Dev Discussion GU73: Content - Too Challenging

brainiac t7 raid & darkseid raid, double boss fight and adds, hitting harder than one can heal or burn them

I agree not fair to the player who earned it. I'm 331sp 201cr and I Was out damaged by a 196cr 119sp over and over again ran with my wife in raids trying to help her build a toon and now her damage beats me. tried hybrid weapon and super powers not beating her. before you could add her total up in damage by times 4 and that would be what I used to do not no more can't beat her now with 119sp 196 cr anyone understands this they see it too low sp buffed high sp debuffed.

personally i found a few raids/alerts impossible even before stats revamp.. i never even finished science spire solo cause it was nigh impossible to get those energy orbs to the charger repeatedly. certainly some stuff needs tweaking but atleast now people will use their heads in missions. cut the lower tier difficulty for high crs and no drop rates but otherwise leave it as is. people are finally getting the gist of teamwork in raids now that they have too.

What a you talking about?! Which clamps, which nerfs?! Your wife just better player than you if she beat you... And if you still do not understand, CR now is just a numbers that shows what content is available to you. Stats and personal "skill" is really matter and it is great!

Mission: Clue Three (Riddler Mission while leveling up to 30)
NPCs: Joker clowns
Combat Rating (level): 28
# of Skill Points: 31
Mods: None
Power/Focus: Mental/PftT
Description: The Joker Clowns aggro really easily, and it's too easy to get mobbed and be taken down.

Edit: I forgot to mention that I saw this happen to several other players working on the same mission. I tried to go in to help twice. One time it worked, and the other time we were both overwhelmed. (And then someone hit Clayface, and I bolted!)

LPVE takes now twice as long as before , the npc have same amount of HP as before revamp but legends damage got nerfed.

a 6 min trigon run turned into a 16min run

Instance: Oan Science Cells
NPCs: Starlings, Vice, Qwardians
Combat Rating (level): tank 62, Dps 60, troller 43, healer (me) 60
# of Skill Points: 55 (blind queue - don't know anyone else's)
Mods: None
Power/Focus: Celestial
Description:

• Starlings were mobbing me, even with the tank pulling them. Their defenses seemed very high. (Sidenote, being mobbed by starlings is freaky!)
• Vice's control effects were extreme. When he pulls you in to get you in the plasma field, I usually breakout and roll away. I was stuck brushing myself off for a second or two before I could break out. I had power, and in one case I used my breakout trinket. There was still a delay, and one time this caused a party wipe.
• Qwardians hit too hard for adds

Overall, I'm really enjoying the revamp. The boss fights I've done have seemed right in terms of challenge. After playing multiple characters with different powers at different levels, I think two things stand out as needing a pass.

1. The control effects are affecting PCs too much. PCs need higher dom to affect NPCs of high level, but the reverse doesn't seem to be true. Our willpower should get stronger as we go so that NPCs in a Tier 1 alert can't CC higher tier PCs (or a few tiers higher).
2. The minions have too much health and defense. I don't mean they need to be hugely adjusted, but once I get more than 2-3 minions on me, its very tough to survive. I'm not a rush-ahead-guns-blazing type. It's easy to pick up a handful of adds, and the lowest level ones should be tuned to someone on the lowish end of the tier.

Thanks so much for continuing to take feedback! There's so much to try out, and I'm having a great time.

South Gotham Courthouse, this was a pain on the past, but now it is worse than die in lava, I have 3 guys on the team a troler (me) CR 71, a healer 90, and 2 dps, 1 was 139 cr, we take a very long batle in all bos a pain, but the last boss is impossible he kill everyone in about 40 seconds, I now he have some mecanics and bla bla bla, but it is not fun at all yje new minion he summon have a very large health pool and sometimes they are impossible to kill cause 1 man is aways locked by the boss, so when this happen to one of the dps is game over, for a dungeon made for ppl who have 70+ CR it is impossible to do , plz do something here , sorry for my bad english

Lpve if weapons got dmg decreased, then a decrese on npc´s hp would be good, f trigon´s that is afast one is taking a while, then with gotham courthouse, smallville etc, will be a novel

Essentially all the raids are extremely difficult now, almost regardless of how strong the team is and what tier the raid is. I don't know if that might actually be intentional, but it seems far too drastic to me. I haven't been able to complete a single raid T6 and up since the revamp, (have yet to attempt T5 or lower).

