Someone explain what makes the Battlegoose so good

So I notice I keep getting killed by this weapon a lot, which doesn't bother me in itself, but a lot of times the deaths feel too quick for what they are. Usually this doesn't put me off too much because there's things like server lag, player ping, shoddy hit detection etc. Although I mean we're talking like I've literally opened fire on someones back, had them turn around, and rip through my full health NW5 + fully charged HA shield with no headshot audio as if they had fired a pump action at me. I'm usually the one who rips peoples heads open at close range and get hate tells from them, but even when I'm on my game I've had times when my jaw was wide looking at the bright purple weapon on the killscreen wondering what the hell happened.

Tonights session was normal for the most part, except for a team of two dudes using Battlegeese in conjunction, they were very powerful, I had to get clever to counter them. Nothing out of the ordinary about that, in fact I appreciated the challenge. However, when I checked their player stats pages, I saw something interesting, I will link them here:

https://www.planetside2.com/players/#!/5428163811567904785/weapons

https://www.planetside2.com/players/#!/5428092153692005969/weapons

So the first thing I noticed was that although the 54A is a relatively new gun, both of these dudes have a number of kills with the weapon that I could only dream of getting over many years of play. Second thing I noticed was their headshot rate with the weapon. Now the weapon is an Orion sidegrade, with a few less shots per mag and a different reloading mechanic that synergizes well with killstreak playstyles, but nothing about it seems OP on a bullet to bullet basis. Why then do guys like this have much higher headshot ratios with this weapon than with the Orion? And what's with the instakills I keep experiencing with it? That's weird, esp when I get headshots on them and don't win.

Guy 1:
Orion HSR: 29.5%
Battlegoose HSR: 47.9%

Guy 2:
Orion HSR: 22.1%
Battlegoose HSR: 32.8%

Is this suspicious to anyone else? Have these players just improved a lot since they last used the Orion, or does every Battlegoose come with an aimbot? Not trying to get the weapon nerfed, I like how it's balanced and wish the other faction weapons were more like it, but honestly fighting against it raises some concerns.

I've been using it for a good while now and I find its partly more skill and a lot of luck. On the luck side of things I find I burst fire far more often now as to keep the heat level down but by doing so I maximize my ability to use the high vertical recoil to my advantage and have the last round usually always hit the head.

Infinite ammo on an already excellent weapon model being used by top tier players, its about what you'd expect.

The battlegoose has infinite ammo, making it have no downtime. that's what makes it so good. If it didn't have the heat mechanic it would be inferior to the orion in every way, since it would just be an orion without a foreward grip. Even as it is, the orion is still a better gun in a fight.

It's a trade-off taking it over the orion. You are gimping yourself slightly on accuracy for more staying power in a fight since you wont have to rely on people dropping ammo packs or needing to reload.

Geuse has less ammo per "mag" and punishes the payer harshly for missing. People who are good with geuse know that and will try extra hard to go for HSs.
With the Orion you have more leeway, and they know that.
So with Orion you are better off aiming for the chest, but with geuse you have to aim for the head.

The statistics shows the players accuracy and HS ratio with Orion since they were BR1.
Crappy BR1 stats will stick to their Orion stats always.

The geuse doesent have that problem. These guys most likely only started using geuse after they were BR100 and well experienced with orion.
I mean, that one guy has almost 14000 orion kills, so when he picks up geuse he had "some" practice.

Betelgeuse rewards people who can stay alive (to take advantage of infinite ammopool) and who can reliably get headshots (negate the accuracy, mag downside).
Players who can do those two things usually look suspicious, because they have high HS ratio's and can take advantage of game mechanics and make correct descisions in a fight.

Because they have already auraxiumed several LMGs to get it. Basically they are more experienced when they pick up the Battlegoose. That is why they are better with it.

Dash, as someone who has seen you ingame and appreciates your own skill, I am not surprised at the consensus in here but don't agree. These two are suspicious. It takes a lot more than luck to account for those HSR's.

One guy has 23k kills and the other 12k with that weapon (I'm counting the orion cause it's basically the same gun)
That's not suspicious.That's not luck. That's practice.

Keep telling yourself that. But also, do feel free to produce the average HSR across the board for those using the Beetle and Orion. You can do that right, just to show that you're right?

I have posted this before.
the directives weapon has no forward grip meaning increased recoil.
to some one who is not skilled with recoil this is a down side, (past 40 m) the orions effective range is within 40 m

heads are notoriously hard to hit in combat, this is why armed forces are trained to shoot for the heart.
the people that are getting these weapons are use to shooting for the chest/upper neck. the Orion if you take it in the vr with no grip you will find your self geting many more headshots with out trying than some other weapons, because of the way it kicks.

for all intensive purposes the only real downsides to the orions purpose are solved with the directives variant, it is a direct upgrade, just like the directive sniper rifles, it is not an area suppression tool, so no big mag, it is not long range so the grip who cares?

cant wait till i get mines lol,

lol. I actually looked at those players stats. They are simply top grade players. Unlike you I can see that and admire the skill instead of accusing people of cheating.
Keep telling yourself that everyone who is good is cheating. I'm sure that helps.

Yeah, thought so, totally unable to back up your assertion with any real evidence. As for telling myself that everyone good is cheating, I do often check first by the way. But a little more seriously, the crap that enablers have spewed for far too long, trying to basically bully people into silence in the game by telling them that they're just bad, that there aren't any cheats, or it's lag and all the rest, are just beyond lame now. People aren't idiots and they're starting to wake up, especially players who in fact are pretty good and do know about lag, latency, hit registration and all the rest. So try a different excuse or provide the stats you were asked for.

