[Vehicle] HOW is the vanguard statistically the worst MBT

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Badgerbomb, Sep 2, 2015.

  1. hello1

  2. axiom537

    You clearly have no idea what you are talking about nor what anyone else is trying to explain to you...You appear to have little to no knowledge of statistics or even the basics of game balancing. While you do have an over inflated EGO, which you appear to think makes up for a lack of substance in your argument...
    • Up x 1
  3. SW0V

    Also, to any people that believe the Vanguard is the weakest MBT.

    MBT deaths per month per faction

    Lightning deaths per month per faction

    Harasser deaths per month per faction

    I see a pattern here.
  4. AlterEgo

    I would love it if the Vanguard had extra armor on all sides and its cannon dealt 50% more damage and had an even larger splash radius. In return, make it slow as fudge. It'd be funny, being miles away from the futuristic Abrams coming at you with pre-WW2 tank speeds:p
  5. SW0V

    God damnit! Stop stealing TR faction traits! *lockdown prowler*
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  6. Jake the Dog

    Well thank god Im on the internet, what would I do without you to correct me lol.

    F'n English wiz's. XD
  7. axiom537

    Yes, me too...you only pulled statistic profiles for the vehicles that would support your argument...And you did not normalize the kills in relationship to the amount the vehicle is pulled...Or in other words the Vanguard is pulled more then the Prowler and Magrider, therefore for that very fact it should have more total kills. However, when you normalize the number of pulls, then we see that Vanguard is under performing.

    See below, ColonelChingles explains the mistake you made...

    • Up x 1
  8. Danath

    Prowler AP + Vulcan + Halberd- 68.77 (34290+6446+2599 kills: 407.2+102.5+120.4 hours)
    Vanguard AP + Enforcer + Halberd - 69.24 (38623+12319+2959 kills: 491.2+169.5+117.7 hours)

    The Vulcan is the 5TH on the list of MBT secondaries. Is not exactly a representative sample. ;)
  9. Ronin Oni

    You can't be seriously that clueless when you purport to be such a tank minded player

    I mean, come the frack on. It's pretty goddamn obvious

    The harasser is a MUCH better platform for CQB AV weapons (hence why NC and VS are each getting one) while the Prowler has long needed a good long range option (GateKeeper, but heretofore has been almost purely Halberd)

    Prowler Vulcan stats are poor because the Prowler is a piss poor platform for it.

    You can make flank ambushes (being the fastest tank helps) where AP+Vulcan on an enemy MBT will shred it in seconds, but that's an extremely high risk playstyle, and will land you a few deaths to no avail for trying.
  10. Jake the Dog

    Vanguard AP stats vs. other FPC and P2-120 stats as per the last month:
    VKPU: http://ps2oraclestats.com/?stat=vKPU&weapon1=3460&weapon2=3730&weapon3=4008
    KILLS: http://ps2oraclestats.com/?stat=kills&weapon1=3460&weapon2=3730&weapon3=4008 <- outperforms magrider

    Vehicle ES Secondaries Saron vs Enforcer vs Vulcan:
    VKPU: http://ps2oraclestats.com/?stat=vKPU&weapon1=3442&weapon2=3704&weapon3=4029 <- close tie with saron (also note it beats the halberd on the prowler)
    KILLS: http://ps2oraclestats.com/?stat=kills&weapon1=3442&weapon2=3704&weapon3=4029

    According to the charts for last month the tanks performed as expected. With the prowler trailing in vulcan kills (due to the nature of the weapon, which will be made interesting when given ES secondaries).

    VKPU on AUG 1st for example:
    P2-120 AP: 5.6
    Titan 150 AP: 5.3
    Supernova FPC: 5.8

    Vulcan: 2.1
    (TR) Halberd: 1.8
    Enforcer ML85: 3.1
    Saron: 3.2

    Time for addition :D Ik some of us aren't in college yet so bare with me.
    Prowler stats on Aug 1st:
    Vulcan+p2 120 AP: 5.6+2.1= 7.7 KPU when put together
    Halberd+p2 120 AP: 5.6+1.8= 7.4

    Vanguard stats:

    Magrider stats:
    5.8+ 3.2= 9.0 KPU


    No they're representative and don't call me Shirley.

