Pretty much where I am right now... I have faith, and that's about it... You just displayed the problem right there. You have a development team that doesn't understand Infiltrators trying to balance out sniping, another aspect they don't seem to understand, by completely making it worthless. It was balanced before, nanoweave just compensates for the fact that it's frustrating to other players...the problem with that is you destroy the entire point.
"Long range" sniping being nullified by nanoweave. I hadn't realized that this was a reanimated thread, but the quotes I had listed still apply. More blatantly so now days... Still, I really loathe reanimated threads like this...and my inability to actually look at the dates of threads. -.-
Yeah... Were it not for that, we'd have two options for our Infiltrators right now: the unique playing style of sniping and then the SMG run and gun hybrid style that they gave us when nanoweave just started becoming more popular. We kind of got pushed into SMG play, which frustrates me quite a bit due to being a rather deeply dedicated sniper.
Did you proof read that? You sound like a brat... Its not like SOE wants to go out of its way you make your experience miserable. THEY CARE !! They want you to have the best experience possible, their salaries depend on it. The remaining developers have far more pressing, core issues to address. Liberators are in the same boat but id rather they fix the core game issues first. Honestly, delete your own account, as a sniper you wont be missed...
It's definitely a challenge to address and hopefully overcome. Devs who: * have limited understanding of the Infiltrator class or existing gameplay * don't play and haven't played them in any comprehensive fashion * don't have any communication with or knowledge of the Infil (forum) community, and * will be in exclusive charge of both future changes and in resolving ongoing issues. On the topic of "NW vs. OHK" (NanoWeave vs. One-Hit-Kill, more specifically the suggestion to get rid of NW as a way to survive OHKs from Bolt Action Rifles), while I think the issue is important to many Infils, I also think it is bad for the Class to fixate on it rather than spending time covering other solutions or other areas that could also use attention/improvement. Specifically because NW > OHK is very popular with other Infantry Classes (and it seems the Devs), and changing it so Bolt Actions can OHK NW Users at any range is not likely a battle that Infils will win. One much more likely solution in making Infantry more vulnerable to OHKSs is to have the Devs boost the abilities of other suits and to add additional suits that are good, so that more players choose to NOT wear Nanoweave. So that NW no longer has the dominance it does now as the best/"go to" suit option for most Infantry. MANY other Infantry have recently concluded and commented on the ways in which NW hurts the standard Infantry game by slowing Time-To-Kill (TTK) of weapons, giving HA more reaction time, making lower Magazine size of some weapons a problem (unreliable if clip can kill target before running out), and unprortionately affecting already slower Time-To-Kill weapons much more than Faster TTK weapons. (since it takes the slower guns more time to chew through the added Hit Points) NW is not popular with the standard Infantry for these reason. As Infils, we can piggyback this to help push for a massive overhaul of other suits to get them buffed and to get people choosing to switch to those other suits because the buffs make them attractive enough.
Hmm... I have a fairly strong feeling that attempting to cover up an obvious imbalance to the system by making other options more lucrative will only work for so long. We're meant to take down high priority targets, and while these targets may choose the other options...their increased death rate to our class will result in a quick back peddle to the previous option available. All you have done is boosted the other options for the other classes, while those we are meant to take down will deem it more prudent to protect themselves completely from the class meant to do just that. Doesn't matter how lucrative the other options are, if you're being taken down more often by snipers...you're going to take that option. The frustration over one hit kill headshots is a ridiculous reason to implement something that negates an entire facet of a class. It would be the equivalent of providing a suit slot that negates shotguns, or a suit slot that completely negates battle rifles. We're balanced before you incorporate nanoweave into the system, and by doing so...it just destroys the very core of what sniping is suppose to be. You give the primary target of snipers something that renders them completely immune to the class that's meant to take them, specifically, out even when they have mastered the mechanics of their class. All that time learning the system...only to come upon a potential nullification of your reward due to no fault of your own but a choice of the opposition that's suppose to be your primary target.
