DPS increases in last patch

Ok you guys are adding in ae damage and saying that what a class can do for dps?? That's like me taking my sk, swarming a bunch of mobs and saying that's an SKs dps number. I never realized people were adding in damage to multiple mobs at once, that's ridiculous and sooo many different factors. Dps a class can do should be measured against ONE mob. Ae damage ability is a different subject.

Rogues needed a boost big time. Zerkers.. Well I can't imagine someone who actually plays a zerker as a main. I couldn't imagine how awful that would be. The devs who came up with root and blind should never be allowed to touch another game ever.

I actually bought the cotf expansion for my rogue account because of the changes. Finally a good reason, and it was on sale for $30

DPS by definition is damage per second.

where in that definition is it limited to one target?

Couldn't agree more. I was suprised when it happened. Rogues deserved some form of burn parity with berserkers, but I'd always expected to meet somewhere in the middle instead of this.

Not that I dislike having a bit of power. Makes a change!

Pretty much agree with all of this except the point that rogues WERE indicated to be the next class gaining a boost. I can't recall where (maybe beta forums), but we all knew it was inc. And before Behelit complains, no it wasn't a stitchup job by Songsa and myself. (The devs are infact smarter than that to base an entire set of class upgrades on 2 peoples say so.) This came from themselves.

Quick someone do a valley raid and base your decisions off that.. it's only fair..

That is a potential gain for 50sec. Beyond that it's MUCH less of a gain; still some of course, but less. The only events where realistically a guild would gain 1 million dps on for the duration of the fight is an event that was already trivial to that guild.

And now rogues got an upgrade i see some berserkers (not you specifically) calling for nerf with chosen perfect duration parses or crying instead of being happy that finally rogues came back to the show after 4 years of average dps to stay polite.
Brog and myself several times supported a sustained dps increase for berserkers to compete with casters, i advice you to continue in that way.

I don't mind it, after a full week of raids with it isn't that bad. The problem I have is the comments from development that no one is getting significant gains and a 100k Adps burn disc and significant improvement on sustained (not just in the form of the rampage disc, but 3 ranks of rogues fury etc) came out of nowhere.

My class abilities don't even function from this patch...

"And now rogues got an upgrade i see some berserkers (not you specifically) calling for nerf with chosen perfect duration parses"

Oh you mean like everyone was doing on the valley raid with berserkers and crying/whining they needed a nerf? It's funny how when the shoe is on the other foot, people start singing a different toon. Now all the things berserkers said, are the same excuses rogues are using as justification.

With that being said. Rock on Rogues

Best part about that entire statement and sentiment when VoA was current I often saw rangers/rogues higher than zerkers and around 130k+

I am happy for rogues, but that makes me wonder (even more) why wizards got arcane fusion nerfed...

Dang, that's big. They're a DPS class so I don't get the hullabaloo about it, though. Need to group with rogues more often. Thanks!

I remember years ago when zerkers first came out about how close their DPS was to rogues, on how rogues should / need to be top DPS yet. Was so much flaming and support for rogues then. Then years later they lost that top spot, now they have it again and now listen to some complain to no end on how they have it again is just to funny for me.

As I stated in a previous post, I am glad that got a nice DPS boost, was long over due.

With a small enough sample size (optimum aDPS AE burn with more mobs than you'll generally encounter in most in-game scenarios) the huge increase is kind of a given since it's coming from a previous value (AE wise) of zero/whatever the dmg would've been on the usual single target.

Overall I'm seeing 9.3% increase now but these abilities are still new to us so that is likely to increase a bit.. I have a massive amount of pre-patch data and very limited post so I expect it to normalize. The damage was predictable to anyone who beta tested to any degree (Enkel and I discussed this - and my guess for overall increase wasn't far off)

And like I said, the parse that the monk linked is a bit of a red herring .. since (and I have the same parse data) I can only attribute about 48k of this, roughly, in any way to new pierce AA/discs which were prevalent as opposed to backstab DPS which was not boosted in the patch (aside from Rogue's Fury min dmg modifier but each rank is fairly small - the main bonus to those ranks are duration increases)

I'm saying that if you include AE damage, then how can you possibly compare the results?? So if you have 10 mobs that you are damaging and get 350k dps and I have 4 mobs and have 200kdps, does that mean you do more dps then I do?? The baseline for dps should be measured against ONE target. Having a discussion about how much AE dps you can do is a different measurement and completely dependent on how many mobs etc.. I don't take a swarm parse for my SK and say that is the dps they do. If you do that then you must say, DPS vs X# of mobs.

The baseline is the measured encounter, not whatever you decide. Some encounters have 20 adds up at once, some have none. You gain an average by taking every encounter and dividing by the total, not ignoring data.

I don't really understand some of your thinking lol. Lets take Neriak 2 for example I nuke Prince Tarant Thex and i switch off and nuke adds it's not going to stop counting my time on prince because i switched off it will keep counting and when i come back to nuking prince you will see your dps on him drop tremendously in those same second i was nuking adds so if you combine them you get your actual Damage per second.

Raid events = real application of damage. They're always going to have some noise in the numbers, but they're where your dps actually matters. Not a test dummy in the GH or arena.
We're not talking about ideal single target burns, or solo swarm application. But these events happen every week for lots of guilds.

If you can tank all the adds in a current raid event to get some awesome swarming dps, cool. Do it.

And yes, that situation with doing damage to lots of adds is exactly the reason we do parses with adds combined. If a raid needs 500mil damage to a boss and another 200mil across 20 adds to win, what makes the damage to those adds unimportant? It needs to be done to win. For lots of events, the adds present a larger wipe risk than the boss. And doing a combined parse doesn't "punish" those to follow directions to split off for adds.

It's you that doesn't seem to understand. When you provide a parse as hard data to a developer it must meet a certain criteria. If you cherry pick and don't present all the evidence as a whole you will be ignored.

It'd be the equivalent of doing a blind study and ignoring anyone who returned results that you didn't think fit, regardless of whether or not it was fact.

I'm telling you exactly how they are going to look at it and it's not going to be how you want them to.

DPS is just what it says, damage per second. Whether it is one mob or is 10 mobs in parallel it makes no difference - it's all damage in a given time.

However this also puts the mockery on linking specific parses and drawing too many conclusions. Eg from http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/showpost.php?p=542250&postcount=8 I showed, purely for the humour value, a 577k furious rampage parse in a raid event.

Does that mean Bers are overpowered? No of course not and I knew that when I posted it (with caveats to explain it). It means on that ONE specific event, and not even usefully, they can get overinflated numbers for a bit of a laugh. For meaningful analysis we either need whole event parses or specific known mobs that offer the same conditions for all players. It's hard to achieve though, especially with different kill times from differing guilds.