Cloaks.....THEY SUCK!

If you say so, but stealth will still not be uncounterable.

I don't think SoE are that stupid, I doubt they want invisible players with no way to counter running all over the place.

You speak as if full invisibility added into the game is a bad thing in the game's current state.

The changes done and the CURRENT cloak- are worse than they were. They can be seen more easily than they could before.

They can't recharge while invisible if what that other person said about early beta cloaks is true.

however, this isn't something put in game by the devs- this is bad implementation and thus isn't a proper counter and shouldnt happen because it wasnt intentional.

something that WAS implemented- you can't use any weapons until a sec after you decloak. THAT was the intended counter. and it works.

thermal and IR do see cloaks. They don't do the best job- as the funny graphics of the cloak make it hard to see in IR or thermal- however, thermal and IR are NOT hard counters to the cloak- because the IR and thermal were put in for a different reason than purely to see cloaks. it's just an ability they have to see stealthed stuff. No problems, no fuss.

All i'm saying is you make it sound like they would heavily dominate beyond anything we've ever seen, if they made the invisibility better and very hard to see across all graphics settings. I don't think so- as there's already things that stop that like the weapon restriction

And if you go back through the thread you will see that I support cloak making you invisible... while you are not moving. Currently this happens with certain graphics settings and not others, which is another issue which IMO needs to be sorted first.

:edit:

Although I've not mentioned my support for stealth recharging when staying still, neither have I said anything against it. Again, I think they need to make changes one at a time so they can see how each change effects things so would prefer to judge this after stealth is the same for everyone.

i think you'll find the case the rest of us are making is that it needs to be more effective while moving. Perhaps not full blown running- but movement.

the point about changes one at a time- no one will disagree with

Then lets agree that we all need to see stealth in the same way before we decide if how we see stealth is "correct"?

Standing also makes your cloak vastly less effective, guess they didn't add that part.

"nanites deflecting light" is "magical invisible." Pseudoscientific garbage about nanomachines deflecting photons doesn't make it any less magical especially when it fails to address problems with that sort of cloaking such as not being able to see anything.

In PS1 you were invisible so you could infiltrate bases and do useful things. In PS2 you are not invisible and you can't do much in a base anyhow, so I suppose its not a huge problem.

Ultimately, cloak is the worst thing to use when infiltrating a base, its better just to approach from an angle the enemy doesn't guard if possible, because everyone, and I mean absolutely everyone, can hear you go into and out of cloak. You can literally be heard, in the biolab, from the vehicle terminals below the biolab.

this.

i was of course being snarky, my point was that the argument of "the nanites just bend light not heat" is erroneous. these nanites which seem to be core canon in this universe are extremely advanced tech that does all sorts of cool stuff .... the thought that they can't also mask you from IR while bending light (not a simple trick) is absolutely laughable.

to further the point, something i always fall back on in these discussions.

the genre is SCIENCE fiction not fiction science. the science has to be plausible before the fiction. if it isn't then it is just a gag. many movies, tv shows, and games are use sci-fi horribly. some do it exceptionally. this game has a lot of "ok, i can do X why not Y"? with from what i can tell the only answers are 'because'. not everything has to fit perfectly but we aren't to that point yet. we still have a lot of 'huh? wtf?'.

this part actually isn't 'pseudo science' really. there is actual research into various types of 'invisibility' and even nanites which makes the 'science' in ps2 plausible. one thing i really like about the premise in fact.

however saying "these kick *** cool nanites can bend light" .... while then suggesting "but heat ... no no that isn't possible" is completely stupid. you're picking and choosing instead of embracing what can be a really cool theme. obviously game balance is key and the ultimate decider here however, infiltrators are so far down the "breaking the game" meter right now it isn't even worth considering.

You speak like Cloakers have a choice to uncloak infront of you. Sometimes you have no choice whatsoever to uncloak - even when an enemy appears from a spawn tube, drop pod, sunderer, Light Assault jetpack, or aircraft. There is little you can do, except prepare yourself to either be gunned up before stealth runs out, or for a chase/pistol fight when it runs out.

I eagerly await the science between a maglev tank which can ride over mud, dirt, mountains, snow, grass, etc.

LOL Their stealth works because they have a jungle so dense with trees and shrubbery that they don't even need the stealth to be hidden. If they were on Indar they would be dead in seconds.....

I think a counter like NV scopes are OK, as long as I am not getting killed while cloaked by anything BUT NV scoped guns. I am going to say it again, the Infiltrator NEEDS a buff for CQ and the Infiltrator NEEDS a buff for cloaking....

I swear if one more dip**** tells me to learn how to play I'm going to murder a litter of kittens.
I AM A GOOD FRIGGIN SNIPER AND INFILTRATOR WITH A 2.5 K/D!!! OK?????
This is not a matter of skill, its a matter of being underpowered.
Its the same with the Vanu, no matter how much skill a TR player gets, he is always going to be killed by a Vanu soldier with the same amount of skill, because Vanu are overpowered in everyway. (Please, though, stay off that topic, this is an Infiltrator thread)

It doesn't matter how much skill I get if my class is WAY underpowered, and I can never reach my true potential. Now I don't expect to be OP, but I do expect to have a decent chance against other classes (maybe not a heavy) in CQ, and I do expect to be able to actually INFILTRATE a heavily guarded base without getting spotted by every player in the base the moment I poke my "invisible" head through the back door.

it is alien tech ... in sci-fi that is an easy way to explain things away without having to be overly pedantic about explaining every last detail which in most cases will lose the audience.

why does that work? "it is alien" ooooh ok cool got it, moving on.

And why can't the same "logic" be used with stealth?

Why does stealth have to be true to current science but magical alien maglev tanks are perfectly fine?

because, they chose to tie it to nanites, not alien tech. we know this since all 3 factions have access to it.

however, if this were a vanu only ability ... it would have zero down side and automatically work for you without any effort on your part.

btw, i love how the cloak sound is disgustingly audible for NC, barely audible for the TR, and damn near silent for the VS.

I haven't seen the backstory for the stealth. I have seen nothing to say that the stealth wasn't alien nanites, and stolen from the Vanu.

that doesn't fit the theme anywhere. you're now suggesting that spies for the TR and NC managed to sneak into the VS RnD labs (oddly enough the same place willy e coyote goes) and decided that mag lev tech for their tanks wasn't worth a crap but man ... gotta have those cloak nanites.

see how many BS theories you have to spin to explain why something doesn't function logically within the theme presented when it would just be easier to fix the logical flaw?

1. I'm not saying they did, I'm saying that there is no more evidence that they did not than there is that they did. One can assume that they did or assume that they did not, but neither can provide evidence so neither is "wrong" by default.

2. You don't see how it would be easier for a traitor VS to sneak out a nanite than a big-*** tank?

you mean all three factions having the ability isn't evidence? TR developed weapons, NC stole whatever they could from them. VS broke away as a cult, being of TR decent and therefor already being exposed to TR tech, they re-used the tech that worked and added 'alien' tech into the mix.

tanks and planes ARE nanites. when you 'buy' a tank you're telling the 'system' to build you a tank FROM nanites.

No... 3 factions having the same nanites is not evidence that they were not stolen from one faction.

Evidence is not conjecture. It is not assumptions.

But to steal enough nanites to assemble into a tank you would require a tank-sized pocket. Or a portable vehicle terminal...

:edit:

More realistically, I guess the tank plans would need to be stolen. Again, unless you can provide a link to something official about how well guarded said plans are we have no evidence to say how easy or hard they would be to steal.

Just assumptions.