I think you are vastly overestimating why most players wear NanoWeave. Sniper OHKs are not that important to most players, they are just a bonus. Nanoweave is popular because: 1) it slows Time-To-Kill on Infantry guns (more time to react, more change to survive, more chance to escape, more chance to outgun them, etc.) 2) it negates Personnel Mines 3) it some basic protection bonus vs. any damage types (bullets, splash, explosives, etc.) 4) it protects against OHK from Snipers Of those, only extreme range Snipers, Engineers in Engi Turrets or some using Repair Tool, and HA's Using Rockets from long range care about OHK Snipers as a top priority. Most standard Infantry are much more interested in #1 (or maybe #2). Even my Infil Loadouts other than Extreme Range Sniper care more about #1 and #2. If you split each of the 4 abilities of NW listed in 4 different suits, you would find a LOT less players running the #4 (OHK Sniper Protection) Suit. Either because they prefer another of the abilities, or because they didn't have time/option to switch out of the other suit even when switch to a situation where they want the OHK Sniper Protection. Players used to wear Flak Armor a lot when Personnel Mines and Splash Damage was more deadly. But when they got nerfed, players no longer needed to worry about them at the same level. So moving to NW was a no-brainer. Actually, from a game design standpoint it's a very good reason to offer that protection... at a cost of forgoing something else. It's been widely communicated that Sniping highly frustrates a lot of players. Offering protection to it (at a cost of forgoing something else) is a great way to address that frustration while also not completely hosing Snipers. NW was already in the game at launch. It's just that the majority of the population took a long time to identify it's impact and to grind the Certs to Cert into it. So it wasn't until the PowerCreep set in that we started to see it become more and more of a factor. I am a HUGE proponent of "managing player expectations" (giving them a game where they can rely rely on their experience with the game to be meaningful and have value and have relevance) and in avoiding "style drift" (style drift = player experience of the fun ways in how the game or is played or balanced radically changes). And this NW vs. OHK is a TERRIBLE example of how this was messed up on. Players learned the system at launch and their expectations were set that OHK Snipers were part of the game. To have PowerCreep reverse that expectation/gameplay completely sets players who have developed that gameplay to be massively frustrated and unfairly treated. Hence the reaction from Snipers. Add into that the non-communication from PS2 Devs + the non-interest & ignorance of the class gameplay by PS2 Devs in the Infil Class and you have the mess we see now. It's not a good situation. It's a big mess. But there are ways out of it. Just like MANY of the ongoing issues in this game could be addressed in a manner that doesn't take a ton of labor and that doesn't result in breaking other things.
Just to correct you, I don't think Nanoweave saves you from mines anymore. I think SoE nerfed that a few updates back.
I might agree with this were it not for the fact that so many are extremely adamant about not losing that ability to negate one hit kills via headshot. It's pretty obvious that it's a high priority amongst many individuals. In my opinion, babying those who are frustrated about a balanced mechanic is not the best way to design a game...call me old fashioned. Furthermore, satisfying the frustration of your run and gun oriented classes at the sacrifice of your dedicated snipers in a game that already has population problems isn't too brilliant an idea either. Like I said, should we throw in a hard counter for everything people get frustrated over? I'm well aware of that fact, it was essentially a bait and switch. The game was presented with the unique playing style of sniping, which differs greatly from your run and gun oriented classes. At the start of the game, this presented a fairly challenging sniping system (The most difficult I've ever used.) with your typical reward...adequate compensation for the time to kill mechanic in the form of a one hit kill upon headshot. However, at this time nanoweave wasn't fully understood and greatly underestimated...so things progressed for snipers as they would in any other game of the past. Right around the time when people were experimenting with nanoweave, the majority of us were distraught over the fact that we are the least polished class and have so few options...essentially being nothing more than snipers. This brought on many threads about the lack of the infiltration aspects of the class and interest towards something similar to the original Planetside. Instead, we were given SMG right around the time that nanoweave became popular and people were starting to realize that it negated the one hit kill from your bolt-action rifles. I don't even believe that anyone wanted the SMG initially, and don't get me wrong...it provides an interesting option to your Infiltrator class but the majority wanted actual infiltration aspects