Why doesn't the Terran Republic ally with the Vanu Sovereignty? [IF YOU HAVEN'T READ THE LORE LEAVE]

Specifically the flashpoint was when TR leaders demanded that Vanu scientists give them the ability to specifically remove the ability of specific individuals to reproduce and possibly cut them off the grid. This was the last straw and resulted in them finally telling the TR to piss off, which you might imagine didn't end well.

So you're saying evolution is a bad thing? A higher level of consciousness is precisely what we're going for. Our quest is to make a better humanity. We're trying to mitigate aspects of human nature like greed, ego, and elitism, not enhance them. We want to bring an end to the endless suffering and cruelty mankind has put itself through since its conception. And no, that's not just me talking out of my ***. That's what enlightenment actually means.

What "tech" do you speak of? Artificial gravity? Energy shields? Body modification? Immortality? Stuff that ALL OF US use? What do you mean by a trojan horse, anyway? It sounds like you're pulling technobabble out of your ***.

Briggs wasn't our "leader", he's just a scientist who was influenced by an alien artifact. He suffered with a form of autism, meaning his suicide could have been caused by depression. He was living under the TR's oppressive and bleak rule, after all. Really it's just ammunition for you guys to load into your propoganda guns. You sound just like those political mudslinging commercials on TV during elections.

And the TR are just typical, cliché bands of tyrants, sheep with no cause mislead by propaganda and fear. You talk about people with dubious interests. What about Waterson, the guy who blew up an entire civilian vessel with Connery and several NC executives on board in the middle of peace talks? He's the one who took over the TR you love so much.

And how do you propose you return to Earth? The wormhole is gone for good. Even if you guys figure out how to harness Vanu technology (which is completely contradictory to your previous statement because wormholes are even more dangerous than whatever tech you think we have) the task of finding Earth out of all the planets in the universe (or multiverse, possibly) makes a needle in a haystack look like child's play. You are all stuck in the past.

Gonna need a source on that. Even in the old TR of Earth the NC was trying to get more freedom from the TR.

Gonna need a source on that. I've scoured the lore several times over and it says nothing about any alien godbrains or us worshiping them. What we "worship" is not any alien, it's technology itself and its incredible potential. Worship is a bit of a buzzword as well.

Yeah, NC is pretty bad as well. They're just misled, like the TR. Another problem of humanity we'll have to fix.

Again, needle in a haystack. It's safe to say that finding Earth is all but impossible at this point. The now closed wormhole could have dropped us anywhere from Andromeda to outside the observable universe to some other universe entirely. There's no way of knowing. If we could reunite with our loved ones that would be spectacular, but it's simply not going to happen. Sorry, but your goal is a mirage.

I still don't know why you're calling Vanu tech dangerous. All tech can be dangerous in the wrong hands. Nuclear power can be used to bring energy to millions, or to demolish entire cities. The wrongest hands I can think of are the TR's. Imagine a militaristic TR society where the government can nano-deconstruct unruly citizens at a whim. Nanite sized cameras tracking your every move.

Agreed.

Yeah, I wrote that a while ago. I got my facts straight now.

LUL CUZ TR HAZ BEST GUNS WOOOO








...

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Carry on...

Just an FYI, the NC are not terrorists (neither are the VS for the same reasons). At least not by the Rules of War and the Geneva Conventions. They wear a uniform and fight using limited warfare (not using NBCR weapons, or targeting civilians). As for the spaceship exploding in transit, I don't believe that was proven to be any particular faction (could have been real terrorists starting shtuff).

HERETICS!

The only ships that exploded were during the initial passing though the wormhole and the assassination of Connery, which was publicly blamed on NC but secretly carried out by Waterson and some of his men.

