Why no new iconics?

I'm relieved to learn that Jack Kerouac is not dead.

If that's true, take a step back and reevaluate. Like I said, why participate in threads like this and argue unnecessarily with people trying to achieve positive change? You don't have a horse in the race and even admit to benefitting if there's some traction. Sit it out and spend your energy somewhere else.

False equivalence. The options are all tasty fruits, yes, but you're still comparing apples to oranges. None of those is a Superhero game where "powers" is the most important defining characteristic of the *entire genre*. And none of those is based on a globally recognizable franchise people have invested in since the 1930s. Before MH closed down it effectively had 60ish powersets (each character was a powerset).

And this is the stockholm syndrome part.

You're literally fighting against better things because (as I suggested above) you're afraid to get your hopes up and be disappointed. So, instead of either supporting people trying to make things better or even just standing aside, you give those people a hard time who put the effort in to ask/fight for change and fixes and discourage their enthusiasm.

Sadly, there's a whole world of people who think like you out there right now; being barriers to change and progress on a wide variety of far more important issues, so you're not alone. And you've really internalized this mindset.

I struck a nerve if you needed to take a shot like that. ... You do that. Zod knows how unforgiving of daily human life *some people* in this community can be if something unwanted happened. Thankfully we're not all that salty though, so if anything did happen with your imaginary "nephew" we won't all come for you.

"Put money on"....so you DO only worry about the money....

Call me gullible if you like, but lots of people do have nephews (and/or nieces). I see no reason to assume the OP was lying.

The Joker Returns (Batman #1) An officer was cut after inspecting Jokers' card. He died later. Implying their is poison on the Joker's razor sharp playing cards.

Batman: Animated Series; Episode: Be a clown.
New 52 Batman #40

etc.....

He's making a reference to our leaguemate who I posted about a few weeks back. Lorax while not vocal himself, was very supportive of the people who were vocally demanding action against our friend. But yes, he can easily claim it's not a reference to that -- but then he really wouldn't need to give us a status update on his daily family life either since no one would have noticed him being absent from the forums during a real afternoon visit.

I know all of this but lets be honest , and say majority of the people would get this ability simply to make Gambit. We already have a bunch of quantum, and mental Gambits.

There will be a could of Jokers but we know who the most poplar card throwing comic character is. It would make more sense to have them be Knives since the joker is known for that as well and it would not invite any potential licensing problems.

I haven't played MH, so I'm just wondering how many active skills each character has? According to the video from youtube, I got the impression that there are only 8, if this is so, then you can safely write lpvp (lpve) icons in separate poversets ... and everything will equalize ...

I don't remember exactly since it's been a while. They launched with more per character but after an update a few years in, were trimmed to less. IIRC each character had 3 trees with 5 or 6 powers in each tree.

It's an open forum. Kuno made a ridiculous claim regarding iconic powers and Dev/player communication, I pointed her to a recent conversation with the senior producer regarding new powers. You came to defend your friend, cool. You brought up stockholm syndrome but take a step back to look at the company you keep. Now allow me to direct you to something you told me:

And I wasn't vocal because I sincerely felt bad for your friend and didn't want to add what had already been said.

It is, but why double down on an awful take when you don't have to? Again, you already admitted to not being against this so why argue with the people supporting it? It's a free forum but what's your endgame? You're just alienating people unnecessarily and contributing to a toxic forum culture in an accepted-by-the-rules way, that literally drives people away from the forums and the game. I'm not saying it's all on you btw, it's a toxic forum culture in general that many of us have contributed to over the years doing it.

Mepps responded to Kuno's comment directly. It was a frustrated comment from what I recall (it's curated now I think) but I wouldn't characterize it as a "ridiculous claim".

Also, yes, "senior producer" in the gaming industry is not what you think it is. It's not like in the movie industry where they front the cash and are in charge behind the scenes. In the gaming industry a producer or senior producer is the title for a project manager. Art directors "project manage" creative content and assets while Producers "project manage" development assets. DB may do things differently but this is generally true across the industry. Both Panderus and Mepps (and a couple other posts by green names) repeated the *then* position of the Dev team. In that conversation we (players) made the case against that approach for them to take into consideration and change course.

That position was then contradicted by the CEO in several interviews. CEO outranks Sr. project manager (no offence to Panderus). Of course, it remains to be seen what will happen ultimately and what direction this aspect of the game will go in. Things can always change -- that's the point of making the case for something.

The company I keep? yikes... no.

It is stockholm syndrome. There's always a cacophony of ill informed people arguing against changes that improve the material conditions of the game and our play experience; for no reason. Your replies here are an example of it and I'm pointing it out and asking you to reconsider how you contribute to these discussions. It's not constructive at all.

By quoting this are you telling me you're passionate about being an obstacle for people asking for the Devs to make improvements to the game, and I should just let you aggravate them? Really?