over a run and gun oriented mechanic. That aside, your snipers were pushed into using the SMG due to the inadequacy of your long range sniping...the primary reason that all of your dedicated snipers even entered into the game. Were this initially realized, I have a strong belief that the majority of your snipers would have never even touched Planetside 2, and with the way our class seems to be pushed closer and closer to a run and gun style class coupled with the developer talk about one hit kills needing hard counters...it really makes you wonder if this wasn't the plan all along. Granted, I might just be overly frustrated right now due to having experienced a night flooded with lag that has left me downright infuriated...but you can see what I mean. We started out as the class with the least options and polishing... We gained an optional aspect to the class that wasn't everyone's ideal for the addition... The previous aspect we all loved was destroyed by the realization of a hard counter that then became popular... We're right back where we started in the first few days of the game...but this time with a playing style that few dedicated snipers even wanted. Granted, the Infiltrator update is going to be providing us with some interesting quirks...but is it really going to compensate for the huge slap to the face of every sniper? I think you're not quite understanding why we're frustrated... It's not just what you expressed, though that's definitely part of it and more of an additional reason why we're so heated. It's that with this hard counter, Planetside 2 has no sniper gameplay. This playing style was balanced long ago through the progressive course of FPS, and they're throwing in a hard counter to a playing style that was already balanced...which means it is underpowered and thus does not exist to any adequate degree to justify our presence within the game. Before the popularity of nanoweave...we were a bit annoyed by just how restrictive the base mechanics of sniping in PS2 are...let alone now that its hard counter has been revealed. Before nanoweave became popular, that was the fundamental balanced system...there wasn't anything more balanced than that...it was even a more challenging variant to its predecessors. They took that system and destroyed it, but the element of its destruction wasn't realized initially... Now, we're left doing whatever we can to try and find joy in the hopes of having that come back...or sighing in dismay at the thought of having to leave because there isn't anything provided in game that we enjoy. Like I said...if we all knew of this hard counter to begin with, many of us wouldn't be here... Again, let me reiterate... Imagine if there was a optional suit slot that completely negated battle-rifle damage. Imagine if there was an optional suit slot that completely negated shotguns. That is the equivalent of what's been done to snipers. ...or rather, if you really want to get technical...make sure that suit slot only negates their ability to do damage at close to moderate range. That would make them equivalent to the absurdity of nanoweave. Make them suit slots that negate shotguns or battle rifles at close to medium range, but permit them to deal damage at maximum range. Before you say that it's not the same because we kill in one, or two, hits...getting a second hit off on the same target requires them to be downright braindead or AFK. If you miss, they're gone and heal up to full HP via med-kit or medic. So, these conceptual suit slots would be the equivalent to what's been done to bolt-action rifles.
Mh Mh, i'm only rank 10 with my first BA Rifle (M77-B), and its frustrating in larger battles. Good target, shoot, pling, he runs away. A sensor dart near the enemy base brings more points. When i have enough points to unlock the Hailstorm, i will switch for it until they change NW. A change that i would wnat to see would be specialized armors that provide protection from different weapon types. CQ Shotgun Protection Small Calibre SMG/LMG/Pistol Protection High Calibre Sniper/Vehicle MG Protection
Let me start by saying that Sniping with Bolt Action for me is almost always about the Headshot for One-Hit-Kill. I don't like taking more than one shot because: 1) it means I have to be exposed longer (easier to spot, also easier to target and shoot) 2) it means I have to send more than 1 tracer shot in close duration to each other (enemy can be notice the first and track the second) 3) it's unreliable as a kill (which hurts getting kills and it can alert them to your position) I will take Bodyshots at certain times, but it is the exception: 1) lone target running across wide open area 2) target that has their head protected, but who I want to kill or drive off (like an Engineer repairing a Base Turret) They are adamant because they REALLY like protection from OHK. It's very nice, it stops something they find very annoying, and they don't want to give it up. But I still feel it's not their top rated Ability from Nanoweave. (except in the classes in situations as noted) If the other Suit Slots weren't so underbuffed (or their intended threat nerfed) and unneeded or if the Nanoweave Suit bonuses were split