Harvesting Changes Coming

Changes to skill ups - OK. I didn't think it was so bad but I can't see it hurting either.
Possibly looking at ratios of harvest types on nodes - maybe. But as pointed out one of the reasons the ratios are set as they are is to try to balance against usage. While leveling my tailor when I was harvesting to craft I wanted hides and hated when I got a streak of useless meat, but when doing the Gathering Obesession I wanted the meat - you can't have it both ways
But I have to agree with other posters that the proposed changes to harvest time are a massive nerf to tool desirablilty. I hop between mutiple alts, some high level who have access to the best tools and some low level ones that don't and sure I notice a huge difference in harvest time - it does feel very slow on the lowbies. But that is the point - it makes leveling up and hitting the milestone for the next tool mean something. A 0.1 difference between tools is virtually meaningless. There is no point in bothering with anything except the highest level one and even that won't make a huge difference.
Overall I think there are better ways to spend dev time than messing with harvesting.

Baubo@Unrest wrote:

Especially since it was flyable in Beta.

Frizznik wrote:

Hammer, meet nail ... I think we have a winner

Any comment on allowing nodes to despawn after a set time to help clear cherry picked zones out and reset? One of my favorite times to harvest is after the servers come back up from an update or a crash as I know I can go just about anywhere and not have to worry about there being a lack of any type of resource.
Can we revisit the amount of meat we find in dens? I know it was set that way on purpose, but because it was set that way, it has over reached its goal and now needs the pendelum to swing back in the other direction a little bit.
Could we have some meat added to the higher tiers dens? Not really sure why meats were removed from harvesting at higher levels. Ive not checked recipes, so if the higher recipes do not take meats, I can understand ... but still seems wrong to force the crafters to buy the meats from adventurers or to level adventuring themselves in order to stay in work.

Rijacki wrote:

Cove of Decay is a dungeon with harvest nodes, Bloodskull Valley is a dungeon with harvest nodes. Rivervale is not unique in this, and it knows perfectly well what it is: It is an open-air, non-linear progression heroic dungeon which provides opportunities for duos, small groups, groups and harvesters alike. The one thing it isn't is a predictable cookie-cutter overland solo zone with linear quests, and thank goodness for that. (EDIT: I just went into Rivervale to check it out for myself, and I'd say that 85% of the zone is quite easy to harvest solo. The only part of the zone that I wouldn't advise going into is where the fairies/treants live.. but you can easily harvest everywhere else, just stick to the roads or the river - if you can handle the solo mobs in the river - and get nodes on hills when mobs aren't looking. No problem. Oh, and watch out for Mangler.)
Anyway, as for the actual changes to harvesting.. I'm not keen on the changes to the base harvest time and the harvesting tools. Mainly because I would never buy a tool that reduced my harvesting by 0.1. Why bother, you know? I much prefer Umber's suggestions!

Umber@Guk wrote:

This is a much better solution. Makes it better than it currently is for new characters and vets, and keeps the desirablility of the tools (both sets, as tinkered tools come with + harvesting stats). Maybe the additional early level tool(s) could be added as rewards for the Gathering Obsession questline, if they're not added to woodworkers' recipe books.
I'd also like to see "collecting" added to the harvesting skills to get that 5 second time down too.
Great idea, Umber!

Umber@Guk wrote:

QFE.
Reducing the harvesting time for a new character? A good change.
Nerfing the desirability of the harvesting tools? A bad design choice.

15% Double Harvest, 100 skill, and 5% higher chance at rares for 2 hours would make a freaking awesome potion and really get my attention.

what i wish i like to see...
harvest nodes get increased from 3 pulls unit per node into 5 pulls unit per node, so that increase amount of raws gathered.
3 pulls so soon and you have to look for another nodes, so please make it 5.

