[Suggestion] Why NC needs to be nerfed

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by szqc, Jul 2, 2023.

  1. szqc

    Why NC needs to be nerfed
    I will explain from the following: Infantry Weapons, Infantry Skills, MAX, Vanguard, Reaver.
    Infantry weapons
    First of all, we need to know that there is a bug in this game, the infantry weapon panel fire rate does not match the actual fire rate. I don't know why they don't fix this bug, obviously they have the ability to fix this bug on the aircraft weapons. Because of this bug, the higher the panel fire rate, the more actual fire rate is lost. This results in NC's weapon actually having the highest dps.
    Let's look at the 167 damage weapons first. There is no doubt that NC has the best 167 damage weapons, from SMG, AF-4 cyclone is the superior alternative to MG-S1 Jackal and VE-S Canis, from carbine, AF-4A bandit has the highest damage in this attribute of 0.75, from assault rifle, NC1 Gauss Rifle is already the best 167 damage rifle. In terms of LMG, the LA1 Anchor is also the best 167 LMG in this game.
    In let's take a look at NC's unique 200 damage weapons. We can find that these weapons have a first shot stance walk of 0 (except for the SMG) which means that these guns are sure to hit on the first shot just like a sniper rifle. And all of these weapons can be fitted with Compensator (especially note the MGR-A1 Vanquisher, which has no recoil at all, so it doesn't need Compensator) which means it's easy to handle these guns. So you think NC players are cripples who can't control their guns well?
    Finally let's look at the 143 damage weapons that are the weak point of NC. ,from carbine GD-7f is the highest panel output weapon in this game along with VS's Serpent VE92, from assault rifle GR-22 is the best rifle with 0.75 attribute along with TR's TAR and VS's H-V45, Carnage AR is the only rifle with 750/143 damage model that can fit a brakeman, from LMG The MGR-L1 Promise is the LMG that has the most outrageous stability in this game. In summary, even the 143 damage weapon that is the weak point of the NC is not a weak presence.
    So, I think NC has the best infantry weapon.
    Infantry skills
    Demeter Veil (NC Heavy Assault only)
    First of all this is a team skill on Heavy Assault and at this stage there is no competition for this skill which leads to a big unfairness. This is similar to the case of LA60 Masthead, before the LA60 Masthead came out, the air defense could only be given to Heavy Assault or MAX, but after the LA60 Masthead came out, only NC's engineering got the air defense ability, from this stage there is no competition for this ability which leads to a big unfairness.
    Let's look at the infantry's AOE capabilities, there are currently three types of ammunition can help infantry to obtain AOE capabilities are: NC's SABOT AMMUNTION, TR's EXPLOSIVE AMMUNTION, VS's LASHING AMMUNTION.
    But the existence of flak causes TR and VS AOE gain only 20% of the weapon damage. The NC can get 100% of the gain at the cost of a 10% reduction in rate of fire.
    NC's MAX can kill the most enemies in the shortest time, from the weapons of TR and VS two-handed weapons together at most equal to 120% of the machine gun, but NC's one-handed weapon is approximately equal to a shotgun, two-handed is equal to two shotguns. 120% of the machine gun how can kill faster than two shotguns?
    Plus MAX skills, NC's shield is the only one useful in combat. How many people have you seen using Zealot Overdrive Engine and Lockdown in peer-to-peer infantry fights where they have far more negative effects than positive ones.
    So, I think NC has the best MAX.
    First let's take a look at the other MBT's skill gains. Magrider's Recharge is a little hard to calculate, for the sake of calculation I took it as dodging 2000 damage, which means a 40% gain; Peowler's Barrage boosts 30% reload speed, which means a 30% gain; Fire Suppression, which both work if You can use it at the last minute, you will return to 33% of the total blood, which means 33% gain.
    Looking at Forward Vanguard Shield, from the front it reduces damage by 67%, which means that during Forward Vanguard Shield activation your Vanguard's frontal equivalent blood is increased to 3 x, which means a 200% gain; from the side it reduces damage by 34%, which means that during Forward Vanguard Shield activation increases your Vanguard's side equivalent to 1.5x, which means a 50% gain.
    So from a gain perspective, this is outrageous.
    This is the most normal part of this whole section. First let's review the characteristics of each ESF. Mosquito: smallest size, fastest cruise, smallest jet thrust, smallest vertical thrust. Scythe: medium volume, medium cruise, medium jet thrust, medium vertical thrust. reaver: maximum volume, slowest cruise, maximum jet thrust, maximum vertical thrust. Still relatively balanced in terms of features.
    But why is the Reaver 1.1 to 1.2 times the weapon of the Mosquito and Scythe? This results in the Reaver always winning in battles of equal accuracy, and the Reaver has the advantage against larger targets.
  2. OneShadowWarrior

    It’s not a secret that the VS, TR and NSO get the shaft. However you can’t change what was built wrong at inception. It was the same thing in the first Planetside with NC dominance with the Jackhammer alone.

