People Who Leave Duos Because of Support Role

Assuming my partner isn't massively over geared for the instance:

If I'm a troller and another troller joins me? Sweet, even less down time due to power generation. I can spam my powers even more.

If I'm a troller and a healer joins me? Sweet, no downtime waiting for health to regen or searching for healing barrels.

If I'm a troller and a tank joins me? Sweet This will make the tricker aspects of this Duo easier.

If I'm a troller and a DPS joins me? Meh all they are adding is additional damage. I do that just fine on my own, and any other role would add more then enough damage anyway. But I suppose I can let this person think he "carried" me through the duo.

If I'm playing a healer, I'd prefer a troller or tank, but another healer is okay. And DPS is still a case of "meh, it's just damage".

To my amusement, I've been yelled at over on XB1's server because I joined a Duo in DPS role and wasn't in "Controller" role. My partner didn't want more damage, they wanted a personal Power Battery. I was playing a Hand Blast/Sorcery character, so couldn't have entered Controller role anyway.

Just so everyone here knows - if I could ALWAYS Troll in this game I would. I love the role, especially as a Hard light.

They could personally do away with my DPS side if they wanted to...just let me TROLL everything.

My Dps side - especially for HL - is average, at best. Part of that is the power, the other part is that I just don't do Dps greatly.

THAT being said - it always seem easier for ME to just queue up and gear up as a Dps for the Duos. If I happen to see someone that asks me to switch I will do it in a heartbeat.

When I queue for duos maybe 10% of the time I get a healer, tank or Controller. Out of that 10% maybe "ONLY" 3% actually know what they're doing.

The results end up being disastrous. Then - after about 20 min in that duo the other player leaves - which leaves ME up the creek without a paddle.....

In my 7+ years playing this game I've played a role OTHER than dps in a DUO maybe 5 times.

For future content if the Devs want to make duos that make it PAINFULLY obvious that a support role is needed then I'm all for it.

Perhaps I should rephrase it to "a more robust or complete player" plays both sides, because obviously a player can still be good at the role they do play 100% of the time, so yes you're right that terminology probably wasn't the best.

Also just to double clarify haha, it's not my perspective, I'm simply putting myself in the shoes of those that do leave to offer an explanation as to why they would

In saying that there are times and days where even I might have time constraints on my game play and I'm trying to get as much done as possible because I have about 8 end game characters so running a duo I know isn't going to be particularly efficient wouldn't be entirely desirable.

to be fair you're somewhat of an exception, for every person like you whose in support but doing their bit to enhance damage and cut back time delays there are 3 or 4 other support players who queue in to duos and sit in the roof rafters just spectating.

If I'm being perfectly honest, it's not frequent that I experience a support player in a duo, but I'd have to say that usually when I do the scorecard will be in the realms of 20mil damage my end and 300k their end, I was never in need of their power, never at risk of dying in fact they were mostly healing themselves as others have said and they were making zero attempt to buff any damage output.

So although I applaud the fact you're an exception, you really are like a diamond among a whole bunch of dirty coal lumps.

Harley's Heist and Wayne Manor Gala are both easier with a support role at level. WMG basically needs a tank to corral the adds prior to the first boss fight because they aggro very easily and a healer can't heal through it enough.

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I think herein lies the rub about support roles and alts. They are needed for our population. Sometimes, all we have are people's alts in order to heal, troll or tank raids. The idea that my controller alt (which has a DPS armory) may have to split vendor gear in order to do enough damage to run duos and alerts efficiently is kinda ridiculous. Then that toon isn't going to perform the best when the time comes to raid and do the support role that its artifacts, augments, etc are geared for.

Having said that, there are times where players are totally clueless. Ice player queues into duo as tank, has no shields and uses Arctic Gust without white mod? We've all seen someone like that before. Random queue in as 2 DPS, other is 10 CR above you but only has 200K more damage than you after the first boss, that's not going to be a successful run. If a player queues in as controller, but debuffs, stuns and counters enemies and pops their group shield when Hush comes out during Batscape duo? That's probably going to be a more successful run. Unfortunately, you never know what you are going to get.