Aside from the raids, the Iceberg Lounge solo is very difficult now. I'm a 176CR Rage DPS; the Pengbot was difficult but I got past it on the second try with a soder, supercharge, and well timed use of a couple trinkets. Penguin was nearly impossible, it took me 7 or 8 attempts to beat him. I was using soders, supercharge, trinkets, and the orange barrel. Every time about 15s in and I'd have him down to 1/2 or 2/3 health, I'd have anywhere from 30% to 90% of my health remaining, and he would one-shot me with no warning and blocking would be futile because he would pop me into the air for a split second and then almost simultaneously execute me before I could even react.
The Wastelands Wonderland Duo is also disproportionately difficult, relative to the other duos of similar CR range. Jacob had always been fairly tough, but now he lethally instant kills me on top of the adds doing much more significant damage. Took half a dozen attempts for me and a 145CR partner to beat him, and my partner was KO'd but I finished off the last 1/4 of Jacob's health by myself using the Sentinels, trinkets, the orange crystal, a couple supercharges, and a couple soders (and a lot of blocking and rolling around to stall for cooldowns).

Demons Plan (not elite)

DPS 140, 156, Troll 144
Me 201 DPS Full special forces mods, full base specials mods, starro op items (ring, face, trinket) AF3 OP items (ring, neck) and the 182 OP helmet

struggled through most of it, died on last boss every time...
...
...

Just finished up the Demons Plan normal alert with my cr 163 electric healer. Some notes on how it all went in my perspective.

Power wasn't an issue for me, surprisingly, considering we didn't have a controller. I was able to heal fine though I've never been one to spam heals. Gotta say, though, that electric healing agro is ridiculous. From bosses to trash mobs, once I popped a heal I had agro on everything non stop. I was using electrogenesis on cool down, not sure if that power was the cause of it or any heal.

Once I got adjusted to having agro on everything, instance went pretty smooth up to the last boss fight. Trying to "heal tank" the Ra's Al Ghul fight was awful. I literally spent the majority of my time blocking and occasionally let go to spam some heals or a super charge. Took five attempts before we managed to beat him. One of the adds hit me for 4200, which is like a quarter of my health. Facing numerous adds in the fight? Yeah, good luck .

Was going to try and run A Rip In Time to test things further but kept getting dc'd with 0x002f error.

Yeah, anything with ground "fire" sort of mechanics, mantis, braniac magic whachamadoodle in the Themy Raid can basically 1 shot you if you fail to execute the mechanics to stay out of it

And yes, the braniac meteor fire ball thing in the Themy raid, did indeed melt my face off as a 199/242 dps - took two tries but i finally managed to do that fight without being hit by any of the fire meteors - so i can certainly see how mantis' stuff would melt some @ level folk - those bits of mechanic probably need to be tuned a bit - they're overly unforgiving regardless of gear/sp

edit for clarification:
I dont necessarily have an issue with those special attack mechanics and the damage they cause BUT.
if the fights are to take 3-4x as long. then the speed / tempo of how often those attacks occur should probably be less frequent

having gone through the themy raid braniac magic dude fight having dodged 14 of 15 meteors throughout the fight usually leads to a very efficient and successful fight - having dodged 80 of 85 meteors usually means everyones dead but you. lol

(meteor counts are arbitrary - didnt actually count them)

For older content, minimum CR should be revisited. Going into older alerts and raids with min cr players is really painful now

GLITCH REPORT

In New Genesis (Open World) against Steppenwolf bounty boss fight, as a CR 113, his pull one-shots you, with no chance to block or roll away. Literally in mid-air you die.

So far every solo I've tested has been no problem, with one exception, so I think this qualifies under the too challenging glitch: The Penguin in Iceberg Lounge. I was at full strength, lost close to 90% health by a single exploding Penguin. And there's usually 6 or so of them in the room in addition to Penguin's pretty heavy attacks. So that one is truly imbalanced.

To emphasize my earlier post. I don't see how a team could get through a tier 2 raid if every member was in the zone (cr 43-64). They won't have role gear, they won't have mods, they won't have that much SP. Even if they were experienced players I think those factors would prevent them from accomplishing the mission. And that goes for each tier up to about tier 6. After players reach 100, they really should have all the things I just mentioned, so from that point on I wouldn't give much sympathy. But at tier 2 the bosses are much more powerful than me (I'm CR 200, 265 SP), and I'm what, 5x as powerful as players in that tier (considering they don't have mods/sp)?

Superman bounty is way too OP. It takes a team of 4 max CR 200+ SP people to take him down. I get that he is the man of steel but there is no way anyone on that level of content could handle him.

This is not about running alerts with 4 DPSs. It is about running RAIDS and 199CR not being able to kill a 119.

To be fair, the penguins did that before the revamp. If you got too close to those little guys, you'd be almost dead in one shot.