The game has a big problem at the moment with those who cheat, and those who enable and excuse them are often either gullible or complicit. Now, to be fair and since you're probably not going to be able to produce those stats or any real evidence, it is possible that this is skill, which is why I said suspicious, not outright cheating, but don't trot out the same old tired tactics that no longer work, to flat out deny people's genuine concerns. That's one thng that really does put people off this game and frankly PS2 and the community can't afford to do this anymore, especially with hackers openly laughing at the company and posting videos showing just how active they are right now, while some are still going on about, 'get gud,' 'mad cause bad,' and all the other twelve year old style nonsense that they got away with for so long.

Especiallysuspicious if you compare betlegeuse & butcher wich are supposed to have the same accuracy...

Aaaaand there it is: "oh the lag is so bad." "my hit registrations sucks" "they can kill people despite all that so they are cheating!!!11elevenone" wah wah wah...

Just to prove you wrong: Betelgeuse avrg Accuracy: 24.5% and HSR: 23.8 % / orion acc: 18.8% and HSR: 19.7%
source is Dasanfall stats page.

And what does this prove about these two cases? That they are above average. Way above average. That was never in question. My point was that they are simply two VERY good very experienced players. Averages are completely irrelevant to the discussion. If you had actually looked at these players stats you could see that they are simply very good. But I guess it's hard to see with tears in your eyes.

And I don't think you get how stuff like this works. You are the ones accusing people. So you get to prove the cheating. so go ahead.

But you are right. It basically boils down to this: You can't comprehend that someone could be this good without cheating.

The Betelgeuse is OP because it takes the best LMG in the game and removes its only downside (frequent reloads). For some reason it seems to play badly with clientside, as well (though the Orion does too), so it's pretty much an insta-death on the recipient's side.

The GODSAW and Butcher take weapons which are more situational or less good than the Orion, and then add compromises. The Betelgeuse takes the best weapon and makes it better. It's clearly unfair and that's why nearly every BR100 VS heavy runs Betelgeuse and why the stats on that weapon are far above the other Aurax LMGs (even though all the same arguments about 'practice' and 'skill' should apply there).

My current understanding is the Betelgeuse fires 49 rounds before needing the long cooldown. A reduced magazine size of 1 bullet.

What I find absolutely hilarious about those weapon stats for those two players...

Orion: Over 10k kills
Betelguese: Over 10k kills.
Every other LMG they have access to: Only just enough kills to get the auraxium and therefore betelguese.

Does make you wonder if theres just something about the orion/betelguese...

My guess is possibly that their statistics with the Orion are spread across their whole (long) career, whereas their statistics with the Betelgeuse start at a point where they are already exceptionally experienced with the weapon.

If not that, then cool paintjobs improve performance. BUY CAMOS.

EDIT: I look a bit closer at the stats and one of them has a lower overall accuracy with the Betelgeuse than with the Orion. At least I may be half-right.

Nope, but it makes me recall the mental breakdown and shed tears while trying to aurax the piece of crap Polaris.

After that I ended up with that purple piece of metal I just cant find any good use for except being a nice contrast to the windblown camo...in the fights I like there's too many enemies left at the end of my heat threshold...it's less accurate than the Orion which I liked as noob, but only until I discovered the SVA, a gun that feels a lot more like a faction trait than some Orion or Betel with their, in comparison, massive bullet spread.
"Infinite ammo" is a very very poor argument, because restocking ammo is usually about as hard as recharging shields. Not having to reload sometimes feels nice, yes, but only when 50 shots actually suffice. In a room with 3+ enemies that can get tough.

So instead of seeing people complain about people who have become just vastly experienced with LMGs, and therefor good, I'd like to hear how people consider the Orion better than the Carv or SVA.
I don't know so much the difference between Carv and SVA themselves, all I know is that they both are my favourite LMGs in the game and feel very much alike. The SVA shoots just less then a bullet less per second than the Carv/Orion, but all while landing the hits pretty much exactly at the very spot you aim at and I don't even give up that lovely 0.75x ADS.
Having used the Flare quite happily, the vertical recoil on the Carv was easy to handle and with that, to me it's an SVA with Orion-tier RPM, twice the Orion's mag-size and less bullet spread.

tl;dr... try as I might... I can't make the Orion/Betel to be that "best LMG in the game" everyone, even their users like to call it, because to me there simply are better guns which, for some reason, get very little attention. Of course I'm still a noob, but after seeing the Betel, I decided to stick with the SVA as LMG until death does us apart and I wish I had the Carv on my Vanu.

Pretty sure I'm doing something wrong, but what?

I assume its a numbers thing. Youll notice that the butcher is the lowest performing of the three.

I at least never see butchers in use, but i see endless beetlejuices and GODSAWS (After the buff at least)

From what i can tell and have heard its like almost all the directive weapons and not a perfect upgrade to the original, from what i can tell based on other people testimonies and what ive seen in videos its not much different in practice than the Orion which is the highest performing starter, if not the highest in game. I would assume that the following reasons are why its performing so highly

>Usage numbers
>Auraxium weapons generally perform better than their base model if they can be considered a viable upgrade to whatever they do, as shown by the directive pistols boasting a higher kpu, the tempest boasting the highest KPU and KPH of all smgs in game etc. Since it was based off a high performing model and can potentially be an upgrade its not surprising that its doing so well
>Since its a directive weapon generally only players with a decent level of ability in the chosen class/weapon class will be using it, which will boost its numbers significantly