Can people stop post stupid **** about lancer being a long range RL already. All rockets/projectiles vanishes past 400-450 meters (good luck hitting an ESF with that range/velocity) All launchers have the same range limitation (render range). AND it's the only Launcher with a 100 meter damage dropoff. You need to stay in the 100 meter range if you want to use full damage. Using a Lancer past 100 meter it's like trying to snipe with a beamer, you can but it's useless.
What a well thought-out counterargument. It's clear you've mentally checked-out of this discussion, so I'll accept your concession.
This is not redundant, and it is on-topic with what you yourself brought up. All I did was give an example with the Vanguard and you went into the subject with all the wrong info. "not been nerfed" my butt. They aren't situational, these are the common combat methods. Unless ofcourse you are an idiot who drives to the most open spot in the game and then drives around there avoiding all cover while approaching the enemy and then being surprised that you have to look for cover once a Vanguard turns a corner. A corner which is immediately used as cover by said Vanguard. Also if we talk about situational, a 1v1 is situational. PS2 is about large-scale combat, and there's usually another vehicle or some infantry nearby that will change the amount of options each player has during the engagement. Pure 1v1 out in the open are exceedingly rare. Really? So the Harasser should be losing from everyone. It has the least health, the least damage mitigation and the least damage output even! Oh my god it should be toast! Except that maneuverability and speed are also important, as shown with the Harasser. And damage output is also important, because if you have 1000 extra health but your opponent deals so much more damage that your health is gone faster then that 1000 extra health+damage mitigation were inferior. So statistically, you are full of it. You cherry-pick stats. Hey here's an idea, why don't we assign weight and value to each statistic. Here's a bunch of the statistics you need to give a value to: DPS Damage per magazine accuracy (almost the same for all vehicles, although Vanguard has the "worst" recoil) speed maneuverability Hitbox size (front&rear/side/top) health damage reduction ability amount of ability usage. Now DPS and damage per magazine are pretty important, right? Higher DPS and damage per magazine directly counters higher health and damage reduction. So depending on the variety between these stats you need to grade them. Is 1000 health more valuable than say 50 more DPS? Or the ability to deal 50% more damage in a single salvo before you get back into cover? Getting back into cover gives you that nice question of how important is the speed to pop in and out of cover, and connects to the hitbox size as for example the Vanguard's long and slow frame can't pop-up and duck back into cover before the enemy fires a second salvo even though only when 50% of the vanguard's long frame is showing it can fire while the Magrider can slide in and out of cover using it's thinnest hitbox size and faster than the Vanguard can accelerate forwards and backwards again. This isn't something you can condense in a single "it's got more health, ofcourse it's better". All 4 tanks have advantages and disadvantages. The total of all these advantages and disadvantages makes the tank what it is.
The Phoenix has always been a spawnroom-only weapon (it is the only place where you can use it safely) and useful to annoy the enemy or finish badly damage vehicles by following the trail of smoke. Even with the current reload-in-flight bug it is not powerful enough to kill an healthy Sunderer if there is an engineer repairing it between shots, its DPS is pitiful. When I play NC I mostly use it to maim or kill snipers for the sheer fun of it: fire, gain altitude, give a look and then dive toward the pesky infiltrators. From that perspective it is really an unique weapon, not for racking kills but to have fun with. If I were DBG, I would keep the Phoenix but add a laser guided cooperative NS rocket launcher operating in this way: 1. player A (e.g. an LA or an Infiltrator) equip the laser tool, locate a target (either fixed or moving) and press the trigger 2. player B (an HA with the launcher) sees on the minimap an icon indicating a target is being painted AND it is in range 3. player B equips the launcher and lobs the missile in the general direction of the icon. 4. the missile once in flight scans for the laser spot emitted by the tool (so it must have LOS) and then it steers autonomously toward it, player B can lob another missile in the same way 5. if the laser is switched off the missile goes ballistic. To counter, vehicles can do the following: - emit smoke so the laser spot won't be visible anymore and the missile will loose guidance - equip a LWR (Laser Warning Receiver) that will inform they are being painted - rely on mark 1 eyeball of other players to see a big laser spot (maybe a very visible green one). The laser beam is not visible, otherwise it would be too easy to kill the spotter
I don't know what's worse. Defending a bug, or trying to mine the other faction things. Which are just bad after nerfs
Well I've just had another tedious crapfest on Esamir attempting to move armour up to Snowshear. Which is pointless if the NC are holding it because you cannot get within 200 meters before your MBT is wrecked by constant ******* Phoenix spam. Oh but it doesn't do a lot of damage an NC will say, wrong - it tales near 25% each hit. But you can shoot it an NC will say, well yeah, you can, but it rarely stops it hitting and this is with a Walker secondary.Yes but you are completely vulnerable when firing it an NC will opine, nah, 99% of the time you will be either in a spawn room or behind cover. I don't know about TR weapons because well, why would I but the Lancer cannot be fired behind cover. To fire a charged shot you need to break cover and hold position for release. Yesterday I was in a more generous mood but today I've had enough of this ****. I don't know if stopping it firing through spawn rooms will be enough because it can still be spammed safely from behind cover. It needs a double nerf. Either that or give me a self destruct button on my Magrider so I can at least deny spawn room heroes some XP.