Well then I guess most support players I encounter in duos are just bad players. Oh well

So what if a person is in a support role for a duo? The instance takes maybe 5 minutes longer... BooHooo!

Support roles are in the game for a reason; to be used.
Besides, I have seen many Trolls in full troll gear and in troll role out DPS many people in full DPS gear, I've even seen healers do this too... I am one of them in both cases. You are not carrying the Troll or the Healer; they are both helping you in the instance.

Years ago, people were always crying because we didn't have enough Trolls/healers/Tanks, now all of the sudden that some people are starting to bring these roles back, now people b****n about how people que up as support and not DPS?
People need to make up their damned minds!

That DPS players think we need them at all to complete duos (And complete them in a timely manner) is laughable. DPS players trying to say they're "carrying" support roles in duos..that's a joke. I battle tank duos, I don't need DPS at all..hell, most of the time I don't even need a second player. To be honest, with the way the community is in this game, I'd rather play them solo.

So yeah...all the DPS players out there that don't want to run duos with support roles..keep it up..keep leaving..this game is so much more enjoyable for me when I don't have to play content with you

Let me give you the loudest AMEN!!!! In history!
If I could like your comment a hundred more times, I would!

Whenever I run a DUO and yes IN SUPPORT ROLE (and from now on even more, just to p155 these people off even more)- if they leave, AWESOME. Because a troll, a healer and a tank can pretty much solo anything... even things DPS can't.

Its one thing to play support. It's another to be in tank role spamming duel pistols. Gotten that 1 too many times. Rather shout in lfg then q at this point

I don't leave duo if someone is using a support role. But I don't run many duos these days because I got most feats, and most of my characters are way above most duos (Beside the Metal II one). I do not mind doing most of the job if the other side at least participate.
If I'm in the stabilizer event, I stop attack and wait till the other guy gets in or start moving. I don't want to do the entire job by myself, I don't care if you heal or do low damage but at least DO something, at his point. I don't want to be one of those "Oh she's high CR she over thinks herself and won't help lower players" Cause that's seriously not true. I have no issue helping lower players, but I won't get the job done for them. I will gladly teach, I will gladly explain, but I will NOT Carry. I experienced it myself when I went into a duo with a high CR (And the Duo was relevant to me) and because I didn't know the guy tried to do a feat - he got upset and stopped moving. If there were some sort of communication- he would get the feat. I am not in anyone's head. So I can't guess what people want. But not participating was a low move, we both could be done with it already. (I ignored him and re queued and eventually got it done, but still). This is the selfish attitude I am talking about.

So to me as long as you participate - no matter your role - we're good. I'll only leave if you don't do anything at all.

I dont understand the problem, if u queue up as a support role in a duo and ur teammate tells you to go dps u have 2 choices: either u press one key and u switch to ur dps role (=u dont need dps gear,dps spec, dps artifacts) or u just ignore it and if the duo partner is leaving... who cares, u queued as support role so u obviously brought time with you and all roles can solo a duo anyway as long there is skill involved.

Last time I checked, Dual Pistols was Precision damage. Can't hardly say they're not cooperating.
For instance, I have a specific armory I setup as DPS gear, BUT for Tank role using Staff (Prec) This on a Rage toon. From your perspective I look as a Tank, but I am in full DPS gear, only setup as tank because for Rage at least, this is super beneficial if one uses the correct rotation, coupled with Prec, you do lots of Prec damage but also have the full benefits of a Tank. (As I said this is with Rage)... Am I not helping out if I am eating through enemies with insane Prec damage and ALSO receiving most of the damage because I am in Tank? (After so many years, many of us have found all these nice loopholes that make our gaming experience that much more fun).
For this rage toon I am talking about, I have full gear for both DPS and Tank, but, I prefer this setup I mentioned because as I said, I have the best of both worlds and makes my gaming more fun. And no, it doesn't take long to finish an instance... with this particular setup I have outdps'd a lot of people... and they've asked me HOW is it even possible. It's called :"TRIAL AND ERROR"!

