Feedback: New Servers announcement

Woke era of EQ that's lasted for...22 years since the dawn of instanced raiding?

I'm failing to see past your thinly veiled insult to get to your point. What competition? Picking purposely out of whack laughably imbalanced classes (necro enc etc) with the sole intent to grief and KS people minding their own business trying to enjoy some PVE?

The EQ I grew up with normally respected the idea of camps. Maybe BB was some weird paradise utopia and all the other servers were toxic dumpster fires? I don't know. The raid scene was pretty toxic, but that was for all neckbeards anyways. I don't know what went astray with the TLP community and their revisionist history of KSing and training each other for camp rights was always the norm. No it wasn't.

all the omgosh we demand ber/bl is kinda sounding like the new whn fv pvp tlp

You do realize that people can still steal spawns right? FTE makes it even easier for one person to KS a group, or an automated boxer to steal a camp. Did you ever see camps like the circlet of shadow? On oakwynd it was camped afk by automated mage bots for the entire duration of kunark, and there was nothing I could do about it because mage pets can get FTE before it was even unlocked.

But I guess that doesn't suit your narrative, right?

So being able to sit totally afk at a named camp while the group pulls surrounding mobs for exp somehow makes it harder for me to FTE lock the named mob when it pops? It replaces one problem with another, and solves absolutely nothing. Look at my example above, look at bergurgle, and all the groups and guilds encounter locking epic mobs, raid mobs, etc. FTE suits nobody beyond those that are afraid of getting trained as a trade off to making the game feel more isolated and more instanced. A very, very slight minority.

What's super odd is that they even mentioned Aradune's popularity in relationship to this. Odd because the ONLY reasons Aradune was popular were because of the 2-box limit and the supposedly enhanced customer support. Neither of those things are mentioned for the new server so it is indeed NOT an Aradune clone and so in no way is giving people what they indicated they wanted by Aradune's popularity. I almost feel like it's a bit shady for them to imply it's a clone of Aradune lol

Great example. Bergurgle was monopolized bigtime on Aradune, far more than it was on Oakwynd. Why? Because wizards could nuke it down before clerics could deal enough damage.

Getting epic drops on Oakwynd was far easier than most other TLPs. Did you even play on Oakwynd? This is the argument of people last year when FTE was announced, and it ended up not being an issue at all.

You can come up with all the possible scenarios, but reality was Oakwynd had the least toxicty of TLPs and FTE was the major cause of that. Pretty much any "issue" that you can come up with could be done on non-FTE servers as well in some way.

An Oakwynd clone this soon would likely not be very successful. The people who like the ruleset are unlikely to want to start over for the same rules. Also, it's pretty tough to beat the Mischief ruleset for popularity. No matter what the ruleset of Tormax was/is, it will have a steep hill to climb up vs a random loot free trade server.

Tormax is probably going to have a rough population unless Teek is hugely overpopulated and people leave it for the less populated option.

You keep saying that but either by ignorance or choice refuse to admit it's any different. I've given examples above as to why FTE makes it easier but you ignore that.

I played (at various stages) in the biggest 3 guilds on oakwynd from day 1 to POP. In my experience, it was easier to get my epic pieces in aradune than it was in oakwynd, and aradune had way, way more people despite the fact that it had two servers launch instead of one. The level of competition is inherently connected with the game and is burned into its mechanics. With FTE or no FTE - other players are going to want to compete for drops. FTE only gives more leverage to the minority toxic person to sit at your camp to take the named with your entire group being able to do nothing about it. Happened to me several times.

Absolutely Oakwynd is less toxic. Because it's completely dead, and i'm sure that's why you'd enjoy tormax.

In past FTE threads I brought up this specific camp, and was either told it was easy to beat Bot crews, ignored, or worse given idea how to beat box crews. I gave up, and decided that if Oakwynd was heaven for some due to FTE so be it. I have stopped playing on Oakwynd a month ago due to server population being dead except for peak hours.

I just feel bad for the people who were carrying the banner for FTE so much they invented narratives as they went (If you didn't adore FTE, you are a KSing Krono lord!, If you can't beat well scripted bots you lack skill because I took aHG which I never could before!).

I hope they add FTE to Tormax to keep these dozen or so happy. We know Tormax, a Phinny clone, is gonna be low pop within weeks. FTE added to it might attract a few more players I suppose.

What did amuse me was all the people behaving as if before FTE (Oakwynd) every TLP was over run with Krono farming, player training scum who victimized the very few normal players (the same very few who were in the FTE CheerSquad).
I didn't realise it was that bad in the past!

Do you really need them itemized? The only one choosing ignorance is you. I'll indulge you, though.
1- Sitting AFK while a group pulls and then locking down their named. First, those types of players could do it on any server. Not only could they sit there, but they didn't even need to bother being the first to attack. They just had to put on their dots or nuke. FTE made that much more difficult, because even a very non-optimal group had a chance of getting the first attack in. And once they did that, it made it much more difficult to steal.