    Also if you haven't guessed I'm rounding the numbers off to the tenths.

    So here are the monthly stats as given by oracle stat tracker:
    Supernova FPC: 5.5 VKPU
    Titan 150 AP: 5.3 VKPU
    P2 120 AP: 5.5 VKPU

    ML85: 3.0
    G30 Vulcan: 2.0
    Saron: 3.0

    Magrider: 5.5+3.0= 8.5 VKPU
    Vanguard: 5.3+3.0= 8.3 VKPU
    Prowler: 5.5+2.0= 7.5 VKPU

    Source: http://ps2oraclestats.com/monthlystats/

    Wow such UP. Much stats. Vanguard stats are on par with magrider stats and prowler is actually trailing.

    Prowler very buff much wow.

    So yeah, there's your balance, prowler trailing vanguard on par with magrider. Try using the VKPU function it tends to be more indicative of actual tank stats and how they perform in everyones hands.
  11. Jake the Dog

    Nah, its called typing on a phone, and it's more difficult to type full organized thoughts on a phone than anything see last quoted post.
  12. SW0V

    Er, what? What other combat ground vehicles exist in this game?

    For someone who criticised someone else for not showing data to back their argument you sure do that a lot.
    The increased usage of Vanguards is likely not due to them being pulled more. It's likely due to their increased survivability because of their "I win" shield.


    So, yeah... there are more vanguards. But not because NC players are special and use tanks more. It's because their tanks are roughly 10% harder to kill based on stats.
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  13. Jake the Dog

    For a more detailed post (sorry I've been posting from my phone too much I tend to ramble and have disorganized thoughts) see the post I replied to axiom with.
  14. Jake the Dog

    These stats most people are pulling off the internet saying that the Vanguard is UP, are failing to take into account its secondaries which believe it or not you actually have another gun on top of your tank that someone (or you) can use. Take my posts how you will.
  15. Imp C Bravo

    Im not a tanker so this is pure speculation: but vanguards are the most defensive and toughest tank right? So they spend more time taking fire for the sundies and other ground vehicles. Using a "how much you kill metric" then of course the defensive tank is going to perform poorly. If you were to use, say, a "meatshields fire that would otherwise destroy friendly vehicles" I bet the vanguard is doing pretty good. Sometimes being able to weather a storm is important to the overall cohesiveness of an armor column.

    Again, the above is just a different way of looking at it and is not necessarily close to correct.
  16. Taemien

    You're not shooting down a Gal at 240kph (decent pilots know how to get it to go this fast overland) barreling in on a control point before it drops its people. The only way to stop that is to skywhale it with another Gal.
  17. ColonelChingles

    Haha, hey, I'm allowed to make a mistake or two. :p

    The important part being that when informed about my mistakes, I seek to correct them. :)
    • Up x 2
  18. Jake the Dog

    You're like the guy that jumps into my tank and is like "you can't shoot down that reaver". Then I blow up the reaver.
  19. Goretzu

    The thing is you've just said what I said only in a LOT more words! :)

    i.e The Vans's strength isn't something that occurs very often and can be mitigated pretty well indeed by good play.
    In fact even toe to toe an Anchored 2 man Prowler will beat a 2 man Van.

    So if you meet an equally skilled Prowler or Mag in general circumstances, overall (on average) you are going to struggle more than if you were in the other MBT.

    Which is why it is statistically on-par/sub-par - the Van isn't an amazing overall MBT that inexplicably and unexplainably underperforms statistically; the reasons it performs where it does statistically are very clear and straight foward.

    That's not to say balance is way out or the Van is useless, although that is largely (IMO) because the shield likely props up its performance.
  20. Taemien

    No, I'm the guy that orders my squad to fly over your Prowler while its busy taking pot shots at Reavers, taking your base and putting a Phalanx turret round up your tailpipe.

    I'm into winning alerts. Not cert farming.