In many ways harvesting comes with bonuses already built in: Chance of rare and multiple harvests. Also upper levels have access to tools, pack horses and gear that shave off harvest overhead. Why do they need more? I think that the plan as stated helps where it is needed and will let newbs experience the game more realistically and possibly stay to play with the rest of us, or a current player might be persuaded to level up a needed class for better guild balance. That's the bonus I'm looking for!
Right now the lower levels are operating at a handicap, which gives a distorted picture of how it plays at cap. IMHO beginning times should be easy, quick and less complex in comparison to the higher levels; not difficult, slow and confusing. Above all it needs to reflect the updates so that returning players don't feel like "nothing has changed."

feldon30 wrote:

/AGREE

Umber@Guk wrote:

I like this idea way better. It helps out crafters usefullness instead of making one more useful item pretty much obsolete.
Plus it will introduce new players to the broker sooner. You could have the information go out to the toons in the harvesting quest letter. "by the way, you can buy harvesting tools on the broker that increase your harvesting speed."
Edit: Oh, and by the way, in the lowest levels you get a whole lot more rares. So that can be considered a "new player bonus". Then as you level up they get scarcer and scarcer until they practically disappear unless you want to devote massive amounts of time to harvesting.

Katz wrote:

While I like this idea, a coding restriction prevents any effect from ever casting at more than twice normal speed. To whit, harvesting is base 5.0 (and stays such under your suggestion) the fastest it can go, period, is 2.5 (which it hits with tools). So your suggestion of 3.0 speed tools, while nifty, would be useless (can't make harvesting any faster than 2.5, ever.)
The change as detailed results in the same time as is, but also means that those racial harvesting abilities actually make a difference to harvest speed (which they currently don't once you get tools) since the drop to 3 second base results in a 1.5 second absolute cap.

As another alternative if you must alter harvesting:
Set the base at tier 1 to 2.5 secs but have it increase by 0.3 to 0.5 sec per tier.
Have tools at each tier that would reduce the time by the same amount so that harvesters would have to upgrade their tools each tier in much the same way that adventurers have to.
Have the tools craftable and useable at x9 and only apply to their tier or above.
So a tier 2 tool would be available at level 9 (artisan so all trades could make their first tool) and grant a 0.3 - 0.5 bonus to harvests from tier 2 and above.
This meets the goal of reducing the time for new players while also providing a reason to get new tools.
Of course the existing system probably doesn't allow for this kind of progression on harvest times so it may be a bridge too far.
Edit: The restriction on only applying to their tier and above is probably a little restrictive - if there was a cap of 2.5 sec plus any racial bonus then it wouldn't be needed. But you would need to prevent a high level tool insta-popping low level nodes.

Adeyia@Antonia Bayle wrote:

I harvest for the rares and to sell mats. Some of the t9 items on my server get up to 1g each on the broker just for roots and lumber at least.

Anobabylon@Oasis wrote:

I agree 1000% percent. I have only been able to force myself to help the brat in Mara 3 times mostly due to the fact I want to shoot myself when I get to the rivervale harvests. Everytime I go there is a lack of beast dens and if i harvest all the other stuff some idiot in the zone goes and takes the dens as they pop. grrrrrrrrrrrrr

With all the other thinsg wrong or broken at the moment I really don't know why you are wasting time/effort on something this trivial.

feldon30 wrote:

I agree that having the gear should account for a better than 1-2% chance of getting a rare.....considering aquiring all the harvesting gear takes quite a bit of effort.
However.... rares aren't very rare anyways. No, I don't go out harvesting for 10 hours at a time but I think my record was 22 t9 rares in 2 hours of harvsting. To me that isn't very rare considering you could go hours and hours without seeing 1 rare back in t5.
Lower tier rares cost a lot because there is nobody harvesting those tiers...not because it is difficult to find them. Making rares easier to find will not bring down the price of t1-t8 stuff.

Cloudrat wrote:

I also /agree. I hate the days I decide to devote to harvesting rares to just walk away with 1 or 2 after hours and hours of harvesting lumber for the t9 rare.

