I'm closing in on 105 (103 at the moment) and beginning to wonder if I'm using all my tools correctly to maximize DPS. I got some good info from the Monk Spam Key thread, but it only covers the routine stuff that should always be clicked. This is where I'm at from that: Flying Kick - Autoskill Tiger Claw - Autoskill Banestrike, Doomwalker's Synergy, Stunning Kick, Zalikor's Fang, Vigorous Shuriken - Spam Key Drunken Monkey, Zan Fi - Manual (to manage end usage) This is where i begin to wonder how to mix things together properly. I made two more buttons for Burst and Full Burn. They are: Five Point Palm, Crane Stance - Burst Infusion of Thunder, Focused Destructive Force, Jab Through - Full Burn There might be one more thing on the Full Burn key but I don't remember. Ideally I would pop Drunken Monkey, Zan Fi, the Burst key, then the Full Burn key, and then Speed Focus Disc once Jab Through ends. It's complicated because you can only have one disc up at a time and Crane Stance, Jab Through, and Speed Focus are all discs. I had heard somewhere that Speed Focus was the best burn disc to use, but don't know for sure. Should I even be worrying about Jab Through? Are there things I'm missing here? Is there a better combination or order to do them in? Do any of these things affect Five Point Palm or Crane stance? I used to pop Jab Through, Infusion of Thunder, then FPP, and then just run whatever discs until it was dead. But adding in CS complicated that combo because it's a disc. Does 1H versus 2H matter for these decisions? I just upgraded my Ethereal Greatclub to a Will of Zan Fi last night so will use that to 105, but I have a couple good 1H weapons too. Mostly using 2H for the Staff Block benefits when pulling.
take off Jab Through and never look back. it's about as useful as Eight Breathes. put zan fi in your spam (it's down for half a minute every 8 or so). if you don't have a beastlord, SF/FDF is the best you can use. because of how cooldowns are, you can pretty much cycle using Dicho and IoT with Heel and SF (I also throw in First Spire in that but I know a couple that prefer second) If you really want to get as much burst as you can, pop IF/DMS/Dragon Balance then spam, click crane before the fk mod fades, start prepping for your next disc (hit iot), also use bp. once you use synergy a second time, click it off and hit sg, fdf, and dicho. I almost never do this since i hate wasting discs (only disc I ever click off is Earthforce). 2 handers benefit more from fdf as it only goes off of your primary and 2h is generally just better right now. eye of the storm isn't too great but should still be used between your burns. Earthforce is a great filler disc but isn't great for damage (only adds a small damage bonus but it also makes you fairly bulky while it's up and it gives you a rune that competely absorbs a set number of hits or spells) you should mess around and test rotations to see what you are most comfortable with. oh, don't neglect Wasp either
So it didn't occur to me until I read your post, but I didn't have all my discs. For some reason I thought Dicho was 105, but it's 101. Hadn't bought any EoK discs or the two in Plane of Tranquility either. I went and did all that yesterday, but now need to rework my buttons. If I'm understanding correctly, I should pair up Dicho with IoT, SF with FDF and 1st or 2nd Spire, and then cycle those with Heel. Or I could try the trickier combo with clicking off Synergy and all that. Will definitely play around with these options and see what I can do. Most of the time when grouping normal difficulty stuff I just use my spam key and Drunken Monkey. If we get a couple mobs and need to plow through faster I add in Zan Fi and maybe a random disc. I'll try moving Zan Fi to the spam key, not sure if the autogranted AA's got my reuse down low enough to keep it up nearly all the time or not. Other than the multiple mob situation, I really only go heavy for named mobs. So I want to make sure I setup keys that allow me to go a little heavy and a lot heavy when needed. Thanks for the tips.
Your overall output increases a ton when you change your mindset. You should be looking for opportunities to "go heavy" any time the buttons are up. "oho," you should say to yourself (or, you know, to your group), "I have some buttons. let's get some mobs and bring the noise!" Hopefully they're doing the same, and just like that, with no wild upgrades or whatever necessary, the group is killing like four times as many mobs over time. If the group needs discs for named? they're never that far away. If you've gone 20 minutes without Speeding, 15 minutes without Destructive Forcing or Heeling, all that stuff, then you haven't been all tactical and smart... you've just been multiple full burns' worth weaker. You don't need to jam everything on some single trash pull, but if single trash pulls don't accommodate discing, then you need to pull multiple mobs more often so that you can bring your character's full power to bear. One good way to do things is if you're grouped with a shaman, or with a bard, then try to line up a new set of something with each of their epic clicks. That's every 3 minutes like monk epic, you can have a disc each for at least the first three. When doing xp stuff, it's not exactly every 3 min, so maybe you full recycle when it comes again
For grouping, just save big burns for bad situations or for named mobs, otherwise what others said and what you have is just fine. 2 hander is only better if it is comparable stats and level as 1 handers. Dont go using a grouping 2 hander if you have EoK raid 1 handers. For raids, most is about surviving and bursting dps at the right times VERY fast. Almost every raid now involves switching targets, avoiding AoE's and emotes. Sustainable dps is not much of a thing for us, so just burst when is needed and most vital and learn when you are going to be switching targets soon and running to avoid AoE's.