up into only being offered in different Suits (one vs. Snipers, one vs. small arms, Flak Armor, etc.) then we could get some quality variety in Suit selection for players and stop seeing the warped affect of most players running Naonweave. It's a fairly normal Design method in games that offer high degrees of customization. Game like Magic The Gathering do it all the time. Figure out what the players would like to have, then cost it appropriately (both what they have to give, and what they forgo in using it) and let them have it if they can stomach the cost. A problem occurs when the cost isn't balanced correctly. Such as the player not having to forgo anything meaningful to them, like we have with Nanoweave. Another problem occurs when the effect is too good/effective (especially if it's not a single player game and it is negatively affecting other players directly). Which is what many Snipers are saying. I'm not sure it was intentional, but you are correct. It was a bait and switch. (intended or not) Yeah, I was there. I enjoyed Sniping more without the NW. And it really has been a mess in terms of how Sniping has changed. And for many reasons besides Nanoweave: * Nanoweave * Decreasing Player Population * Faction Imbalance * Scout Radar * Recon Dart * Thermal Vision on Vehicles * Harasser * etc. Thankfully the recent change to Scout Radar has largely removed the Flash Scout Radar problem for closer range Sniping. But there are many other things to deal with for Snipers. Yeah, SMG and Infil Class development are a whole different issue/problem. I do like the SMG for the Class. But it speaks to a conception problem the Devs have in terms of understanding, caring, or being able to develop the class in-line with the playerstyle that has evolved by the players who play it. (or building upon that) I don't know, but I don't think they had a plan for Snipers. I think the Devs went with the SMG and no-OHK because they didn't like to play as Snipers and didn't like many other players didn't like being Headshoted. Yes, I see what you mean. And those are good points and synopsis of what we're looking at for the class. Also, I can relate on the lag problems. I've been learning flying ESFs lately, and Lag Time Warp and Lag Spikes have resulted in a lot of insta-death situations for me lately: Lag Spike into instant Lawn Dart, Lag Time Warp into sudden death from accumulated damage from sources never even seen. Yeah, the Devs not knowing the Class or what players want out of it is bad. And I expect it's largely gonna get worse. I don't have a lot of faith for the "Class Update". They don't seem to know the class or really care, SOE just had their staff slashed, they have communicated they are targeting other things in the game right now, and I saw how they "Buffed" the Nyx I USED to love. I think it's exaggerating and incorrect to say it has no Sniper gameplay. Case in point, I've been using my TR Alt since I'm learning to fly in a Mossie, and when I run out of Air Resources or need to grind Certs for my ESF Tree I resort to my Infil or repairing Base Turrets. Since I have the Hailstorm (which I hate), I often end up using my Bolt Action. You can see Sniper stats here: https://players.planetside2.com/#!/5428044677970277137/killboard I have a lot of experience as a Sniper, and I have a good gun and almost Maxed cloak on that character. So I am not saying it's trivial for unCerted or inexperienced players to know how to get results Sniping. My strategies (set-up and sniping) are pretty complicated. Though I'd be happy to relate what they are if anyone wants to know. It was challenging for Snipers, but annoying for non-Sniper targets. I know Sniping has been a pillar of gameplay in many FPS games for years now, and Sniping seems perfectly suited to PS2. But many players don't like Sniping and in PS2 with its huge worlds this can be even more annoying to them. This is why I DO feel that a version of "anti-Sniping OHK" option in the game fits. I just think its current implementation is very bad: 1) no Cost for using it 2) too effective at closer ranges 3) too widely used, and (if Suit balance doesn't change) it will be more and more widely used as PowerCreep (Certing of characters) continues It's also terrible that Nanoweave does not show up in game as a different looking suit so Snipers know which targets have it. (though at extreme ranges it would still be hard to tell cause the target is so small and suit variances wouldn't show up) I'm not against those types of Suits being added if players want them. As long as they were costed appropriately and not overly effective. To be clear, I only say that if you have a competent Design Team doing it. If they are incompetent, then you don't want them *trying* to do it because it's very likely they will mess it up. So, since I don't trust the SOE Dev group in this type of Design (they don't seem to know how to tune well or why to tune, and they are very bad with putting/leaving bad [and disruptive] things in game for a long time before they are even addressed [let alone "fixed"]), I would definitely not want them to touch it. I like a lot of PS2 and the SOE Dev group, but not in this area for sure.