You weren't. But you were supporting those who were asking for blood and you needlessly referenced it here to stir the pot for a reaction. We still love our friend and he's still in our league and we're still enjoying our play experience with him and lots of chats etc still. We've got a lot more tea to chat about these days since that event. We're not ashamed of what happened at all so weaponizing it for a reaction just comes off petty. Doesn't hurt me or anyone else in our league who reads these attacks.

Look, I can't stop you from anything. I'm just asking you (and anyone doing the same thing) to think about your goal in a situation like this. Are you trying to push people away from the game or are you trying to make the game better?

Why single me out when you don't have to? I'm not arguing with people, I was responding to one person who is grievously misinformed and for whatever reason you took it personal. And it's funny you want to bring up my toxicity while in the same breath defend someone else's toxicity.

Umm....

Can you please explain how any of what's in yellow is supposed to be "fighting for better things". Because this is just toxic drivel to me. We got an episode 100% free for everyone which disproves everything made has to be attached to monetization. Weapon Mastery is far from dead but what killed it for Kuno shall remain an unsolved mystery. Armories exist but I think she just wants a 20 slot loadout, great concept for keyboards and horrible for console controllers. We literally had a revamp in 2017, what we have now is not what we had in 2011. The marketplace could use some new additions but "dead and abandoned" comes off like "I got everything I wanted with my Loyalty Points". Dev team doesn't have innovative ideas and systems, offers no critical input other than 'new habilities'. They make bad decisions, everybody makes bad decisions. And the rest is just subjective. What is fun for Kuno? What is innovative for Kuno? What is so confusing about the storylines?

It is, I have a LinkedIn.

Yikes yes. Get in where you fit in.

There's always a cacophony of ill informed people arguing against changes that improve the material conditions of the game and our play experience; for no reason. Your replies here are an example of it and I'm pointing it out and asking you to reconsider how you contribute to these discussions. It's not constructive at all.[/quote]
Did you just rediscover the term Stockholm syndrome this week? Was there a special on Lifetime? The View? OWN? Oxygen? Law and Order: SVU? Stockholm syndrome is what happens when a hostage sympathizes with their captor or a victim of abuse with their abuser. It's kind of a sick extreme to an analogy you're trying to sell.

But just as long as that cacophony of ill informed people are making noise for your side, it's ok? Kuno's replies in this thread were constructive? Do you think your replies were constructive?

No I was telling you to find the 'Ignore' button but that's obviously not going to happen.

There was no "goal" to my original comment. Something ill informed was said and I directed that person to read something that might be useful. Something simple bothered you that much? And now that I think on it, the absolute irony of someone accusing the dev team for misunderstanding players and that same person uses made up words in their "feedback".

Because you have no reason to argue. Kuno isn't happy with X so they're sharing their feedback. You don't disagree apparently (your own words) yet, you're here arguing with whoever. At least the other people arguing with Kuno actually disagree with their points. You're not disagreeing and instead just trying to shut down the conversation.

I didn't defend anyone's toxicity. Mepps addressed Kuno directly. I replied to you because you're typically mature and reasonable.

You linked to Panderus' talking points on powersets which explained (at the time) their unwillingness to commit to X because of the concerns over ROE. How do you *not* know what all that's about if you've been playing for so many years? I know what each of those criticisms is about -- they're not mysterious. And none of what they said is controversial at all. It's all stuff that's been brought up before, for years now and the Devs agree with most of those criticisms too.

btw I come from a city of immigrants. I come from a family of immigrants actually. Where I come from we just listen to the substance of people's words. We don't get caught up policing someone's accent and we don't make fun of them saying things differently.

Incorrect. Get a job in the industry and get back to me.

Shrug. This is still coming off as petty.

Someone with stockholm syndrome is someone who falls in love with their abuser and defends them despite it being against their own interests. Someone arguing against improvements and solutions to issues in the game is like someone irrationally defending their abuser against their own interests.

Yes. They are providing feedback to the Devs about their experiences. You're not providing feedback about the game, you're just arguing with Kuno because you don't like their feedback. Kuno is using the forum for what it's here for. You're just bullying people you dislike.

Right. I should put you on ignore so you can bully someone into shutting up without interference. You're going to be really disappointed.

Something you didn't understand and couldn't be bothered to understand. Because.reasons. *
Something that suited your position. **

Get some air. You're not at your best.

Kuno has no points. Kuno has grievances, some misguided and some real, but no points.

You are defending toxicity because it suits your own standpoints. Spin it however you wish.

You incorrectly assumed why I quoted Panderus' replies. And you keep throwing on this extra information about the empty promises from Jackster's interview and it has nothing to do with anything in this thread.

Don't try to explain or minimalize people's job descriptions when no one asks. We already did the 'meet and greet' with just about everybody on the team and I know what a senior producer is. I know what a CEO is. I know what a janitor is. These aren't people that need explaining.

