The TR and VS MAXes have a lot more range, yet they still have the same number of kills per mag and a faster reload. You'd think the NC MAX at least had an epic ability that allows it to get to the proper range, but no. The closest thing we have to that is the charge, which is useless at lower levels. The shield is also useful but: a) It only covers the front. b)It doesn't help against explosives. And no, the shotguns aren't overpowered. All you have to do is run 10-15 meters away from the MAX and you're safe. In short, the other MAXes are way more useful and versatile.
Other maxes are continuously pretty good at various ranges, while NC maxes are godlike at close range and fairly useless at longer ranges. I hate running into NC maxes more than any other max by far though because I get oneshot instantly, lol. Atleast vs a VS or TR max you can try some evasive maneuvers or whatnot. If NC had their shotguns replaced with machine gun equivalents you might see that as a buff and Id be perfectly happy for such a change myself since I'd stop getting instagibbed!
While you may not get one shot by other MAX at the range in which an NC MAX can one shot you, you're equally as screwed against a decent TR/VS MAX. Not only that, unlike the NC MAX, the next half a dozen of your teammates will be in loads of trouble too. How many evasive maneuvers do you think these guys could have pulled off? Stole this recently posted video from the general forum.
All MAXes can have an instant kill on infantry. With lag, client side hit detection, and human reaction time if you kill under .6-.7 seconds on your screen it is near impossible for your target to do anything and is seen as a instagib or WTF hit me kill. That can get to about 1 full second depending on how bad the lag is at that moment and/or the server is taking a ****. All MAXes have a sub one second kill time on infantry. It takes 7-8 bullets to kill with a TR or VS MAX AI weapon. With a ROF of anywhere between 330 to 500 for each arm you fire those 7-8 bullets at average in about .57 seconds and up close you wont miss. Math- 330+500/2= 415 average ROF 415*2= 830 dual weapon ROF 830/60= 13.83 RPS 8/13.83= .57 seconds fire time. What sets HMGs from shotguns outside of alpha damage is the mag sizes. You have mag sizes from 40 to 100 with TR and VS weapons, with shotguns you have 6 to 8. So dual them and you have, assuming no misses, kills per mag at about 17 kills for the average TR and VS MAX and 7 for NC MAXes. Math TR/VS 40+100/2= 70 average mag size 70*2= 140 average dual mag size 140/8= 17.5 kills per dual mag. NC 6+8/2= 7 7*2= 14 14/2= 7 Accounting for misses and no matter how you run the numbers, more bullets is better for accounting for misses. There's also the fact that shotguns have 6 pellets in a shell, that helps with misses, but they have their own spread adding to the COF that you can not change or lower from better aim or stance. This is why shotguns don't have range, the pellet spread is impossible to deal with or counter Adding extended mags adds about 50% to the mag sizes to any weapon. Taking TR and VS average from 40-100 to 60-150 and NC averages from 6-8 to 10-12. Those kills per mags are TR/VS 26 and NC 11. The math is above, swap out the numbers if you want to work it out. All of this is in extreme CQC and not taking account for headshots. Add range to around 20m-30m and NC kills per mag goes to hell while TR/VS kills per mag goes to maybe 1/3 to 1/4 depending on weapon an luck. There's also MAXes to deal with and Iv covered that headache in a past thread and it showed that NC MAXes just can't do **** without majority headshots or forced extended mags and are still limited to sub 15m under perfect conditions. Then you have armors that I haven't touched yet with tests and the math. In short. Shotguns are not anywhere as good as HMGs. Shotguns have higher alpha damage, but trade everything else possible for that very limited gain. Not worth it and I ******* hate it. NS MAX weapons would solve everything in MAX AI balance debates, but SOE doesn't want them. That would be to damned easy.
That's why I've created a thread about NS MAX AI weapon. Speak about OP or not is useless, it's about gameplay enormous difference that shouldn't exist. => Change one shotgun to NS and disable other. Give to NC weapon look like VS's pewpew and TR's machinegun. => Give to all AI MAX choice between a MG or a shotgun. ===> It's not OP, it's not UP, it's not nerf, it's balance.