Which is a perfectly valid personal choice.

What I don't get is why you think you should be immune from criticism from duo participants who prefer a non-lazy partner.

It's your choice. That there will be consequences isn't going to change because you complain on the forums that you should be given the benefit of the doubt for being, in your words, "lazy."

I don't think I've ever left a duo, but I sure laugh at people who do the stablizer duo in healer or tank or troll mode. I mean, gosh, without them doing that support, we'd probably have died instantly!

Or maybe not. If it means so little, why not just hit the switch to go to DPS role anyway? Even if it's primarily a cosmetic change, since it will quiet most of the protests, why not just do that? It's a relatively trivial issue, of course, but as an abstract question, why do you expect other people to cater to your choice to be "lazy"?

So, if being in Support role slows down Duos to an excessive amount, then one would think the same is true in Solo instances, correct? Well, then how about an experiment. I ran the T3 solo instance Monarch Playing Card Company once in Controller role, and once in Damage role. I recorded the completion times. I also wrote down what each build's current CR and stats are. Mind you, this is a pretty easy instance to begin with. The enemy groups aren't particularly challenging, and Deathstroke doesn't have any particularly tricky mechanics. It's just a plain jane beat down. And for parts of the fight he's not even trying to defeat the player. The biggest delays are the unskippable cut scenes and unskippable dialog before you can complete each Riddle objective. During my controller run I ended up running 4 or 5 laps around the first room because the first riddle didn't pop immediately. To be fair, I've never been quite sure what pops that riddle. It seems kind of random. It popped immediately during my DPS run. During my controller run I also got hung up on a wall twice, and accidentally slid down the elevator shaft instead of cleanly jumping down.

Anyway, for my controller run the stats are as follows:

Controller Role
Time to Complete: 06:51 minutes
CR: 80
Health: 7626
Power: 4559
Defense: 3073
Might: 2783
Restoration: 1218
Vitalization: 1457
Precision: 1508
Toughness 2500
Dominance: 1250

For my DPS run the stats are as follows:

DPS Role
Time to Complete: 05:57 minutes
CR 75
Health: 7270
Power: 4878
Defense: 2942
Might: 3049
Restoration: 1157
Vitalization: 869
Precision: 1762
Toughness 2500
Dominance: 534

And huh, it was 54 seconds faster during the DPS run. How much of that was from being in "DPS" role and how much was from cleaner movement and the first objective popping immediately? I'm unsure, but if both runs had been equally clean movement wise, the difference wouldn't really be something you're going to notice. Hell, I didn't notice a difference anyway, until I checked the stats window upon completion.

Both roles were using an identical power tray load out. As for artifacts, both builds use identical artifacts. This is because those are the only ones the character has. These are:
Entwined Rings of Azar (rank 79)
Gem of Horus (rank 19)
Omegahedron (rank 19)

My Source Marks are currently going towards finishing off my The Lost Auroch gear set, so I've not been caring about getting each artifact to breakthrough to the next tier. I'm banking my Nth metal for now until I do decide to save up for catalysts.

So as I've been saying, if I join your Duo with Miss Meow and I'm in Controller role (which I usually am) I am not slowing you down very much, if at all.

We both know its one thing to do that..other if ur doing it with no idea to play your character

I have done this exact test on multiple instances. I don't have the data as you just posted, but, you are 100% correct. Time difference is marginal at Best. IF, people are taking so long completing an instance in support it is simply because they BELIEVE that it is faster with DPS, which we know it's not true. Also, if in their case it IS true, then they need to look at what abilities they are using, how they spec'ed and what rotations they are using.

The thing to remember is... Those same people have no idea what they are doing when in DPS role either.

Is my Gadgets power rotation top tier damage? Probably not. But I chose powers which were aoe, hit decently hard, and synergized together well.