"As predicted, the wormhole did indeed open on October 20, and Connery's expedition fleet was expecting it. What they weren't expecting was the wormhole's massive gravity well—as it took shape, the rift pulled the fleet's first wave into its depths and deposited them on the other side before its ships could even engage engines. As subsequent waves attempted to follow, however, the rift began to destabilize, and only some were able to pass through safely before the gravity well, closing completely, destroyed those ships still near it. In all, only 40,000 people of the initial expeditionary crew survived the ordeal. It didn’t take long for the survivors' relief at being alive to be quickly overshadowed by the realization that they were trapped on the far side of the universe with a mere fraction of their original supplies. And the wormhole, if it was to reopen at all after the stress placed upon it by the fleet, was not likely to make a return for another 98.3 years."

You're also right about people calling them terrorists. At their start NC may've had some seedier elements that used extreme tactics, but after the passing of 200 years. It seems NC developed into a semi-formal military with slightly different goals. We have no idea of peoples lifespans on auraxis or what happened during those 200 years, so all we can do is speculate from there.

FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDDOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

With the NC overpop we need to lol.

https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?posts/2720502/

This thread had some good discussion which changed the point of view of speculation. Again, they wrote the lore to get each Faction to have Dark and Light to them. Everything is mainly Grey.

NC was a corporate run power house back on Mars under the TR in Sol. The Vanu technology is what got the expeditionary force lost on Auraxis in the first place.

I swear, Planet Side is like the grandest Social Experiment. I'ts amazing to see everyone's interpretations of each side; very few players see how every factions is just as ****** and the next one. And yes I know that sounds pessimistic. However every side also has just as much good as the other; though I think the VS is worse for humanity over all. The TR are afraid of change, the NC are infused with greed and the VS are blind to reason.
Each Faction has a Flaw and a Strength.

As to an Alliance between the TR and VS?
Lore wise, for what's set up; those in control of the TR will feel the VS is a threat. The VS are a "new" philosophy. The TR are an old one. The cult religious drive of the VS now directly clashes with the militaristic and duty bound ilk of the TR. It wouldn't work. The VS are driven to spread their new beliefs like any other religious cult would as it's a way to persevere. To the traditionalist TR, that an invasion of their Republic idealism.
Same goes with NC actually. While the top of the NC are nothing but Corporate Eliteist advertising the idea of "Freedom" to it's followers, the followers are truly in the NC fighting for what they think is "freedom" and "humanity". The VS are actually giving up their humanity by altering themselves biologically.
No matter how you look at it, each faction's lore is "DESIGNED" to grate against one another.

Where does it say they NC are on mars? That's an interesting little tidbit.

True. It's also what saved humanity from committing nuclear suicide. We were embroiled in a horrid war when one of the wormholes collapsed, tearing apart Pluto. Immediately we recognized it as a possible threat and buddied up into the Terran Republic. We owe that Vanu tech our lives.

I love that aspect of Planetside 2, and really wish the devs would capitalize on it. There have been some really great debates and arguments about faction politics here on forumside and on reddit.

I don't see how we're blind to reason, though. But I guess that's why I'm Vanu and you're TR.

Makes sense. I don't think the VS would be too keen on aligning themselves with what they perceive as tyranny and ignorance.

Makes sense as well. "Humanity" is rife with flaws. This very war proves that irrefutably.

I see that now.[/quote]

I believe that is old lore. On the newer wiki, the NC page litterally gives the Sol origins of the NC in two sentances. Isn't detailed at all. They took over Mars from what I remember and tensions between the NC and the TR were straining even prior to the Wormhole collapse. The Drama that occurred with Connery, Matherson and others was due to the NC first nudging for more power to continue to grow. Whe the Auraxis colonization happened is when the TR changed colors and became a bit more harsh, lashing back at the NC with framed terrorist attacks and other novel things.