More uesful? not really. More versatile? indeed.. But most of times i see max: -Tower base. -Tech plant (espacially inside the main building) -Amp stations (A point, SCU and gens room) -Biolabs. And guess at what range are those fights happens? NC max have also the fastest TTK against ennemies maxes. also: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...QVFWS3hQQnZETWp1SmRZYk1oSWc&usp=sharing#gid=1 Better than TR weapon and as effective as VS ones. Mattocks being the best AI max weapon.
Hey everybody you should be using slugs and Falcons on your NC MAX happy to help #SLUGLYFE #FREESNUGGLES #BUTTS #FALCOWNS Spending 350 of the one kind of valuable resource on a suit that is worthless outside of 15m is as dumb as pulling a tank that's 750 mechanized resources and only have a secondary turret. Fact is that the NC MAX is fine, and the VS/TR MAX have too much range. The tradeoff should be like everything else - high alpha long downtime (NC) or low alpha short downtime (VS/TR), instead it's that ON TOP of range limitations for the long downtime MAXes
The reason why we want to get a better type of weapon is that our AI range is limited at 20 meters being the furthest. Yes, you could use AV weapons but those you have a huge range for error. The other MAXes can use their AI weapons out to 100 meters even. Yes, there are slugs, but those aren't very useful, especially since we only have a magazine of around 10 rounds.
No it doesn't. 'Aegis' and 'NC = shotguns' could certainly use some work but NC MAX does not currently underperform when compared to the other two. I can't say much for VS MAX, but you sure as hell won't be getting reliable kills 'at 100m' with the TR one.
How do you compare weapon types that have nothing in common? You can compare VS and TR MAX AI weapons from them all being of the same weapon type. HMG, a big *** gun. But with NC MAXes having nothing but shotguns you can't use the same data to compare them as you would to TR or VS MAX AI weapons. The weapon types are just to different and nothing about them that can be used to compare them with each other. Certain weapon types will have better KPU numbers over others. Certain weapon types will have better K/D numbers over others. Certain weapon types will have better score numbers than others. Certain weapon types will be .... you get the point. Fact is, there is nothing to compare weapon types without every weapon type being available to each player so that you can have the same, or very close, weapon type to compare to. We can compare infantry shotguns, carbines, rifles, and LMGs between factions because EVERYONE has that weapon type and there is something like minded to compare to. With MAXes there is not weapon type choice. 2 factions get HMGs, 1 gets shotguns. You can't compare those weapon types without MASSIVE amounts of data and reading each bit of that data in a certain way for each weapon type. Doing that leads to an infinite amount of bias. As for using AV weapons for AI work. **** no. AV weapons should never be a real option for infantry unless you're at extreme ranges doing a "why not" shot. Plus taking AV weapons can help with lone kills, but murder you against groups. Slugs though, I'll never use on a MAX as long as they stay like they are. Mattocks need 15 full point blank shells in the chest to kill a stock MAX, Scattercannons need only 13. It takes 20 slugs to do the same, 14 if 100% headshots. You only have at most 24 rounds to work with. They give AI range yes, but are not worth the certs seeing how they ruin your ability to fight MAXes and are another 300 certs on top of the forced 1,000 for extended mags. Plus there's no extra ammo or any way to lower the COF, outside of sitting in the dirt, that can help counter the high likelihood of missing. Slugs are a choice some gladly make, not me. I need to be able to fight MAXes when I need to, not when I want to. But I'll say it again as I have almost since launch. NS MAX AI weapons will solve just about everything with adding just 2 weapons. You get something to compare to and everyone gets their niche.
Falcons are pretty scary at medium and long range, even against infantry. Anyway, I find it pretty silly that no one ever brings up the biggest weakness NC MAXes have (their size relative to other MAXes, especially the VS MAX) yet will complain about their weapons (which are fine) all day. The fact that the NC max is wide as a barn is going to get you killed way more than the pitiful range of the buckshot you insist on using a inappropriate times.
