Air Hammer balance discussion (+ ideas for new A2A primaries)

Full Speed with afterburners, I still get hit with pods all the time.

Air Hammer is fine.

I suggest you do in game research before you post your ignorant nonsense. I have personally tested out the AH in game and it takes 5 shots to kill an ESF. This alone should be enough to question the accuracy of your other numbers. Also, you're very biased when you post the TTK of rotaries but not the TTK of the other AI guns.

FYI AH's large spread is made up by its ability to 1 shot infantry and 3 shot maxes. The Air Hammer is as good as the other AI guns against infantry in addition to being good vs ESFs too. When the AH becomes more widespread, it's insane damage output compared to the other AI guns will gain greater notice regardless of how you try so desperately to defend.

I suggest that you draw your conclusions from in game experience, and not stats you find in a spread sheet. It is ridiculous to even suggest that you always will be able to hit every pellet with every shot. I know for a fact that I have never killed a max with 3 shots. It might be theoretically possible - but there is a long way from theory to how it works in game.

If you just for one day tried to use the Reaver with AH, you would find that there are many situations where you are vastly inferior to the Rotary/Rocket pod combo. Be it against maxes or infantry, or any dogfighting involving a enemy pilot that doesn't completely suck. People fly with AH because its fun to fly around with a giant shotgun. I specifically also fly with it because i enjoy the challenge.

But for you to even suggest that the AH is better against maxes just shows me that you have no practical experience with the AH. You have to get so close for the AH to be effective, that even if it was a 1 on 1 between a AH and a Burster max with no other AA interfering, the burster will have downed the Reaver before you get in AH range. This alone should be enough to question the accuracy of your other conclusions.

I never claimed that AH was overall effective in a 1v1 against maxes. I only mentioned it takes 3 shots with the AH to kill a max which highlights the superior damage of the AH over the other AI guns. You certainly don't deny that the AH can 1 shot infantry which makes up for its large spread. Do you even fly any other ESF outside of Reaver? I fly both Mossie and Reaver. I have a much easier time using AH on Reaver.

I do not deny that 1 good hit with enough pellets will kill an infantry. That has never been a secret, so i don't see why i should deny it? But can we then agree that you have to get really close to get a hit with enough pellets to 1 shot an infantry? And can we also agree that the random nature of where the pellets go, cannot guarantee a 1 shot kill even if you are 5 m away from you target? And can we agree that the time it takes you to move close to the infantry from when you spot them, and you are in AH range, you could have killed them with rocket pods? or PPA? or Banshee? So yes, from when you press the trigger, until the infantry drops, it might be faster with the AH. But you neglect the time invested to get yourself in a position where the AH is effective. Where pods an Rotary can be effective vs. infantry at almost any range. You also neglect the inherent danger of being so close to infantry in order to engage them.

I do fly other than Reavers, but i fail to see how that is a point in your argument.

You are the one stating that the situational difficulty and scenario shouldn't be taken into account to decide on weapon potency, and this is in your eyes making AH OP (it may well be, mind you).
So accept another guy take your exact same stance, apply it to another weapon, and discovers it's also OP.

Case in point : the difficulty to hit every pellet on AH MUST be taken into account in balancing discussions. Which makes the gun less OP than you try to describe it.

wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait...



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wait...

people think the air hammer is op?

Well, there's definitely something fishy when I take AH + Fuel Tanks over Vortek + Fuel Tank because I know I can do 3x more things with AH :
* Be as efficient in A2A
* Be more efficient in AI job
* Be vastly more efficient against ground vehicles

If you ask me, AH problem is more in the damage it does against ground vehicles.

Ultimately, the overpowered aspect of the AH is its TTK against ESFs when compared to the Banshee or the PPA. It was my original point that the AH is more or less equal to the other AI guns against infantry. It is, however, immensely stronger against ESFs when compared to the other AI guns.

If you go back and read my original post, you would see that i do agree that the AH is way better at killing air than the other empires AI weapons. But that is because the air hammer in fact is an A2A gun. Werther it was intended to be or not by the game designers, the weapon is good at A2A. My solution to this imbalance, is to give the other factions a new empire specific A2A primary, or change the PPA and Banshee to be as "good" at A2A and as "bad" at A2G as an Air Hammer with no certs put in it.

Notice, I call it an imbalance. It's an imbalance because the other empires don't have an alternative A2A primary like we do. But the AH is not overpowered. That would imply that it is more powerful than the Rotary weapons. In my eyes its a sidegrade to the Rotary. It has some very specific situations where its better than the Rotary, and a lot of instances where it's worse.

And as a finishing note. I think we all should stop caring about TTK stats and spreadsheets. Especially when it comes to comparing a shotguns with a machinegun. TTK is only useful under perfect conditions, which never happens in a battle.

Are Rotaries still 650 m/s after the projectile speed nerf? Where do you find this information?

not interested no thanks,this doesn't need to be in game,the air is balanced how it is

The Rotaries were 750 m/s before taking that 100 m/s nerf. So yes, they're still 650 m/s (Scythe weapons have always been slower because they have no bullet drop).

You can get this info by reading the FireModes and Projectiles game files http://ps2.dynet.com/

https://www.planetside2.com/empires

Looking at the new changes on the website, now it is.

Fix brakes and fix pitch acceleration and the reaver is fixed.

I am done discussing this subject, they want the reaver to have the strongest guns, it seems early beta and tech test did not teach enough, so the AH stays like it is, for how long? is the question, heh.

As long as we are discussing Reaver Primaries, may I point out the the stock gun (Mustang, in the case of the Reaver) does indeed exist and thus should be included in balance discussions. I'm not an expert on piloting, but I can say from experience that the Mustang definitely outranges both the Rotary and Air Hammer by a pretty large margin, on top of being more forgiving to use then the Rotary. I can snipe targets outside of A2A missile range with it and actually afford to miss shots due to the longer-lasting magazine.

As for Rotary vs Air Hammer for anti-infantry work, one of these weapons requires careful aiming to hit infantry and the other doesn't. DPS isn't everything.