DBG has suspended Overrated guild members for not complying with a player-made rotation

This "Rule of conduct" was player-generated. This forum thread was not started by a DBG employee / GM, but by a player.

Had the rotation thread been initiated by DBG in the form of an official dev/GM stating "here are the rotation rules for this server" .... I'd be fine with it. In fact, we probably wouldn't have "tested the waters" of your so called rotation rules. Nope, they just stickied the rotation thread and called it good. Sloppy. Lazy.


FYI - No one in Overrated was contacted by a GM in or out of game. We encouraged a GM (via petition) to open a dialogue and have a civilized conversation on the matter, but further attempts at contact were almost instantly closed out with no reason or reply. Next time we'll just ask for a GM first. kk? It is quite clear that mediation is just a joke at this point.

Yeah, agreed, specially when your guild leader told everyone involved to go themselves when mediation started. Why don't you do the same?

The guild leader of Overrated never once said that, to any guild leader.

Keep drinking that kool-aid, and show me where the alleged words of "go F yourself" were spoken to any of the parties involved. Screenshot? Chat log? A falsified chat log?

MIM had 30+ in zone and could have easily DPS raced our 7. Why didn't they defend their own "honour"? The DPS advantage was there by a mile.

Nope, instead we call in the nanny patrol.

the more important question is, was it faceless that told on you?

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Omfg Elricvonclief! I get annoyed at the shiz you Live, More Loyal Than Those Of Us Veterans Who Only Played 8 years Because You Stayed And Changed Everquest And Now Rate More Than Other EQ Vets Just Because Of Time Served apparently, spew about the TLP subscribers, even when the subject, is stretched out, examined and found to be .0005% true! This though, this just made me laugh soooooo much!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *Salute.

Nope, I decided not to 3rd party mediate and asked Gremin a more casual guild's leader to handle this one.

Would they have preferred me to him?

MiM did the honorable thing and did not DPS race or engage the mobs because they did not want to be suspended also for violations of the rotation or EULA. They did exactly what was told of them to do by the GMs the first time the SKY rotation had an issue.

The rotation is an enforced document by Daybreak. They may not have created it but they have signed off on its enforcement.

Rotations are not only sanctioned but were required by DBG. It was their intention that players work out differences and that DBG only intervene when someone isn't willing to cooperate

If Gremin had been the one "mediating" Snubs, Modest Man would have still been suspended

The mediation process has not been improved despite the 2 weeks of conversation in the private thread.
Sure there is a difference in this case, and there was a "guild leader" being spoken to, but they are hardly a rotation guild with significant skin & voting power in the rotation.

Gremin fired a WMD knowing it was a WMD - it could be argued that Yawgmoth just pressed a button and was gleefully hoping that some action might be taken.

2 instances this week the WMD was used, because non-rotation players have no "assets" to negotiate with, there is no equality.

I'm curious <Overrated>, what's the use of a rotation if anyone can disagree with it and do what they want? Shall we just go back to FFA and watch FI kill everything again?

It's hard to believe you guys are actually excited about a group, not a guild, GROUP, of accounts getting suspended for playing the game.

So, if the guild leaders actually put hate and fear on the rotation, would DBG back that up also? Daybreak has taken the one cash cow that Sony still had left and turned it into a $hitshow, Wow, good job ruining your only good thing.

Random guild keeps Hate clear. Makes it easier for a guild (rotation or not) to go in and attempt Innoruuk quickly.

Random guild keeps Fear clear. Makes it easier for a guild (rotation or not) to go in and attempt CT quickly.

Random guild keeps Sky clear. Make it impossible for a guild not already on the Sky rotation to go in and attempt, say, Eye of Veeshan. Because: keys. Even keeping the first two islands clear can do that.

When I first saw that Sky was rotated on Lockjaw (while I was still on Ragefire), I was admittedly a bit confused (Why Sky and not Hate/Fear?). But then I thought more about it and it made sense.
Sky is simply different than Hate and Fear. Yes, it's rotated to ensure access for the raid guilds who intend to get to the later islands. Yes, there are current ongoing discussions about how to improve access for the community while still ensuring that keys are not a problem for the raid guilds. You have to remember that some of the raid guilds can kill Sky at any time, while others can only do so during Australian or Asian primetime, others can only do so during US primetime, and maybe at some point we'll have some on Lockjaw who can only do so during European primetime.

Also, for those who seem confused about the fact that rotations were required and would be enforced, see: https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq...ations-coming-to-ragefire-and-lockjaw.225229/ This announcement showed up in the game launcher when it was new. You can still find it in News & Announcements.
Also: the stickied "Rotation" threads at the top of this forum. They are STICKIED by DBG to indicate "THIS IS IMPORTANT". Roshen required the community to write up the rotations, and then he stickied them. He wouldn't make the initial post himself. Other stickies, at this moment, are the thread about Guide support and the thread announcing that server transfers from Ragefire to Lockjaw were ending and are now finished.

Just remember, if you do, kiss your account goodbye forever. DBG perma bans people that do that.

So the agreed to rotation that DBG said they will enforce is null and void because the thread wasn't started by DBG, even though they posted in there saying, we have seen this thread and made it sticky.

But even in that very first post from Roshen, petitions were meant for extreme situations and he specifically said "guilds and players" (both bolded by me for emphasis)

Roshen has been continually emphasizing this in the private discussions, and from the very first day of these enforced rotations, the guild council has been made aware that they have excluded a significant part of the server population.

You were added late into the private discussion so you might not have read everything from the start, but the mediation this week is a sad case of "actions < words"

• There is nothing in that first sticky post saying people will be suspended
• There is nothing in the linked spreadsheet saying what the consequences are if you break the rotation other than a mention of "GM intervention", and that is hidden in a tab many might not see.

Id just like to say from an outsiders point of view:
IIUC the reason given why raid bosses were not given instances was because it would remove the competition inherent in infrequently spawned bosses. This rotation negates that.

No. If Gremin or anyone else with any impartiality had been the one mediating the Modest Man situation, Snubs would have been suspended, and perhaps at most Modest Man would have been required to give up a sky day in reparation.

Guilds did talk to each other. A 3rd party contacted the guild, and was instantly told that the offending parties were aware of the rotation rules, and had no intention of following them. The offending parties refused mediation from a 3rd party, and thus it was escalated.

You keep saying that rotation guilds are "trigger happy" and cannot be a nonbiased third party, but in 100% of the situations where it has came up, if a non-rotation guild or player or group of players has contacted a rotation guild about coming into sky for island 1/2 stuff, the rotation guild has worked with them to figure out a time where they could come up and kill without affecting that guilds raid times. We have countless accounts of this from people on all of the threads you and zhu have been spamming the forums with. The rotation guilds have also are pretty much all in favor of making a FFA day for sky for non rotation guilds, even in an already crowded and slow rotation.

The rotation guilds have proven they are willing to mediate and work with anyone who comes to them looking for some time to kill and sky, and have also proven that they are willing to come up with a solution that takes away their own rotation spots to give to the rest of the server who hasn't gotten onto the rotation yet.

So every time you say that a rotation guild cannot be a nonbiased 3rd party, you have absolutely nothing to back that up, as the rotation guilds have worked to disprove that 100% since these issues started popping up.