rangers who are in VP but what about everyone else ? It doesn't seem like much to get excited about to me. Whilst the devs are "fixing" the ranges of bard songs, how about "fixing" heals/cures to have larger range too ? Hey, why not just remove range restrictions from everything, it would be great to melee mobs from the other side of the zone Of course, if the Epic bow hadn't been nerfed, then none of this work with the bard songs would have been necessary. Unless of course it's not being done for the benefit of Rangers... In summary, more smoke and mirrors, and no further progress on the ammo issue.
