I used to run with a foregrip on the default gun but the horizontal recoil is managable. Although I have the Trac AMC I would not suggest it to anyone! I was disappointed. The first shot recoil is worst while full auto is better but I still feel the bullet spread on full auto is bad. I then switched to the Trac 5 S for the grenade launcher and got the auraxium medal. The accuracy on this gun still doesnt really cut it for me though. About a week before they announced the SMGS I bought the jaguar and I LOVE it. Also it is considered a cqc carbine I find its accuracy allows it to reach distances the other carbines can not. I use it with a 3.4x scope and advanced laser sight for that cqc hipfire.
Actually your statement is correct to the letter. Trac-5 and Jaguare have the same RoF and same damage, at point blank range it literally makes no difference at all for TTK. I'm not sure why you backed down from that, I understood what you meant though I had initially thought you were wrong because I thought the Jag had a faster RoF, spread sheet tells me I r teh tupid! And I completely agree that the whole thread could be avoided by research rather then lazily asked questions. I would have commented that Lokas was making up terms like contact shot that don't really apply in a game where it's impossible to even have contact with an opposing player (technically speaking). That level of detail really only has a place in forensics.
Why? Do you really place that much value on an internet argument? Right, and that completely justifies you coming in and being an absolute ***. Instead of just brushing it off and moving on. Incorrect. Accuracy always matters. No further explanation on that point needed. Alternatively; that's actually not what you said. At all. That's what you said. Which does not mention DPS, nor elaborate on what you mean. If you had said that the DPS of the two weapons was the same, you'd be correct. However, that's not what you said. At all. You said they was no difference whatsoever. Which is simply put, wrong. There are differences. Considering you made a broad statement such as 'there's no difference whatsoever' yes, I did assume you didn't have that information available. Now it more seems you need to work on your communication. Because as this conversation (I wouldn't call it an argument when you're the only one flaming, and only out of an insecurity to being corrected) progresses, I see it as more of a communication issue. What you meant to say was that if all the shots hit, there is no difference. They have the same DPS. Which is true. What you said is that in CQB, there is no difference whatsoever between the two guns. This is false. End of discussion. And that really will be the end of this discussion. I'd like to think that you'll just say 'Oh, sorry, I said that wrong. My bad." and move on. But you won't and I'm not going to waste any time trying to find new ways to rephrase my stance while you refuse to budge on yours. Feel free to respond with all your misguided vitriol at someone who was merely correcting a point you incorrectly communicated.
My guess is he knew you weren't going to drop it despite him saying to drop it and admitting he was wrong, even though he isn't. More on that bit latter. No, he didn't start the argument by being an ***. You poked at his statement and essentially insulted him. Granted this wasn't your intent but I've been there, I know how it is. Both statements are false. Jaguar has a convenient advantage over Trac-5 when it comes to mid-close ranges where target acquisition and tracking can get really tricky due to chaotic movement and panic mode. This convenience, however, requires the Jag to have adv. lasers while the Trac-5 is limited to simple lasers. At point blank, the range that Iridar was talking about, there are no differences between the two. "Point blank" was clearly a reference to situations in which accuracy doesn't apply. Secondly no that isn't his exact words. However it was his exact meaning, I figured that out the moment I read it. Maybe because I understand the term "point blank" to mean a situation in which accuracy values are completely negated, and it is purely a contest of DPS. First, his statement was accurate. If anyone mis-communicated it was you by failing to read his statement and jumping to the conclusion that you somehow knew exactly what he was talking about. Secondly I'll quote Iridar on this one: See the red bit? That's the bit that is really making you look stupid right now Lokas. I disagree with that statement, however he wanted the whole thing to end before it even started. Reading comprehension is every bit as important as writing. The only real fault that Iridar has in this entire discussion was that he can't keep a cool head and is easily (emotionally) motivated by what he reads. Again, I've been there. Probably about 1 year ago or less even. And yes he's snapped at me before as well. Not fond of the temper but I at least can recognize what he means and that he's actually an intelligent individual and should be treated as such. Seriously he wrote the damn book on LA, and you think he doesn't have access to "that information"? You should check out the author of the LA guide book that is stickied to the top of the thread here.
Sorry but you're wrong on that one. You can certainly make the argument that this is subjective and a matter of preference or situation but it's really not. The Jaguar is superior to the Lynx and the best carbine available to the light assault class. I have played extensively with all the carbines (well not the burst but c'mon.... its the burst....) and Jaguar is the best performing due to it's balanced recoil characteristics. You can absolutely shred people at medium range with a Jaguar with ease where compensating for the recoil on the Lynx is a burden. The Jaguar allows for you to take full advantage of your jump jets to pop up to high ground and neutralize 2-3 threats with a clip and disappear before they even know you are up there. Don't give me that BS "well I am just better at controlling recoil than you" because you aren't. The difference between the Lynx and Jaguar ROF is minimal at best... and will hardly if ever determine the outcome of an engagement. The ability to put 8 rounds into someones face with ease outweighs that minimal ROF difference by a mile. And you guys and your little flame war are sad.