From a realistic stand point, we'd owe nothing to that technology. There is actually a "class" system of civilizations that we use today and the TR, since discovering the Vanu tech and Wormhole? Briefly became Class 3. What this means is that we are no longer top of the food chain; that we as a species would wake da' eff' up and realize that we need to start prowling for food again or else another unknown preditor will take it. The Vanu Tech wasn't a God Send, it was a wake up call. The TR got lucky finding the scraps of some drifting corpse, feasted on it and realized "we're not alone".
Any rivals then rose up in the traditional survival of the fittest over said scraps.
The War that resulted actually made mankind stronger. It's sickening in terms of our social perceptions now; but on the scales we're talking? We're just rival ant colonies fighting for the right to evolve because we know there is ANOTHER species out there.

Like I said, check that thread I linked. If you havn't already that is. Sure the OP is TERRIBLY biased, even for my TR standards; but the replies were great!

Because as I said, each Empire is designed with grey. The Vanu may be a Technocratic Theocracy, but they are still infused with the belief that they can become superior to their fellow man simply by forsaken mankind altogether. That their choice is the only choice.
They are blind to reason because many of the leaders (most commit suicide) hear voices and give clues to basically being "Brain Washed" or at least schizophrenic.
The followers, thirsting for hope after 200 years of militaristic attrition and economic oppression are easy to be persuaded to follow such ideas. Tech, Harmony and Ascension for all... should you give up your humanity. Literally in every sense; even bodily.

Where the "Blindness" gets worse is that the "Voices" and "Visions" are considered blessings; but again on realistic terms? The Vanu could be a lot like us and simply be manipulating the VS for a future take over.

Once we go into space, we pass that thresh hold as a Class 3 Civ - we're fresh meat. Anything goes. Space is horrible. Unbearable. Every habitable world is a gem and every organic is potential life to consume to propagate your own. This is because space is so unfathomably vast. It may seem like a crock of "closed minded" views but considering our own history? I've got every reason to theorize that an other wise Alien Species will be just as vile, deceptive and war mongering as we are; given the circumstances.

On that note, the average TR populace probably feel the exact same toward the Vanu. You're not part of a "Republic", you're part of a Technocratic Theocracy. That's a very "Only special people rule" styled government and would be considered unfair and tyrannical.

Haha, yes. One of them being selfishness. Can't be a freedom fighting patriot unless you're selfish enough to fight for it. That includes your mental and physical humanity. But then again; I can't hate on the NC for choosing the right to survive as a Human and not give up everything to become something second rate to another species and otherwise entirely inhuman. That's just not natural.

I think your mistaking unity by force with unity by any means nessesary. The TR are quite capable of negotiations, they just need the chance.

Well America rebelled against the rule of the British Empire, so I guess America are terrorists as well

For NSA Freedom. For Oil Democracy.

Yup, anarchy is something else. Russia has something accurately described as "quasi-democracy" or simply "veiled authoritarian regime".

The TR also weren't happy when the VS scientists (still TR at the time) essentially gift wrapped re-birthing tech to the NC; specifically because without it, the NC didn't stand a chance. It was probably figured the side that pushes "freedom" would be more likely to let the science team have their little club house to play in by themselves, TR regulations were tightening by the day.

Still going to say it was Waterson who caused this; and just planted some NC gear on the ship prior to setting it off. A couple of the lore exchanges show he was actively blackmailing high profile people to his side. He also was very against Connery's "not marital law" policies. IE; most of the problems caused by the TR are actually this corrupt *****'s fault.

BUT THEY DO

at least on Woodman

I would assume they might have given the tech to everyone and kind of underhanded "Accidentally" to the NC, considering it would be difficult to determine who was with the NC and TR could still see the use in an immortal slave-labor force...as long as they had their finger on the kill switch, though that was the point where VS told em off.

At least IIRC, been a while since I read the lore, might have to go find it again

Homeboy, all three factions have teleportation. I just teleported from Crimson Bluff to Indar Excavation.

That said, with current NC overpop, TR and VS might as well join forces.

Source? I don't remember it saying anything about that in the lore.

Yeah, I know that now. I posted that a while ago.