Disappointed

Now let me ask you this to understand b/c you keep contradicting yourself. So you said you ran all t1 and t2 zones 5 of you in TOV gear and jewelry and even then they all were tanked by a beastlord and it was a cake walk at the release of AoM from the very beginning? Or was it hard really to do it in ToV gear? So what was it? Easy or hard? And now you 5 still wearing ToV gear to run t1, t2 and even t3 zones and they are all a cake walk? So what change you are talking about? If it was easy from the beginning and easy now nothing changed for your group then.
Or you all now exchanged your gear and jewelry for AoM heroic and zones just became an easy run?
This is what makes your comments to question by others.

As I understood t3 zones were not nerfed but they normally become easy to run in a newer gear. It's a gear progression and that's how it works. It's even more trivial if I get my EM raid gear on, but it doesn't mean the zone difficulty has been changed it's my survivability has increased and damage output.

Therefore, I am asking you again what was the point of your thread? If heroics are easy and have been easy for your group of friends why not to one group easy raid zones then in AoM? Plenty of challenge. I bet you may even change your tank to a real tank class

The quote below explains his point, which you already know and understand even if you don't agree with it.

I would like reply from OP about the difficulty then and now. That is what I asked OP at the very top of my comment. If you know and was in his group I will gladly accept your opinion. Were you? Was it easy for you in ToV gear then or was it a challenge? And how about now when you upgraded your gear to 4 green gemmed? Or are you still running groups in ToV equipment and it became easy just recently after a nerf? Thanks.

I guess things have become confusing as the different threads have come about and I replied in many of them. I can see where it looks like my story is moving all around the place, because I am answering/responding to different points across different time intervals (pre- or post- nerf).

We ran all of the tier 1 zones and tier 2 zones in mostly ToV gear. We could not kill Qworux in his original state (even doing 900k hps). This encounter was rightfully nerfed as it was clearly WAY over the top. After Qworux was specifically fixed, we cleared all tier 2 in mostly ToV gear. When I say mostly, we obviously put on upgrades as they dropped. This was using a paladin as our tank. The tier 1 Zavith'loa zones were a breeze even in the first week. Brokenskull tier 1 was also incredibly easy. We tanked those three zones in the first week with a paladin. Hoist of the Yellowjacket we cleared up to the x2 epic and then we went to bed. He beat the hell out of us. We later returned and killed him after doing more pulls and learning his mechanics a bit better. This fight was likely overtuned, but the fight was very fun and engaging. It was also tanked with a paladin. The tier 2 zones were actually a challenge. In Zavith'loa we could basically go into sleep mode and clear it, but High Hold, Resonance of Malice, and Thresinet's were actually challenging. They weren't ridiculous difficult (like an actual challenge/hard mode heroic zone), but we didn't just waltz through and 1-pull things like we did in Zavith'loa and Brokenskull. This was with a paladin tanking. We had not tried tier 3 at this juncture because we wanted to farm armor (green preferably) before trying those zones. We also had cleared all of the event heroics other than Choir. All of this with a paladin. Out of the event heroics only the Zavith'loa version was super easy. We had half our armor as green malice and likely full jewelry on everyone (even if it was worthless effect, but we wore for resists) except a few slots. I held onto a ToV wrist and ring up to last week.

All of the above paragraph was pre-nerf.

After the general zone nerf we went in to see how it had affected things. Tier 2 zones became tier 1 difficulty and tier 1 zones were equivalent to pulling Skyshrine contested. This was using a paladin. Our paladin didn't log in for about a week so we decided to test our beastlord tanking. Much to my surprise, he could tank every single tier 1 and tier 2. At this juncture most of us had half of our armor as green malice armor and full jewelry other than two of my personal slots.

All of the above paragraph was post-nerf.

Today I will finish my last piece of green malice armor. Our dps has certainly went up substantially, but we were clearing zones when I was still wearing some pieces of potent and two pieces of ToV jewelry. Many of our members are still using ToV weapons, both ranged and primary/secondary. It is in this state that our beastlord has tanked Sanguine Fountains. (I am aware that this zone was not nerfed. This zone is actually very easy, particularly in comparison to Choir and Inner Sanctum.)

Hopefully this has cleared it up. Prior to the nerfs there's 0% chance our beastlord could tank anything outside of perhaps Zavith'loa and Brokenskull. After the nerfs he can tank everything but Choir and Inner Sanctum. So initially all tier 2 and tier 3 zones were a challenge (Sanguine only the first time through) with Hoist of the Yellowjacket being an exception in tier 1. Now there are only two zones that are challenging. Gear does not account for these changes.