Likewise. It might, but I doubt it... The entire purpose of sniping is to remove high priority targets; even if the only thing that this hard counter provides is the negation of the one hit kill headshot, I believe that our primary targets will take said option to avoid the class that's seeking to hunt them down. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. I take nanoweave for the additional health while running with an SMG because I know how easy it is to avoid death by a sniper. The majority of your run and gun classes don't seem to understand this, hence the frustration and desire for that hard counter. So while I'm more likely to take up a more lucrative option that provides me a benefit against several classes...I think that our high priority targets will continue to opt for the hard counter against us. I would never compare Magic the Gathering to Planetside 2. Sure, that particular card game uses that method of "balance" all the time...and they ultimately end up banning a majority of their cards from tournament play because they're downright absurd. The game is based around giving the players malleability to set up their own rules in general...like Dungeons and Dragons. This system doesn't work well in a first person shooter environment, especially one that already has population problems. Indeed, and it's downright infuriating. Truly, I doubt it was intentional...at least I hope it wasn't. I've had a lot of faith in the development team up until now, when I learned that they desire a hard counter against the bolt-action. The problem with this is that it gives the option to completely negate a completely unique playing style...thus alienating your dedicated snipers. That's what makes this all the worse. I don't even bother with short range sniping, I find it more prudent to just pick up the SMG despite my horrific run and gun oriented gameplay. The SMG just provides far more versatility in a situation where you're going to be encountering weapons specifically designed for that range, where your bolt-action (if you're using one) isn't at it's peak performance. The risk skyrockets, thus downplaying the reward. Agreed. I like the SMG middle ground style of play as an option, but as just that...an option. Agreed. We have no representation on the development team. I don't believe there is a single dedicated sniper on there, or I can't fathom how this could have possibly happened. It would be very shocking for me to learn that there was a dedicated sniper on the development team that didn't throw a fit about this to the degree that I am. Likewise, I've spawned several times and just died because my game freezes and I'm incapable of defending myself. However, I'm playing on a Dell Laptop that I believe falls UNDER the recommended specifications...so I've expected this. Which is why I rant about this too often. I want to stay, but if sniping isn't in the game...there's only one other playing style that would keep me around and that's the melee oriented assassin which would be yet another one hit kill methodology that your run and gun oriented players are going to get frustrated with... So I don't see it. I have no idea. I suppose they may change their opinion if the entirety of the dedicated snipers leaves the game, which many seem ready to do. There was a new rifle talked about, and perhaps that will bypass nanoweave with a long ranged balance mechanic in line with statistics as someone suggested elsewhere. I know many of us will groan at having to purchase another rifle, but it would still keep me here. Granted, It's probably more prudent to say that there's no long ranged sniping in Planetside 2. I'm typically one to throw out short ranged simply based upon my belief that it's just more prudent to toss the bolt-action aside for a SMG due to the versatility in situations where you're bound to come up against weapons that are more adequately designed for those ranges... Of course it's annoying. Harassers are annoying, LA troopers are annoying, but I think it's downright stupid to toss them out of the game or effectively reduce them to worthlessness based upon the fact that they're annoying. Then those same players shouldn't complain about an inadequate population, because they're alienating many players in their desire to kick an entire playing style to the curb based upon frustration rather than balance. Like I said, I truly believe that most of your dedicated snipers wouldn't have ever touched the game had they known there was going to be a hard counter...and I've already seen many say they're done. More are holding out for the update with hope...if they're disappointing, more are going to leave. I just think it's foolish to add hard counters to already balanced mechanics based upon frustration...especially in a game with population problems. If they want a hard counter to long ranged sniping...they're going to lose that community, there's no way around it. The more players that drop from Planetside 2, the worse the entire experience as a whole becomes. This isn't even really like nullifying a single gun for the run and gun class because you can still perform that same playing style with another gun and do great. This hard counter, however, completely takes long ranged sniping out of the picture...a completely unique playing style that many enjoy. While it's not the majority, it's more than enough of a chunk to see devastating results in the population if they're slapped in the face like this. They'll leave...and the void is going to be significant.