2- Look at Bergurgle. Already mentioned that. Previous TLPs were far more toxic on that mob. There were literally wizards who would KS Bergurgle and prevent clerics from getting kills unless they paid. On Oakwynd, clerics had a much better chance of getting it and it wasn't nearly worth the effort of griefers. People/groups/guilds locking down epic mobs was almost non-existent. Griefing on those mobs happened far less. FTE again proved superior.

3- FTE stopping trains made people feel isolated. Huh? Does interaction with other players in this game mean only getting out of the way of their trains to you? You know what stopping those trains did do? It stopped people from getting in fights with each other because of trains. It stopped people from purposely ruining others experience by training them when they were mad at them or wanted a certain camp. FTE again proved superior.

4- It was easier on Aradune to get epic pieces? You just aren't being truthful at all here, or had a vastly different experience. Or perhaps you were part of a certain guild that tried to block the entire server from getting their epics until they had all of theirs. Broken Golem ring a bell to you at all?

5- I'm sure now and then someone did sit at your camp and took your named. Welcome to Everquest. It happens far more on non-FTE servers. You've never been to the hill giants at all either during classic, have you?

6- The toxicity on Oakwynd being less is due to FTE actually working. People purposely tried to break it and cause it to fail, and even that didn't work. If you took 100 people on a FTE and another 100 people on a non-FTE server, the non-FTE server would have more toxic people. Once people figured out that it took more effort to try to be toxic than it was worth, they stopped trying.

And no, despite all your wishes, Oakwynd wasn't and isn't a dead server. It has had a much larger population than people give credit for. Compared to say Mischief, yeah its a low population server. Any and all servers would be if they were put in the same release spot. Free to trade / random loot is a popular ruleset to compete against.

I'm going to go even further and address your other posts to someone else.
7- No, it isn't easier to steal someone's camp. It moved the competition from having a broken DPS class able to steal kills to even average groups having a chance to get the kills. And in actual practice griefers tended to leave much faster when they no longer had a chance to just throw a few dots on a creature to win the race.

8- Yeah, I did see Circlet of Shadow. It wasn't tough at all to beat the mage box armies. I have a nice shiny pre-nerf CoS on my necro as a result. One little macro right before mobs were about to spawn: /target a_goblin_bodyguard on line one and /pet attack on line two. Easy. Even if they tried to disrupt things, it was too late because I already got my dots on it. A solo necro was able to beat a handful of those automated mages. FTE wins again.

Let's get back to actual reality. FTE. The people who hate it make up two key arguments:
1) The people who didn't actually try FTE or actually spend much time with it. They followed along with all of the very vocal anti-FTE people.
2) The actual FTE haters. These are the people that hate that they can no longer bring a necro or shaman to KS whatever they wanted. These are the people who hate that their group of casters can't take over a camp at will. These are the people who hate that a smaller guild might get an open world spawn before their bigger guild can organize. That's who hates FTE.

One thing I've noticed about FTE haters is that they HATE that other people might like FTE. It is this massive hit to their very core for some reason. They have trouble restraining themselves from trying to lash out and attack those that like FTE.

Oh, and yes, I'm sure I would enjoy Tormax if I ended up playing there. I try to make the best out of any situation and I'm sure there will be some great people there. But I doubt I will be there. If I did choose to play on the 25th anniversary servers, I'd probably choose Teek. Regardless, weird attempt at a flex by you.

They should indeed give "The oakwynders" another chance, but maybe not this early?

And hopefully the main contributer to Aradunes success, covid, wont be an issue this year...

Pretty sure the achievements are doable. Vaniki is more fun now than it ever has been.

Tormax is a Phinegel clone.

Will DPG have a second Teek style server ready to spin up at launch? I assume they know one won't be enough given the extremely low interest in Tormax's ruleset compared to Teek's.

And if this is the case, that they would have 3 servers anyway, can't they just launch a second with Teek's ruleset but with FTE enabled to split the demand? They could even say that they will merge them later on and FTE will be turned off, since past a certain point EQ is mostly instanced anyway.

This seems like a good path forward, if they refuse to abandon the Tormax experiment.

Tormax is not an experiment, it is an uninspired Phinegel clone. Sad but true

Teek going to have long queue times..

I think FTE should be on all server through Luclin....once you go to PoP and beyond FTE is not needed, but it should always remain on zones prior to Planes of Power.

People can get their KS fix in Nobles Causeway and Wall of Slaughter....lol

I could give or take FTE, I don't think its really going to be a big draw or detractor either way. I'd like to see Tormax be similar enough to Mischief loot rules, which a huge amount of people like, but maybe change something divisive such as removing truebox or speeding up the progression rate. Both servers should boost xp and remove required lvl on gear though.

It is an election year....lol

Numbers are what they have, they not only know the actual daily logons they should be able to get average playtimes and all kinds of metrics that we don't have access to. We the people on the forums are the minority we don't know if we represent the community's desires but the fact that they have another mangler type server and there's been lots of posts asking for specifically that it does look like at least some in the community are getting what they want.

After this year they'll know for sure where free trade + random loot sits vs regular type TLP and they'll have stats to back that up.

Teek will have queues until they create an overflow....Tormax will die if it ever gets off the ground....the only TLP to ever compete with the player base of mischief was Aradune and that is because of Brad McQuaid passing away and a global pandemic.

But you go on kidding yourself.