And we don't 1-group raid zones in this expansion because mobs have billions of hp. While it may be challenging, a 45-minute 0-failures allowed fight isn't something we're interested in yet. We may do it later, but for now we'll avoid 1-grouping raid content.

So, the point of the thread was to express my displeasure with the nerfing of the zones to cater to the lowest common denominator. The tier 1 zones were right where they should have been (except the x2 pirate...kragnok?) and the tier 2 zones were perfect after the Qworux fix.

I admit, based on the varying responses and tangents in the thread, it was difficult to figure out what was being run and in what gear they were being run with.

The point of my third paragraph is that if you dedicate enough time and focused attention on the xpac right out of the starting gates, you're going to be amongst the first people that begin to trivialize it. I'm not sure where the confusion comes from or the need for the condescending tone.

I don't have the luxury of being retired, so I can't dedicate much more than 3-4 hours a night (at the very max) to the game. Even then, that ends up being more like a couple of hours after I've afk'ed to help my sons with homework and all of those other parental duties. Thusly, I have a fairly compressed amount of time to run zones, harvest, named hunt, etc... I would have to say that there are likely quite a few people in the same position and my assumption is that you are an exception to the rule in many ways. There are others out there that can come and go in the game throughout the day as they are retired or home with a disability or what have you. I'm not sure if others in your group have a similar schedule, but it does certainly change the dynamic of how/when one can play the game.

Does any of this excuse the fact that many times nerfs go way past the point of reasonable in this game? No. This fact, however, should come as no surprise to anyone. It has happened repeatedly throughout the history of the game and will continue to occur until the game is no longer being updated. Blaming the whiners and the scrubs is typically an easy way to vent one's frustration over these sorts of things, but it is neither productive or justified. People should continue to provide constructive feedback about the game and not worry about the fact that a resulting nerf might be too much. It helps the overall growth of the game and is not irreversible.

A couple of points/questions:

1) The characters you link to on the first page include the paladin that you had tanking pre-nerf. I may have missed it, but did you 4-person the zones afterwards when the beastlord was tanking?

2) I think gear plays far more of a role in this than you give it credit for. The massive increase in STA/health, the resists, the procs. Having a defiler to heal is something you don't want to overlook either. The shaman wards have significantly improved this xpac.

3) You mention, in many places, that the Zavith'Loa instances are T2. They are not, nor do I think they ever were considered T2. In fact, we were clearing those with relative ease before even getting around to BSB. Resonance is not so much a challenge as it is a test of repetition. It was at first and it still is after the nerfs. Now, it just takes less mindless repetition than it did originally which I don't think is a bad thing.

1) While the paladin is gone we either four-man the zone or we bring in a friend that is a fury. I'll link her profile.

http://u.eq2wire.com/soe/character_detail/455266810837

2) I stated that we only had half the armor while doing this. We geared up (except the paladin) while having the beastlord tank. Yes, we use all of the classes present (myself being the defiler) to their full benefit.

3) Above I put Zavith'loa in tier 1. If I typed tier 2 somewhere I apologize as that was a mistake. I am aware that Zavith'loa is tier 1 and never assumed otherwise. Resonance wasn't incredibly difficult, but our tank lost hp. That isn't the case there now. This could be attributable to gear, but it coincided with the nerfs, so I'm going with that.

It used to be that you could just heal thru the avatars by loading the raid force up with 9 healers or so. They added in a mechanic to put an end to that. Loading up on heals can definitely change the pace of a fight an make it far more viable for odd group set-ups to work.

You're still giving the BL a lot more health and a lot better resists than he would have had beginning the xpac. This alone would have allowed him to push the limits on tanking even before the nerf. Add an extra set of heals/healer buffs (with a fair amount of DPS potential) in there and he should be nearly invulnerable.

I think it's attributable to a number of factors with both the gear and the nerf playing a part. Having a cohesive, well-geared guild group to run with on a consistent basis is also a very helpful thing. People running into difficulties and hoping for nerfs are typically running PuGs with poor group set-ups, possibly no VC or real coordination, etc.. There are a lot of tools and options in the game that help make things easier for people. Not everyone has access to them, however.

As the game population dwindles, guilds tend to shore up their membership and stick more closely together while those without guilds or in guilds with much less focus on progression, are left to grab hold of any grouping opportunity that comes up. Now, I don't think this sort of thing should direct how the game is developed, but the Dev team understands (and other players need to understand) that this is an increasingly more valid aspect of play. Especially with the F2P population. Casualization is a bummer, but it isn't going anywhere in the near term.