I think you are worst. Defending a bug that could be made a feature to make the weapon somewhat capable isnt bad. Giving reasons why the Phoenix is used in spawnrooms to explain why its a bad weapon isnt defending the fact that it can be used there, its just that, an explanation why it has to be used there. There are several suggestions that remedy this, including from me. Suggestions that make sure the weapon makes you less vulnerable outside of the spawn so that you can use it there better, while simultaneously disallowing shooting from the spawn. But that doesnt fit your world view that anyone Who disagrees with you has to be wrong or bad so you ignore it for the most part.
A I don't know how to tell you. YOU CAN'T DESTROY EVERYTHING OUTSIDE 300m OF THE SPAWNROOM BECOUSE A BUG ALLOWS IT. This, or give the same feature to the lancer. Fair, right?
Thats right, you cant destroy everything within 300m of a spawn because of a bug. Fun with your grammar aside, I would ask you to actually start reading peoples posts instead of making up stuff to suit your needs. Giving the same feature to the lancer is bullcrap, because the Lancer already can do more out of the spawn than the Phoenix.
Id love to see this guy in PS1, he think Phoenix spam is bad now.....lol. It literally was the only rocket launcher NC used, and could be dumb fired, and we didnt have classes so anyone could use one. Really the kids today have got no idea.
How have you played so long and have such a terrible understanding of this game's mechanics? Range isn't consistent at all. Strikers reach past render range against air, so we're talking 800+. I've been hit by the Striker at around 1,000, as the guy was shooting at an ESF a few hundred meters in front of me and the rockets were coming from a hill where tanks weren't even visible. As soon as I got within 800m he started shooting at me, as well as the Skyguard sitting next to him. About the Lancer. Of course you won't hit an ESF at 800m, but you can sure as hell peg a tank with it. Most launchers use drop and slow velocity to limit their long range potential, but since the Lancer has neither handicap they needed to do something else. I don't have enough experience using the new Lancer, so maybe that damage falloff needs tweaking, but invisible Lancer squads just shouldn't dominate armor columns at 800m ever again. Neither should Phoenix squads, which is why they're hard capped. I personally disagree with anything being effective from the spawn room, so I'm not defending the Phoenix.
You are right, you can do more with a lancer then a phoenix. For exemple a lancer HA dies. A Phoenix spawnroom spammer doesn't
My new position on launchers is that they all need degrading damage related to range. More powerful than AP within 50m, and about 1/3 as powerful as AP at 300m. Coupled with that, infantry should never render past 300m, unless they always render at a further range. Infantry sometimes showing up but sometimes not causes all kinds of balance problems.
Huh. http://stats.dasanfall.com/ps2/item/35002 http://stats.dasanfall.com/ps2/item/33002 The Phoenix user obviously does die. Both weapons score below 1 KDR meaning the Phoenix user dies enough outside the spawn. How could that be? Well because every time the Phoenix user steps outside to use one they die quickly because of all the negatives it has. That's the whole reason the Phoenix is used so much in spawnrooms: Not because they can, but because it's the only place where they don't die so fast. But you've been told that only 10 times already and so far that hasn't sunk in so I might as well start talking to a wall now. Dear wall: If you look at those stats above, you might notice that the KPH of the Phoenix is slightly higher, but the VKPH is lower along with a greater up/down variance. This means that the Phoenix on average is worse than the Lancer, but has it's moments where it shines as well as moments where it's absolute dirt. So dear wall, this once again shows that there are people with extreme bias who will ignore statistics to prove their point.
You are right. The phoenix Spawn room Spammer dies. When somebody becomes so frustrated (WHICH IN A GAME IS BAD) and goes NC just to teamkill him.
Just give every faction a weapon that can damage vehicles (like deployed sunderers) from WITHIN the spawnroom WITHOUT direkt line of sight. This right there are the two problems with the Phoenix. You can counter any other thing, but not this. It's like DBG would say "ok, lets make some special stuff for the other factions: VS, your Lasher can now shoot inside Spawnrooms" ... i mean, 1 VS lashing into the spawnroom wouldn't do much damage anyway just as a lone Lasher doesn't do much right now. But get 2 or 3 Lashers together ....