Hissyfit@Oasis wrote:

I want to come harvesting with you!! I think the best I have ever walked away with is 4 in about 3 hours and half of those came right at the end close together.

Frizznik wrote:

I would probably buy them all day if they 1. were cheap enough 2. gave me max skill with the possibility of skill ups.
Second harvest chance would be awesome, but not a must.
What I absolutely hate about harvesting is running around in grey zones getting mats that I don't need 'just for skill ups' If I could harvest in my current tier and even get 'nothing but the chance of skillups' I would be happy with that system.
Max skill on 5 of my 20 level 90s is enough build up for a skill, I just skip harvest quests on the other chars.

SIERRYA wrote:

I have always been lucky harvesting on a particicular character and only that character. I truely believe that each character has a luck number attached to it.
I am not saying I have had nights like you but I do normally end up have an exceptional night every now and then.
It was pretty funny that night I got 22 rares... I was complaining in /gu asking people if they knew a way to shut off the rare sound because it was becoming annoying.

SIERRYA wrote:

I never harvest for rares. If I'm harvesting for skillups or for a daily quest and I pull one I consider it a bonus for the day, but I never harvest because I need a rare. If I need a rare or 10, I buy them. And this is why I'd prefer an exp/ts/aa potion over the harvest potion. My ponies and guild harvesters keep up with my need for common raws and in the hours and hours it could potentially take me to harvest 2 eucalyptus I could buy them for 20p and make that money back in way,way less time.

Hissyfit@Oasis wrote:

Please tell me you are referring to things that are wrong with tradeskilling in general and not with the game over all?
First off let me state that I am by far not a "hardcore crafter". I am easy going and just do what I want to do. HOWEVER, I also am empathedic with players who have different playstyles than I do. I understand that there are "hard core raiders" and "hard core adventurers" and "carefree mix it ups" and "hard core crafters" and "hard core role-players" and just about everything inbetween. I am not concieded enough to think that my way of playing fits everyone. I am also not concieded enough to think that ALL of the devs attention should be spend "fixing" only the adventure parts of the game. If no resources were spend to better the crafting/noncombat community, then they would loose TONS of customers.
I really hope that you are referring to things that are broken with tradeskilling and not suggesting that the devs spend all of their resources fixing the combat aspects of the game before they throw any resources to the noncombat players. That just IRKS the fire out of me.
I agree that the way this is being implemented is not going to make a lot of ppl happy. I really hope that the players' opinions are taken into consideration before this is implemented. There are a lot of ways that this outcome can be achieved w/o nerfing woodworkers/tinkers necessity in the game. Tradeskill professions already are all but obsolete. Quit taking away from your noncombat player base or you are going to DESTROY this game!
You all are continually making this game easier and easier to appease the "give me give me" generation. And because every one of the "give me give me" generation feels that anything not combat related is not "worthy" and should be handed to them on a silver platter, you are completely meanializing the appeal of your noncombat aspects of the game and isolating a key portion of your player base.
Things like this should be brought to the community as "here's an idea we are working on ... give us feed back as to how you think it should be implemented" actually listen to your customers and take their ingame experience into consideration and try to work out a plan that can help make the game better rather than make it easier. But to say, "Okay, here is what Im going to do and I'll listen to you but not really listen to you, cause I like my idea and thats all there is to it." /sigh. you're talking about implementing this with gu60? Wow ... not a lot of room for your clientbase to give you ideas of how to improve or change your plan huh? To me that says you really dont care what the clients who actually play these classes and whos gaming experience is built on these aspects of the game feel about the changes. It tells me that you are more interested in making the "noob" as comfortable as possible. Yes, getting new players into the game is important, but not at the expense of your existing and loyal clientel.
/rant off ... sry ... didnt mean to go there but I got on a soap box and no one would help me down. (I also realize I switched from addressing hissyfit to addressing the devs w/o much distiction ... no, i realize hissy is not a dev, just to be clear)