The ROF counts in close combat - and you already described what you're doing. What you're describing is situational and medium range vs. close range. Go ahead and kid yourself that ROF doesn't matter, it does, but if you like being sneaky and taking people out from relatively safety then yeah, it won't matter nearly so much. Face them one on one up close, and you'll get shredded with your Jaguar by anyone with a GD-7F or Serpent guaranteed.
No I won't. For starters I have great movement and aim (at least above average) and shoot people in the head while most people simply unload on center mass. I work people with those Carbines all day long. First off both the GD-7F and Serpent have a superior rate of fire to the Lynx anyways so if you think you can simply out-brawl them you are mistaken. If you simply want to charge into rooms and shoot whomever happens to be there go play HA. I play LA because I really learned to play FPS games at a high level back in the day with Rogue Spear, any FPS in this style (as opposed to Arena style IE Quake, UT, etc) strategy is 90% of the game. I play LA because it allows me to attack from any angle I want to. The vast majority of PS2 engagements are decided by who acquires the target first and lands the first shot, not ROF of your weapon. This is where LA thrives because we can create interesting and unexpected angles and firing solutions. I am not kidding myself I don't live in a statistical vacuum where every engagement is standing toe to toe with the enemy trading blows. If that's how you want to play good for you but you aren't taking advantage of the strengths of the LA class if that is your style. It's also funny that you accuse me of playing "safely" because if you ask anyone I play with they will tell you I am one of the most aggressive players around. I just don't do it stupidly.
It's still speculation because you compare the Jag and Lynx directly. Jag might have a minor difference in RoF compared to the Lynx but how often does the Jag actually go up against the Lynx? The other CQC Carbines out there have a RoF of 845. Still think the Jag's RoF difference is "minor"? Aside from it's balanced recoil, it's improvements over the Lynx are minimal. Which means it really can't be called "superior" as it relies solely on one additional feature. Why everyone is obsessed with comparing it to the Lynx is beyond me. Yes it's probably a superior weapon in terms of versatility, but not when considering CQC combat. As for the head shots vs center mass. That is arguing with personal skill Secular. It's still entirely subjective and is easily countered by "Lynx can shoot faster so more shots to the head equals faster kill". Lynx has a strait up greater DPS then the Jag, and the only advantage that the Jag has is something that anyone can compensate for.
I think the main point of my argument is that people place way too much of an emphasis on statistics, particularly DPS as it relates to RoF on Terran carbines. I have never once died and thought to myself "man, If only I had another 50 RPM I totally would have won that". In practicality that isn't how things play out in PS2, they might seem that way on your spreadsheet but this game isn't played in Excel.
Yes, game is played by players, and most players are humans. Each human would have his personal opionion about something and, more importantly, his feeling. I myself strayed away from CQC as much as possible, because my rig isn't so good, and I tend to get low FPS in CQC. Also my past expiriences told me that I suck in CQC. So I felt bad about my CQC. But everyone praised Lynx so much I decided to give it a try. *Never fear*, thought I to myself: *Your poor skill in CQC and low FPS will be compensated by how awesome your gun is*. And whadda you know, I achieved great results in CQC, game is fun again for me. Now, you tell me, is this because I GAINED CONFIDENCE or because 698 (TRAC 5 S) << 800 (Lynx)? If you're confident about yourself, if you win mindgames it's not gonna matter what your gun is. Today I got killed by infiltrator with a Beamer (VS pistol). He paitently jumped around in cloak while I wasted my clip. Then he decloaked and killed me. He won in a fight Pistol vs CQC Carbine, and it didn't matter had I Lynx or Jaguar, because he had superior tactic. That's what matters in this game, not your weapon, which is a personal ******* choice. Arguing what's better, Lynx or Jaguar is just as ******** as arguing what's better, sparrow or bread.
I would trade in my MSW-r, Carv-S, and TMG-50 for a Gauss Saw (yes I know this is the LA forums). The Trac5s is not a CQC or a range weapon (yet another gun I have Auraxium on...) so it doesn't feel as easy in CQC, however it can be quite effective. The only thing that makes the Trac5s worthwhile are it's under-barrel attachments, otherwise its just a lesser Trac5. However I stand by my statement - ROF does not win you engagements.
I find RoF CAN win you engagements, especially against pesky Nanoweave users, it's just that usually whoever gets the drop on the other guy wins. In the case of Jaguar vs Lynx, the Lynx will help you win those close calls where you both start shooting at the same time, but the Jaguar will help you get the drop on the other guy more often because of its superior handling and distance shooting. Personally, I use the Jaguar, but every now and then I find myself wishing I had the Lynx instead. Of course, if I was using the Lynx I'd probably wish I had the Jaguar every now and then too.
If flinching didn't exist, I would agree with you. However, since it plays such a huge role, RoF is king, period.
