Empire Specific Tank Utilities - if all factions had access to them...

If one could have lockdown on lightning...

Lockdown has a really severe downside. You sure you want to deal with that?

I would love to be able to lockdown behind a Prowler and actually kill it, rather than it being able to turn ONLY its turret and out-DPS me. I liked the AP Lightning until this happened. Haven't touched it since.

You don't want anchor on a tank that wasn't meant to hull down and do front line fighting. Unless you really, really don't like your tank.

The only reason FS and the shield conflict with each other directly is because they're both an HP boost on an identical cooldown.

Using the example of putting the shield on the Prowler, Anchor and Shield would be fairly balanced against each other on that platform. Each would cater to a different play style, each would do what they do well. Shield would only gain a slight edge because of how it would complement the Vulcan. Anchor's "downside" is also fairly minor for what it does: like the Vanguard, the Prowler pretty much has to sit still when shooting without it anyway. Really the activation delay is harsher than the actual anchoring.

Therefore if Anchor can compete with the shield, but FS cannot, FS is weaker than Anchor. Its sole redeeming feature is lack of direct competition, so if a Prowler driver wants an HP boost for his play style he *has* to take FS no matter how pathetic it is. This does not seem like something that should be solved by making the shield equally pathetic, while the other two factions continue to have ES abilities that are superior to FS.

If you absolutely insist on giving the shield such a harsh downside that you could actually screw yourself over by activating it though, then it needs to be a toggle ability (like Anchor is) so that we can react to changing circumstances. Otherwise there would be too many situations where you activate the shield at a time that seems appropriate, but then the situation changes and you can do nothing but stare at your screen for 8 seconds while the ability that was supposed to help you screws you over instead.

Funny, I still use my Magrider all the time, and Vanguards do that to me.

Sounds like magburn.

this is just what I've taken from these shield hate discussions as a non tanker

people are mad that their abilities are situational and that the shield is always helpful

so can't we just find a way to make the shield situational?

the only idea was to make it ramp up or have an activation timer like the upcoming changes to the heavy assault shields

if this seems really stupid and you're a a tanker please just say

Just wondering, since I had asked you in another thread and didn't get a reply. You're an experienced tanker so I find your input to be pretty useful. You're also a very dangerous Vanguard tanker, and I give out a Wrath of Khan yell every time you kill me. I've been seeing a lot of other people claiming that if the Vanshield was nerfed then the Vanguard itself would need buffs to remain competitive, which if true just screams that there's bad balancing going on somewhere in that mess.

I overall don't have an issue fighting Vanguards though I do agree that, particularly when compared with FS, the ability seems a bit too easy of a take for a build. I really don't like the flat nerf calls either, as just reducing the time/strength of the shield until it's on par with FS would be boring as well. Ideally any change would introduce a new layer of decision-making by both the person using the shield, and the enemy fighting against it.

If you Flank a Prowler with an AP Lightning and have cover that Prowler is dead as you should be able to get 2 rear shots before it even unlocks.

What have I done !?

Great discussion so far!
Please note, I specifically didn't want this thread turning into yet another 'nerf Shield' opportunity...

Rather, what I think we've shown is, given the choice, most tankers from all factions, would take the Shield.
Therefore that tells us (what we already know) that tanks across all factions need more durability.
(Tanks in PS2 don't 'tank'...)

The Magburner is clearly in need of a buff, given the poor response to the possibility of an equivalent being on the Prowler or Vanguard.
Therefore, making it omni-directional and/or more like the ESF AfterBurners would be a good thing.

Lock-down seems to have provoked a mixed response. But generally positive.
Yes, it does have the most obvious 'down-side' / disadvantage of the three utilities, but also some very marked bonuses.
(High risk - high reward).

Yes please I would love it if my magburner proppelled my tank into the sky if I used it when stationary.
Also what would a reverse maneuver look like in a magrider?

Heh!

I should have clarified...
the Magburner should be improved to use up fuel in the same way as ESF AfterBurners, not as a 'one boost then cooldown' sort of utility.
That, and/or making it omni-directional, so Magriders can, once again, strafe at incredible speeds to dodge shots, but only for a limited/short time.

If Prowlers and Vanguards got an equivalent utility (Prowlburner and Vanburner) then it could work like NOX being fuel-injected into their engines, giving a temporary speed boost (both forwards or backwards).
(Sort of like Harasser/Flash Turbo on a bigger scale)

The Prowler can turn its turret to roast a Lightning faster than it dies. That'll even work on a Magrider.

"TURRETS OP, NERF TURRETS, SOE DEVS PLOX!!!111!"

You're missing the point completly: Shield = Added durability. Anchor = Greatly increased DPS (between reload and shell speed). Magburn = fun but it has no combat impact of note.

People keep on talking about omniburning behind cover and what not but between burn activation and getting to that cover (client side detection ahoy!) you'd make it anyway or you're dead with or with out; either way the burn will not make a difference. If you want to do something then the Maburn can be given to all but VS lacks a proper way to impact on a MBT battle field actively. The Mag has lowest armor, lowest DPS, lowest shell speed, lowest top speed and largest profile (floating above ground). Some of those lowest are shared with other MBTs but the Prowlers has the highest DPS (a 1/2 AP Prowler can kill a 2/2 AP Mag while shooting the Mag from the front while the Mag shoots the Prowler in the back) and the VG has the highest effective HP pool with the fastest shell velocity making it impossible to kill 1 vs 1 if you can't force it to pop it's shield, run away, hope it don't get you and then get lucky on hitting it (as it still has more hp and faster shots then you do). The Mag has the ability to side strage shots against poor gunners (active side stepping a seen shell only works beyond 300m and at that stage any MBT can disengage from battle at will in a MBT vs MBT). And before you say the Mag can flank; so can any other tank as well.

So if you want to give the Mag something unique yet in style then I propose move the Burn to common pool and give the Mag something like the ability to spawn holo tanks (fake tanks making it harder to know which tank to hit, if they should show up on radar and/or target locks would be dependent on cool down and how they behave/look like in game) around it. It would go with the over all theme of technology (papa Vanu gave it to us!) and being sneaky and flanking. It would not actively increase the armor or DPS but if used well would divert some of the shots in the wrong direction instead allowing the Mag to survive long enough to do the damage it requires.

Fair call.
Yeah, I'd prefer that all factions had variants on the 'Empire Specific' stuff, so that we can utilise various utilities, tactics and combos in different ways. Mix it up a bit you know?
(Rather than nerf the other guys stuff so he goes home and we're left on our own at the playground...)

So, how's this for an idea (might be broken OP, but would be cool as fark):
Give Magriders a Cloaking Device!
(A bit like Infiltrator.)
Put it on a 5-10 second timer with a 30-45 second cool-down.
Now Magriders be disappearing and reappearing like cray cray mofos!

He didn't need to unlock. That's why I think it would be cool to be able to anchor as a Lightning. You could use your small profile and high speeds to get into good positions, then anchor and obliterate MBTs from behind.

Anchor skyguard would be a real gem, so would anchor viper.