I have people that complain at me for doing this...then if I do run my big burns on regular stuff, they complain at me for not having it ready for a name pop or a bad pull. Can't make some people happy.
the logic behind it is that if the group dies to a big pull or a hard named, you waste a lot more time than you using that disc on trash. Secondly, if you are having to use your burst dps on trash, the group sucks and should be killing mobs faster. Theres really not much of a reason to need that much dps on trash, unless you have a group full of paladins in a non undead zone and full healer mercs or 3 90s in your group in an eok zone
Oh, I know what you are saying, and I usually always hold my big burn for name/oh sch*t moments. I was just pointing out that there are some people I group with that feel I should be using big burn as part of normal rotation, and get mad at me for not doing so . I tend to ignore them for the most part.
For me, the frequency I use discs is based on the following factors: #1 Is there an urgent need for this to die? #2 Can I spare the endurance? In guild groups the only time I get any end back is when I hit Breather, or I go afk. If we're at a simple camp with no named, I will use whatever I can within the 21% that Breather gets me. If we have the potential for a named fight then most gets saved. I can't do a full burn on 21%, and the named are way more likely to get lucky and kill the tank. Granted that is mostly when the tank is a merc, but you have to adapt to the group you have. Avoiding death and the related downtime is the most effective goal in these situations. It's possible there is a rotation I could do with burning that would be more optimal DPSwise, but I haven't experimented with that yet. When there are no named to worry about, I could burn constantly and then sit through two fights to refill my end. Depending on the increase in DPS from discs and the number of fights I could burn through before I needed to refill, it could be better than just popping DMS and Zan Fi periodically. Last night I tried a mission in EoK with a couple friends. I got the chance to do a full burn using what I learned from this thread and it really helped. We failed the first two tries, while learning the encounter, and probably would have beaten the third but it was getting late so we bailed. Since there was another Monk in the group, we tried Alliance, and that was a mistake. Way too heavy on end usage for too little return with only two of us. Had I stuck to the rotation and ignored alliance we probably would have won on the second try. But we were trying stuff and now we know better. Until I ran out of end, the Heel, Dicho/IoT/2ndSpire, SF/FDF rotation worked great. Just had a random thought. Should I have spammed FD to drop aggro and hit Breather when I ran out of end? Does that even work?
If that question was directed toward me, the answer would be no. I usually have a disc/aa running at all time, just not my big burn until it is needed.
Alliance will never work with just 2 monks. Unlike a few other classes it takes 3 Monks and still just barely has enough time to fulfill. Quite honestly, it needs to be adjusted to be a bit easier to actually fulfill its damage. Especially considering classes like Necro's and Wizards can very easily fire theirs off with just 2 people. Yes, you can FD for Breather. If you aren't blowing Imitate Death for pulling purposes, that is the best way to do it. Just ID and hit Breather. They are close enough on refresh timers that it works out pretty well. However, you can just use normal FD and hit breather when you get lucky to drop all aggro.
I cycle burns on trash however I always have SF/IoT/Dicho, Heel/IoT/Dicho, or Terrorpalm ready for if a named or botched pull happens
If you're not using your burst stuff on trash, your group sucks. The only time I'd refrain from using stuff when it's up is if there are gaps between mobs -- a bad puller or unable to move around. If you have a constant stream of mobs to kill, you're not wasting your discs. You're killing faster and a good group will be constantly killing with no down time. Your burn stuff allows you to go even faster. If you're starved of mobs (everything in the area is dead) and have down time, sure, hold back. Named are really not that more difficult than the trash. Holding back something for 2 hours between named spawning is a waste. If someone tries to shame you with a single named parse, show them the combined and ask who's been contributing more.
Plus you can just pull trash around the named till key burns are up, communicate with the group. Timers are short your talking at most 5 minute wait if you NEED the dps. If everyone is cycling dps stuff (tanks and healer too) your groups average dps will be high enough like Sega said that you can just lol @ named anyway so even that wait is probably unecessary. Anyone who links burst parses and act like they are indicative of total contribution probably failed grade school math and MMO 101. Or just want to feel better because you've been wrecking them on the combine for 4000s of the parse.
Its situational. I'm not going to waste a perfectly good burn on just one mob sitting in front of me, unless its a named/boss. Park about 3+, then sure, I won't feel the burn has gone to waste because I will actually use it up on those mobs. But downing one mob and having the rest of the burn just waste away is not an efficient use of endurance or the burn. However, I do agree with you on the point that it is a group effort. This is something I need to learn how to do on my warrior, which is to be able to tank as well as contribute to overall DPS output of the group. I know some tanks that do this well, so this is a matter of getting with them to improve my ability to do that. But, overall, I have always been more of a conservative player. Does it hurt my overall DPS compared to others who are full-bore all-in DPSers? Sure. But I don't worry about competing with numbers. I compete with competency, and my ability to be situationally aware, and to be able to pull my group's hind end out of a sling. In the end, its all on how people decide to play their character. Some will determine their toon's worth on their position on the DPS chart. Others will determine their toon's worth on what other things they can offer to the group, and what other skills they can bring to bear. But its not up to us to judge what makes a toon, or a player, a good one or a bad one, based on either criteria.
All this talk about burns, and I am here thinking that groups are excited when they invite my monk and I remember to turn attack on... In all seriousness, so much of using/saving burns is situational. If I am on my magician alone/box, camping a named in Chardok or Laboratory and I don't care about XP, then I am saving everything for that specific named. However if I am in a good group with a stream of mobs and the group is about to burn a lesson, then I am going all out whenever my burn stuff refreshes. A lot of it depends on the goal you have, and how best to use your burn stuff to accomplish said goal...
I seems to me the choice of approach hinges entirely on the effort the player wants to put in. It's not a "style" thing or a "strat" thing at all. There's better, there's worse, and which is employed is just about if a player can be arsed to do it.