You're making me want to remake my Infiltrator thread... There's three playing styles I have wanted to see incorporated to make up the Infiltrator, the primary amongst the variations at least. Sniping: One hit kills via bolt-action Time to kill balance Reconnaissance and Assassination SMG: (Had no desire for this originally, bit it's nice to have the option.) No one hit kills.Hybridization between time to kill and kill to death balance.Harassment and general chaos. Melee: One hit kills via knife. Time to kill balance Espionage and Assassination
Usually the top strategic targets for Snipers are successfully dealt with if you kill them or if you just get a NW plink. Either they die or they go running off and stop what they were doing: firing a Rocket, manning a Engin Turret, repairing a Base Turret, Sniping Targets, troops crowding the side of a Tower, etc. There are a host of problems with getting a plink instead of a kill, but in terms of addressing many key strategic needs, the plink often suffices in terms of pushing the agenda of the battle: disrupting key targets from performing key roles. Getting the plink is more of a problem in terms of losing XP, allowing the target to locate you and retaliate (attack you, Q-Spot you, etc.) and blow your location, etc. I know the idea of comparing Game Design/Mechanics of seemingly radically different genres can seem silly, but I assure you it is a fundamental trait of Game Design. Many games of widely different genres are first concept tested through mock-up as a crude board game or card game. And most games can be broken down to core gameplay elements and then translated across game genres (strictly or loosely) relatively easily and typically with good results. It's because Games rely on fundamental systems of variable interactions at their core. The layers of theme or genre trappings are then layered on top of these. The same fundamental systems that flawed for a card game will translate as being flawed in a board game, video game, or sport. I'm not sure how familiar you are with Magic, but Magic does not ban the majority of their cards from tournament play. "Constructed" tournament formats have banned a very small % of their cardbase (you can see the lists here) and "Limited" tournament formats don't ban cards at all. Though even if they DID Ban a larger % of their cards, I don't think that indicates one way or the other as to whether the final approved card pool and game were well tuned or not. Magic is not designed to give players malleability to set up their own rules. It has very extensive "Judges" rulings on card interaction minutia and it has numerous Judges at each official tournament to ensure that the official rules are followed. Players are given a very diverse set of tool options and customizable configurations with which to pursue and achieve a win condition, but the actual rules base is very fixed. Game Systems, even MMOFPS systems can be broken down to fundamentals and tested in more stripped away genres like Card Games. I have used Spreadsheets in the past to break down a MMORPG component and assess and pinpoint its flaws (and how to fix it). Games consist of "theme" and "mechanics". Theme is the story and all its trappings, Mechanics are the actual rules of the game. You can extract rules from the game and analyze and tune them without having to marry them with their Theme when you do so. It's kinda funny when they said they were stopping all work to focus on lag, because Devs are made of Art/Design/Code (not counting Production, Q&A, etc.) and of those the only ones who work on lag are Code. Art and Design can't help with lag (except in creating art assets or assembling art asset configuration that tax system requirements, and I can assure you that is not being looked at in their lag overhaul. Short Range Sniping is actually much more viable now than when Flash Scout Radar was all over. And it's MUCH easier to find and set-up suitable Short Range Snipping sessions that it is to find or set-up Extreme Long Range Sniping. For Short Range, you just need a collection of enemies. For Extreme Long Range, you pretty much have to find where 2 Zergs have collided and have developed a stalled front. I can set-up session after session of Short Range Sniping Sprees (w/ High Damage Bolt Action, default Scope, and Suppressor). You just have to know basic rules of where to set-up (enemy with their side or back to you, moving sideways or away from you, etc.; in bush, under Tower Base platform, tucked in pocket in smaller Towers), how to use your terrain (cloak, come out of cover [if you're using cover you need to leave to see targets] and aim, uncloak and fire, recloak and return to cover), and how to process targets (closest one first, generally not when looking in your direction, only uncloak briefly to shoot if enough noise about, don't use cloak if it's otherwise silent, etc.) As far as getting to good Sniper locations, the best bet is usually just to hit <Home> and check where it would send you. Then check the Main Map to see who controls it and what type of base it is, then gear up as appropriate (Extreme Long Range for places you can drop on a cliff above or far off in a big open plains; Short Range for a Tower or Station; etc.). Well, can't win em all. It's actually very common for Game Designers not to be hardcore players, especially of all play styles available in their game. Still, its sucks since in this case they also seem to have NO interest in even trying to comprehend what