    Planetside 2 already made the mistake of giving one empire 200 damage profile weapons and on top of that large magazine sizes.

    1. As an ASP I get the best shotgun in the game as a backup weapon - Jackhammer.
    2. Everyone knows at the hands of a veteran your unstoppable with a Gauss SAW or Godsaw.
    3. Infantry vs. a Scatmax, your dead before you can react.
    4. The Vanguard feels like a real tank and a beast. In groups they push everyone back.
    6. The Reaver is 2nd in my opinion to the Mosquito.
    7. The sniper rifles with squared scopes and SAS-R with a 3x unstoppable.
    8. The Phoenix anti vehicle weapon is the only one you can spam from the spawn room consistently.
    9. You get a shotgun as a pistol for infiltrator.
    10. The Reaper, GR-22, Carnage, best assault rifles in the game.
    11. Masthead is the only anti material rifle that has a slight improvement against aircraft.
    12. EM6 Lightmachinegun, you don’t even need any attachment but a extended mag, compensator, high velocity and 2x scope and you chop people up, 200 rounds and vertical recoil takes zero effort to control. Many of the NC LMG’s are to easy to tweak.

    When fights are of equal number the NC will dominate by having the highest damage multiplier.

    I can keep going on and on.
  3. TheMercator

    You are wrong.
    • Up x 5
  4. Liewec123

    no one can even be bothered schooling these "nerf nc" folks anymore.
    there was a time when we felt enough passion to correct people when they call for nerfs to the worst performing MBT.
    but alas, those days are gone, and noone can be bothered now.
    • Up x 6
  5. KhlorosTesero

    Having gotten to 85 on TR, and now working my way up NC, I can say this, its not that NC is better, its that their gear is just easier to use.

    So RoF issue aside, ill take for example the MBTs. Lets look at the vanguard. First off, its a very easy tank to use, because there is nothing ghimicky about it, its a tank, it has armor, it goes boom boom.
    Because of this there is nothing really that is hard to use about it, or counter intuitive. It plays exactly how you think a tank would play, and favors the player that takes pot shots and backs out of fights at the first hit which a lot of new players do. This is because of the shield ability that recharge, it greatly favors players who back off once frist hit.

    So as long as you are playing semi conservativly in the Vanguard, which most new players will, its a very very good tank.

    Now lets look at the prowler, which is an odd beast but a very powerful tank, that i to thought was dog crap until i figured out its hidden power. The prowler can be played in 2 ways, long range sniper tank that basically as soon as you get attention you run. The other way, is a VERY aggressive up front brawler, and with the addition of the kingsnake turrent things thing will SRHED other tanks if you play aggressive.

    The problem with the prowler is you have to play opposite of what you think you should in a tank. You dont want to duel in a prowler you will die, you need to get up close and brawl and hit every shot, and you need to take barrage which will allow you to cream almost any tank you brawl with with out issues.

    Like all things TR, they are actually very very good, but you unironcally need to skill to use it.

    Thats said there are some things that some factiosn just have it bad with. TR maxes for example suck, then again, NCs do as well when you look at the OP vanu MAX.

    NC is not Overpowered, its just easier to use so on average most players will play better on NC.
    • Up x 2
  6. VakarisJ

    This is the first time I see anyone speak of VS MAX being overpowered since that ZoE nerf years ago. Usually people complain about NC MAXes – about their shotguns, about their shield, about Ravens, etc.
  7. KhlorosTesero

    I mean, i would say NC is OP, but ever since they made it so you cant rez them, they are not really an issue. VS Max can still apply its damage to things WAY outta the range of normal maxes.

    Ill go toe toe to toe with a TR max, I run for VS maxes still. NC maxes are pretty ight.
  8. waystin2

    Yeah. Nope. They seem to die just like the other factions when you shoot them or blow them up. Carry on.
  9. Campagne

    It does the heart good to see even after all these years, no one ever even remotely tries to prove any of their outright ******** claims.
    • Up x 1
  10. FlashBang

    I don't really think they are that op, the reason they seem that way is most of the cheaters are nc because of the high alpha dmg.

    That being said we either all need side arm shotguns or they need to be taken out. The vehicle damage on the godsaw is way too high in the time it took me to spawn a sunday and turn a corner one guy knocked out 20% of my vehicles health. It also has basically equal time to kill as vanu on men as vanu while being very slightly less.

    NC weapons generally have a slower rate of fire and higher dmg which makes recovering from mistakes simple, but the problem is with the godsaw is .12 seconds slower ttk isn't really reduced damage to infantry as it states, and not even recognizable by a human. I think you guys need to nerf both dmg types honestly because it does everything too well.

    Vanu get ammo, Tr get slightly better ttk, and NC get a single weapon that kills everything very well.
  11. TheMercator

    How many wrong statements can one write in two paragraphs?
    A cheater doesn't care about Alpha damage, especially one so minimaly better compared to the rest.
    The sidearm shotgun is one of the worst pistols in game.
    The godswas anti-armor damage is ridiciolusly bad.
    The godsaw already was needlessly nerved, unlike lets say the terrible OP Bettlejuice.
    And slower rate of fire makes recovering from mistakes harder...
    • Up x 1
  12. Demigan

    So this is a classic theorycraft, where specific things that (look like) advantages are brought up for the faction you think is OP and you present this as disadvantages for the other factions.