I have Auraxium'd two NC MAX weapons & I cannot agree with your opinion. I think MAXes are fine, regardless of faction (except for Pounders ).
Hitbox size isn't a that much bigger than a TR MAX if at all. Cosmetic armors also don't add anything to hitboxes even though they look massive. Take off the armor and you have something just about the same as a TR MAX. For using buckshot at inappropriate times. Going across a room is enough to hit the range limits. Never mind going from one building to the next. Just going room to room and in hallways can often have greater ranges than that of buckshot. 15m, that is all we have to work with before having to suffer a 3+ second reload time. Let me show you 15m in a bio-lab. Most agree that 15m is the limit of buckshot. That is what 15m is in game and this guy happens to have made the video in a bio-lab, the one base said to be the breeding grounds for NC MAXes.
You're kidding right? The NC Max is STRONG and while it doesn't have the lethal range that VS or TR max has it still has decent reach to it. It wont insta-gib infantry past 15 meters, but it will still do a good amount of damage to kill them or make them run in terror. The NC max trumps any other max in close quarters by far even to the point where it can easily be considered over powered compared to the VS and TR max weapons against other maxes at close quarters. I have personally experienced the receiving end, as a TR max, of dual scatter maxes at close range and have video of how effective they are. 17 minutes in and 26 minutes in I get absolutely stomped on by both of the NC scatter maxes. Here's the specific clips from the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=P3F8ccZYRD0#t=1033 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=P3F8ccZYRD0#t=1564 The video may be old, but the shotguns for the NC max have not changed. The TR miniguns did jack to both those maxes compared to what their shotguns did to me. The first one practically insta-gibbed me. A lot of the time I can tell when I'm going against an NC Max player who knows what they're doing. They wont casually walk up to me, they don't try to shotgun me from far away. They will find a way to close the distance fast and kill me in less than a second if I don't find a way to make that gap between him and I bigger. The NC max is the absolute king of close quarters, where most objectives happen to be. A smart Max pilot picks their fights to how they are equipped. A smart NC max will use charge or the shield to cover distance and annihilate the enemy or retreat when they cannot handle the odds. Learn to play the class. As a TR max going against the NC. I don't fear light assaults and I eat heavy assaults with decimators for dinner. I fear the NC scatter max the most because that mofo can kill me before I take a quarter of his health out if I'm not careful.
All the NC max needs is some normal range guns like the mercies and stuff,i get so much better results on the VS max then the NC, and yes its VS max after zoe nerf
Wait, you're complaining you got stomped on by 2 NC MAX?! The shotguns haven't changed - well apart from the changes..! The first thing I do if I'm fighting NC in my MAX is to equip KA5. I'll let you in on a secret, the only AI weapons that can kill a KA5 MAX at ranges below 8m are an NC MAX using *extended mag* Grinders. Any other combination of weapons on an NC MAX at any range beyond 8m will not kill you. If they have a level 5 shield, if you fired on that MAX at the same time they fired on you, you'll burn through that shield and that MAX before they finish their reload. Just got bored on Connery playing with my NC MAX. 25m against an Inflitrator with my dual extended magged Mattocks - stuck in a Bio Lab where the only NC fight was and the other two continents queued. Infiltrator escaped. Had it been my TR/VS MAX, dead within a second. You sound like you've not used an NC MAX. I've got ~300 hours in them. I've probably got ~25-50 each in the TR/VS MAX. I'm pretty clear on the capabilities of each, not by judging how quickly I got killed by one but by actually using them.
I wasn't really complaining. More of stating facts with video evidence. I was using these two snippits from the video as evidence to show that the NC max does not need a buff. It's not the first nor were they the last times I've been insta gibbed as a max by an NC max. And yes I have used an NC max. The only faction I have not put time into playing is the VS.