the Class's players are even doing now. I think Sniping is in game still, just compromised and you have to know hot to set it up. I agree that good Extreme Range Sniping is very hard to find in game reliably. (though it pops up more often in certain bases/locations) But failed OHK Headshots are much more dangerous in Short Range Sniping. In Long Range Sniping they are more just frustrating at not getting the kill. We may see that style with the new Perma-Cloak, dunno. I'd love to see a OHK Katana that had to be used in main and only had Knife Range I actually hate to say it, but I think they wouldn't even notice. They'd likely just figure it was ordinary players leaving or that Snipers had switched to other forms of gameplay. I know that Designers have the ability to filter player data to see which groups they are losing, but I am almost certain this level of sophisticated analysis is FAR beyond them. I don't blame them. They are coders, and artists, and story tellers, not analysts by trade. They are very good at creating a derivative (copying: mechanics from other games, theme ideas from movies or books, etc.) experience with creative flourishes, they have a poor grasp on what data to grab, how to configure/track it, and how to read it. And likewise most of them are very bad at extracting and comprehending and being able to constructively adjust the fundamental game systems. Could happen. But I think since they have no Snipers on staff that they are just gonna turn their noses up at the thought of reintroducing unstoppable Sniper OHKs. I think Harassers are overdue for a nerf. I figure they'll get one once their "newness" has worn off so that people who bought them will feel they got their "money's worth". This is pretty standard practice for the PS2 Devs with regards to new toys. LA Trooper Shotgun OHKs I think are on Dev radar as a potential problem issue. We already saw LAs given a louder jetpack sound as a slight nerf to this. Right now it seems they are either okay with them or they are still considering the matter. Have you seen the threads when people announce they are leaving? These are the bulk of the players you're talking about. Most don't care about anyone but themselves. They don't care about why players are leaving. They don't get why it might be important. And they feel entitled (and justified) in complaining about whatever they want. I think you have to solve your problems IN SPITE OF these players or through addressing issues that they care about too, not actually trying to mobilize them toward any sense of understanding of your needs. I think many higher level Infiltrators in general are holding out for hope that the Infil Class will be getting some changes that make the Infil Class more compelling. At this point, Infils aren't really needed for anything in the game. They can be handy, and even provide really helpful actions... but they're not really needed. Like I said: 1) I don't hold out much hope that PS2 Devs will ever get into or add anything to the Infil Class, and I expect them to impair the Class more and more as time goes on. (sometimes undoing nerfs or bugs that pop up for the Class, but ovreall losing more ground than gaining) 2) I don't think PS2 Devs will be especially aware of losing the Infil Class. Especially when they are losing players anyway. (in fact, I think they have already lost a number of Infils) I think the PS2 Devs will focus on keeping/drawing players based on what they like and create, not based on what they don't get or don't like.
Nah, that's a full-crew Harasser. Worship is the closest comparison to Nanoweave that I can think of for several reasons. The mechanics are very similar, of course - being able to survive damage sources that should be a complete overkill - but it goes deeper than just that. I could have posted a lot of absolutely ridiculous hard-counters to "specific" strategies (Anarchy comes to mind), but Nanoweave isn't something that you take just to counter snipers, and it certainly isn't useless when no snipers are present. Likewise, Worship is something that almost everyone wants to use, and while it isn't effective against everything, the odds that it's going to pay for itself before the game's done are very high. The problem, of course, arises when your opponent simply does not have a solution to Worship. That's when it goes from "significant but temporary inconvenience" to "completely insurmountable game-ender". And that's exactly what happens in Planetside 2. Infiltrators equipped to snipe do not possess tools capable of dealing with Nanoweave just like people playing red or black in MTG do not possess tools capable of destroying Enchantments. The difference, however, is that those MTG players do possess an incredible variety of alternate solutions that a single card, even one as powerful as Worship, cannot overcome. Basically, snipers do not have meaningful loadout choices, which is where an acceptable counter to Nanoweave should be located if Nanoweave is going to be allowed to exist in the first place. The semi-auto snipers are only capable of ignoring it if you play TR or NC, and as a larger concern of balance, they're terrible weapons by any other merit. Furthermore, the issue is also with Nanoweave itself, and the fact that it's both the most generally desirable suit slot to have at all times and an extremely powerful hard-counter to a single style of play, which is killing that style of play simply because people are countering it without even meaning to.