    But I want you to do something: look at the actual performance of these weapons. These performance statistics incorporate everything, from the biggest noob to the best player, from how they interact with air, ground and infantry, with the average loadout they face or use and the rarer loadouts that are used. All thrown into one melting pot to showcase the actual performance.

    If you do that, you would find that the Vanguard for example is killed the most and achieved the least per pull. On the other hand NC, VS and TR are more or less equal when the use NS weapons on NS vehicles and carbon copy weapons like shotguns and snipers, starter weapons not included. Similarly the NC weapons you describe aren’t among the best weapons.

    You can do that yourself. NC players have proven this enough, its time for the theorycrafters to actually prove they are right for once. You made the claim that NC is the superior faction and that certain weapons like 200 damage models are vastly superior. Ok so it shouldn’t be hard to prove, right? Find some performance data on such weapons and compare them to their counterparts on the other factions. Prove to us that you are right and not just ramming buzzwords at us hoping it sticks.
    • Up x 2
  13. FlashBang

    Do you consider 57 extra flat dmg, the only machine gun that does av dmg, and one less headshot for kills minimal? Because I think you are the only one. Yea lol ammo is super op...
  14. Demigan

    You seem to be missing the fact that when in anti-armor mode, it deals 50% less damage to infantry. Also it has less ammo capacity per magazine.

    If you are going to be quoting stats, make sure you actually do some research?

    Also also, damage per bullet matters little if the ROF doesn’t make you kill faster. But once more we can see how the complete package of accuracy, ammo capacity, reload speed, ROF, damage, damage falloff etc works by looking at the performance statistics.
    • Up x 1
  15. Deffington

    As someone who played TR for long years and now NC and NSO, I can't say NC infantry weapons are OP or something. You have to try them first... For example Godsaw doesn't work that well for me and Promise that you mentioned as stable I consider a complete garbage. Today I'm an ASP ****ter running Kuwa and Jackhammer. You can cry, or you can run Kuwa and Chaingun - works very good too. As for carbines and assault rifles, the most stable are burst weapons. Vanguisher is pretty good, but burst gaussrifle is much more versatile. Trac-B is great too. VS variant I haven't tried.

    But what really grinds my gears is the ongoing cry about Masthead. Yes, it was good when it was released and still is good.
    Thankfully, because NC lacks on AA.
    While Striker and Lancer are good in AA role, Phoenix is just a lucky hit against skilled pilot.
    And NC MAX has no ability to boost it's AA dmg output, unlike TR or VS steelsuits.
    As an NC, it is also less likely to get a lucky hit with Enforcer or Mjollnir such as you can sometimes get with Aphelion, Saron, Gatekeeper or Chaingun on low flying air targets.
    Even Trawler, very decent weapon overall, has a bullet too slow to be effectively used in AA role.
  16. FlashBang

    Deffington M8 I showed you the AA data in that other thread for max weaponry lol. The comet was 30 shots, and the vortex was 17 fully charged shots which is 3 shots in one so 51 shots lol. Most Vs just use the Ns AA guns which I believe everyone can use.

    Demigan yea pressing 1 or b is a real struggle lol. As for performance goes the close range difference is a fraction of a second, but the effective range difference is huge. So it is a more reliable platform, and the clips require less bullets to be effective, and stays effective a greater ranges. The reason it is more forgiving to mistakes is say you both make mistakes your enemy is going to be reloading while you lazer his head. Which is even more likely with VS directive weapons as they have smaller clips.
  17. Deffington

    Why would you even mention VS MAX weapons in AA? I'm always talking about Bursters combined with TR and VS MAX ability. And since TR and VS can raise DPS, it simply makes better AA MAX than NC can have. No other weapon makes any sense in AA role, not even Vortex unless firing at something big.
  18. Tr34

    Despite all those NC nerfs, Airhammer and Scatmax still keeps doing one-shot kills. I think they need further balance updates for certain cheesy stuff.
  19. Demigan

    so an AH can only OHK if every single pellet hits the target. The combination of AOE plus direct damage does 1000 damage exactly.

    So naturally, you are lying.
  20. Demigan

    Showing your complete ignorance there m8. The Godsaw isn’t a superior weapon to the Gauss SAW, it has the same damage falloff for example which has recently been nerfed so it has a higher damage falloff than other weapons by losing two tiers rather than one. The anti-armor mode doesn’t deal more damage to infantry in fact it deals 50% less and its not really that good against vehicles to begin with. Also any time I look it up these weapons have the same COF growth per damage point as their VS/TR counterparts, but because you lose less damage on an accidental miss with a higher ROF weapons they tend to be superior.
    • Up x 2