Except they aren't actually providing real feedback. I can say, "I don't like the Flashpoint generator mods." and if a dev were to read that there would be a dozen questions or they could just make an incorrect assumption. A lot of feedback here looks like this and then players like Kuno get frustrated when the devs don't interpret these vague tidbits correctly. So correct, I didn't like Kuno's feedback. There is literally no rule here that I have found that says I have to either agree with someone or keep my mouth shut. And again you make incorrect assumptions because I generally have agreed with Kuno in former posts. Just because I don't like something someone may have said or didn't see eye to eye on an opinion does not in anyway mean I dislike them. I'm not that shallow.

And I'm not even going to address the rest. If you want to paint me as the mean bully so be it but do it on your own funds because I'm not cutting you a damn check.

The thread itself is non-toxic, we just want to see different things happen with the game, no one is bashing the Developers, atleast not me, as members we just want to enjoy the game like some of you people by agreeing with the main point of this thread "Iconics expansional update". progress.

Kuno has points. Pretending they're invalid because you don't like them, or the way they speak, is petty and doesn't invalidate their points.

Kuno made an angry post. You attacked the post. Kuno is giving feedback about the game, while you're giving feedback about Kuno. One of these is toxic, the other is not.

I didn't make any assumption at all about why you did it. You offered it as evidence of your point against Kuno's; I countered showing it supports Kuno's point instead of yours.

You tried to use the professional hierarchy to prop up the validity of your point. However, it doesn't; you're misinformed and do not understand the hierarchy.

The position literally makes sure everyone is delivering their assets on time in all of the different departments, as I previously explained. It's an incredibly valuable role on a big team with a lot of moving parts. It's not more important than/or "outrank" the Art or Creative Director, Game Director or any of the exec level team. It's a coordinator role and a project management position.

You're not the gatekeeper of feedback. Their feedback doesn't have to meet your standards. The better the feedback the more likely it will be taken seriously by the Dev team, however, it's not your place to shut them down because you don't like it or how it was delivered. Especially considering the feedback offered was all long standing issues with the game we're all aware of at this point and none of it really requires a new explanation--which is why Kuno obv didn't elaborate on any of it.

Not painting you as anything. I called out your behaviour and asked you to take a step back. You didn't like that and doubled down. YOu painted yourself as whatever. Get some air.

Ok Susan.

You present yourself as someone who understands the game and its playerbase so well, but were really struggling to understand Kuno's op, so I took the time (since I'm in lockdown here) to break it down for you. I hope it helps

1) this is their opinion but is supported by several posts by green names over the years.
2) seems pretty clear. most of us want these too.
3) gameplay is almost exclusively powers based because exclusively weapon based characters are not viable. you might reply that "weapon mastery is a thing". I don't know if WM is viable still/anymore but it's not desirable because it forces players to take character options they likely don't want and play the game in a way they don't want -- taking options away from the player.
4) seems pretty clear. most of us aren't happy about this.
5) what Kuno describes as abilities here is up for debate I guess. I believe they are referring to individual powerset powers or movement mode abilities.
6) the loadout allows us to access more functions than 6 things; so I disagree with this criticism. But it's also possible they are referring to the powers inside the sets being mostly filler and unused -- players will only use the most viable (because of the approach to game object balance in the game) 6 powers and ignore the rest leading to a lack of loadout and gameplay variation. this is true and a fair criticism.
7) this isn't controversial. it's an open secret. even the devs aren't happy with the state of the Market.
8) mileage will vary. I disagree with this personally but they're entitled to feel that way.
9) this is a fair criticism that's been coming up a lot lately. the story has become incoherent and we move from one fight to the next without any setup.
10) again, mileage will vary, but this isn't a new or scandalous criticism.

This part is more contentious. I will never imply the devs are lazy. I do think it's fair to be underwhelmed by the lack of new features and systems that could be added to the game and the combat system specifically. The substance of this criticism goes back to the devs only adding content they could directly monetize (up until this current DLC).

The first part is fair. It's their opinion most of us agree with. The next part references a lack of innovation again, which was covered above. Next; bad decisions. This part is also contentious but it's not entirely unfair either depending on what they are specifically upset about. For example; making a Legion DLC that heavily features the Titans instead of more Legion characters, or making a Flashpoint DLC that focuses on fringe characters and side stories instead of covering the main events. The last part is totally contentious and everyone's mileage will vary yet again. I wouldn't characterize them as "garbage" but I do think they've been weaker episodes and they seem to be fairly unpopular for a variety of specific reasons.

note: "habilities" = abilities for any Karens policing the OP's writing.

Ps. Kuno please let me know if I misunderstood anything.

Neither are you.

If someone posts feedback, they open themselves up to criticism and critiques of what they have posted. And as long as any responses or feedback don't break the guidelines set forth by Mepps (the actual gatekeeper around these parts) others are free to offer their opinions and thoughts on what's been posted. Without any responses, a discussion just becomes an echo chamber and the likelihood of anything actually productive coming out of the discussion drops dramatically.

If someone's suggestions can stand up to the criticism and critiques offered by others, awesome. If not, then perhaps some rethinking on the suggestion is in order. Having the best of intentions for the game or wanting to see it improve doesn't give anyone a free pass on having their ideas/suggestions go under the microscope.