There are certainly less talented players out there than you and your group mates. There are also less dedicated players out there and players that don't have some of the luxuries you might be afforded in real life. All of them will run into obstacles in the game and make enough noise that content gets nerfed. It's a pity that it negatively impacts you and your group mates so much, but it happens and is much a part of the game as anything else.

No... I'll never see 4/4 blue, let alone 4/4 green... no never.

The combat in this game is too simple and saturated with abilities to be just tank and spank in every zone. There's no strategic thinking, you just mash buttons as they come off cooldown.

This thread cracks me up.

Is someone honestly trying to flex on the playerbase by using 3 healers in easy zones? LMAO What a joke.

The rest of the PUG groups were using solo healers to clear content pre-nerf, I can run T1 zones without a healer on my Paladin. Am I supposed to be impressed that a scout backed up by 3 healers is tanking? No. No one should be. This thread makes no sense because Scouts have been able to set themselves up to tank for several expansions, the thing is, THERE'S NO POINT BECAUSE THE GAME HAS FIGHTERS!

When you can solo heal your Beastlord, like the rest of us scrubs solo heal zones, then come back and tell us how it should be.

Given my group was discovering all the loot in these zones, let's not pretend you and I are playing on the same level.

We don't use three healers except in rare situations, as I've already explained. Cherry picking that single sentence and generalizing it to everything I've said tells me you're not interested in rational debate or conversation. It's equally amusing that you think a scout tanks as well as an actual fighter. That's the entire point of the thread. Our scout is tanking everything up through T3 without problems.

The content is catered to the lowest common denominator now. It's directed at the player that whines until content is made easier because they don't feel they should have to know their class, abilities, or mechanics. Now that's a joke.

I doubt you cleared Oss Event Heroic. Nobody can. I also doubt that you cleared Ssra event heroic without a tank. So I feel like you are exaggerating alot yourself. Not only others.
So you want to get every zone including T1 difficulty bumped up the way that nobody can clear it except for your group of friends? To what purpose? To be only ones to SLR loot or is there anything else? Would it be you like running one zone for 2 or 3 hours? Is that what you trully want?

I don't. I want a quick and painless run in heroics at least in t1 and t2 zones. I got enough pain in raids when we try new names and learn strategies. Way more pain than I would like but I put up with it b/c there is a challenge and I like it. I don't need the same everywhere in a game. Thank you very much.

Kraeref, he's not exaggerating. Read the rest of his reply above to clarify your other misconceptions.

Read my reply first before you pass judgement. I said that event heroics cannot be cleared w/o a tank. His post confirmed it.
So not all t3 zones they can clear on BL and even three healers. So w/е .

And as Gindoto said get one healer first to solo heal without a tank then talk about easy or hard.

There will always be a small percentage of players who can wiz through content with their eyes closed, solo heal, scout tanking, etc.....on the flip side there will always be players who need 3 healers and a tank to get through any zone......and then you have all the others in-between.....it's all the others who make up the majority of players in this game!!...they are not bad players nor are they top notch hard core but they are the majority in numbers and they are the ones the devs needs to look after because without that majority group this game is tanked.

The ossuary event isn't aimed at heroics players, firstly, so that's a complete red herring. The zone requires a full set of the best raid gear and specific class setup to even stand a chance. On top of that, it likely requires all kinds of near-to-full exploitation given how overtuned it is.

We have not tried the Ssra event heroic without a tank as the zone's loot is horrible. We have no reason to go there. I will suggest that we try it with Col tanking, but I suspect you won't rescind your doubts or acknowledge the success.

Easy and hard aren't predicated on your odd goalposts. Let's say we have him tank it with one healer, what will you do? Will you acknowledge that the zones are easy? We both know the answer is no. You'll simply move your goalposts and respond with something like "Try one healer with an illusionist tank!" It's a waste of my time to address a theater of the absurd.

I can spot the problem with your post rather quickly. This game was catered around the hardcore from the beginning. Hardcore has left this game in droves because they have changed and focused on that middle group of "can't be bothered" people. Most servers are lucky to have ONE high end guild now and that situation is getting worse by the year.

It is telling when the next EQ MMO has no raid content in it. The intentions are clear. SOE isn't interested in hardcore gamers. They want fluff players: barbie dressup and house decorators. The people that mindlessly consume marketplace purchases but play little of the content.

Oh and he has tanked all of the event heroics other than Ssra and Ossuary, for clarification.

So you want every zone to be overtuned then and nobody can clear any heroics? What's your proposal. That is why so many absurd posts here including mine. Because I still cannot get what kind of difficulty you need in AoM for your satisfaction?
Overtune every and each zone and more heroic players will leave the game. That's what you want? /shrugs. W/e. This thread was absurd from the beginning. Good day.