A Sniper's Ruminations [Problems/Suggestions]

I don't really have any issues with sniping itself or nanoweave, but I really agree on the weapon palette swaps. It's just so lazy.

Want to put a 4x scope/reflex on your bolt driver? You can't. You have to buy the near identical SAS-R for no reason at all.
Want to put a 4x scope on your semi auto sniper? Buy the near identical semi auto sniper (Shadow?) that can mount the closer range sights.

This is just seriously terrible weapon design. The rifles should have more differences than just limiting the sights they can use. At first sight It appears there's a good selection, but several of the weapons are clones with different sight options.

Then there's the LA80 which is just longshot with a few tweaked stats. Hardly no tangible differences. Is it really that hard to come up with some rifles that are not completely deriative of existing weapons?

It really is. Sniping weapons are some of the hardest things to balance in a game, because the game mechanics will often make a few or only one trait extremely important compared to the rest, so variations that aren't useless or overpowered are hard to invent. The LA80 isn't hardly different, its got 50 m/s less velocity in exchange for a somewhat better refire rate. The problem is when you refer to point #1; the LA80 simply isn't worth it because projectile velocity is everything for sniper rifles in this particular game, and its at the same exorbitant price.

Not saying it could have been done better though. They should have split the bonuses between the two rifles; only one should have had a velocity increase and only one should have had a damage increase. They should not have piled both bonuses onto one rifle with the only penalty being a paltry refire and reload speed decrease.

And the ones that can take short range optics have a velocity penalty over the standard one. Not insignificant, and its enough to turn me away from them in favor of the cheap 100 cert SASR.

I understand what you're saying and I agree that the balancing would have been better if the longshot had to trade off some damage for that bullet velocity. Or what about a Bolt Action with 10 in the mag? Or one that could equip an adv laser sight? I'll settle for anything more creative than slightly tweaking damage/bullet velocity/reload.

But in regards to the Bolt Driver vs SAS-R - the bolt driver has 50 more velocity (10%) and the SAS-R has like half a second faster reload (and slightly faster rechamber time I think). Other than those small differences, it's basically the same weapon with different sight options.

Add to that the fact that a lot of these rifles look alike - it's just lazy to me. SoE should really redesign more weapon models.

I think of all my complaints, the source of the problem can be tracked to general laziness. There's no cert trees for snipers, the guns are pallette swaps and largely similar in any way that counts. I mean, what use is the forward grip on a bolt action? You have to re-sigh after every shot anyway. Just goofy, and clearly at the bottom of their priority list.

Sniping is made largely irrelevant by one single thing in the game: respawns. Or to be precise, the frequency and just how close you can spawn to any given location. Practically every group larger then 3 will carry along their own respawn point.
How to fix this? You can't. SOE made the mistake of having drop beacon and AMS unlocks being so cheap they are practically free.

But as for what OP was talking about, there is a multiplier for headshot damage with every weapon. For sniper rifles this multiplier is the highest. The best way to "fix the problem" (some people don't see it as a bad thing) is simply to kick up the multiplier just enough to allow at least BASR's to kill on s headshot at all ranges. All other stats will remain unchanged. The damage a BASR deals when hitting any other part will be just as it is now. But when you knock someone over the head, you can kill them reliably.
With the exception of the final NW unlock. It costs 1000 certs, if you bank this much then I am fine with you surviving.

As for MAXes and vehicles. We have an EMP grenade that does nothing against vehicles, and just clears the already empty HUD for the MAX (no shields). So we make EMP actually do something. Shutting down vehicles and maxes so you can't move or fire. Or both, preferably.
Then there is the option of a true anti-materiel rifle. A gun with a 1 shot magazine that can damage a tank enough to be a threat. But I can just feel the simmering heat this idea produces. Too many AV weapons in the game at the moment as it is.

Everything you say is true, and I love your ideas.

In ps1 all sniper kills are a 2 shot affair, you could not cloak between shots, and you did not have a supressor so quit crying you have it easy.

I was the first sniper platinum on VS in PS1 and the second overall on Emerald behind AmbientOSX. I've forgotten more about sniping in Planetside than you will ever know. Be careful before you try and check someone. You never know when you might be talking to an expert.

Sniping in PS1 was easier for a few reasons. The players moved slower. There was less battlefield clutter (screen shake didn't exist, no smoke or effects of that nature). There was no scope sway. You could carry other weapons with you; for example, you could snipe with a rexo suit and have an assault rifle as a secondary weapon to fend off anyone who gets close. Also, it was easier to get into hard-to-reach places like trees by dropping out of skeeters.

All that being said, sniping was still difficult and I enjoy a position of privilege of being one of the sniper OGs in that game. You'll notice that Planetside 2 is a different game, however, and that's why we're talking about that game in this thread.

yeah ok whatever you say there bub i never heard of you. All I hear from you is i want my stuff easier. go spew your self name dropping elsewhere.

P.s. Auraxium was the highest weapon merit in ps1 not platinum.

Nicely put. Although I'm going to have to disagree with a little bit of it. Not the important bits, just a minor bit about the usefulness of a sniper.

First. Snipers are only directly useless against vehicles. Indirectly, they can be the nail in the coffin. If you are a sniper, you can do something to render that vehicle useless. It requires a bit of patience and forethought, but it is very rewarding: Wait for the tank to flee and repair and snipe the diver or gunner doing the repairing. I know it's a bit situational and requires a bit of dedication, but helps your faction out quite a lot. And if it's driverless, do a /region to tell your faction that there is a sitting duck to destroy.

Second, don't underestimate your ability to sneak behind enemies and hack their s***. Especially turrets. If you hack a turret that has a line of sight on your enemy's rear, rain down on them with their own phalanx. Even if it's the AA phalanx. It diverts their focus and forces a number of them to deal with you. If you.

Other than that, I completely agree, the infiltrator needs more love as a sniper class.

I do whenever possible try and snipe drivers, but it's very situational. Most drivers know better not to get out and repair where a sniper may be looking. Though sniping engies who are just repairing on the front line can be useful.

The point I was making is that their usefulness is already greatly limited (not invisible) so the elements that are limiting them further could stand to be re-evaluated.

I'd like to add an idea about a revamp for the assist system which at least would help snipers to not feel totally cheated when only getting assists instead of kills on nanoweave targets. The change would be the person doing the majority of damage to a target gets the kill while the person finishing someone on low health gets the assist, also assist exp should scale with the threat level of the killed instead of being a flat rate as it is now. So a critical assist on an extreme menace should be worth 75% of the kill exp instead of just 50 exp.

While this doesn't address the greater issue of nanoweave being too good or rather the other options not being good enough it may at least make the whole thing a bit easier to stomach if nothing else.

And I thought I'd add this as it seems appropriate.

Very well written OP. It takes an issue that has been beaten to death on our infiltrator subforum and reads like a fresh discussion on the class.

I LOVE sniping. It is a fun way for some of us to enjoy the game. The fact that we have such large maps and freedom to move around and find interesting positions makes it such a rewarding style of play. Yes, it should remain limited and challenging - current mechanics such as scope sway, bullet drop and velocity (requiring leading of moving targets) prevent this style of play from being overwhelming.

The rifle attachments need a fresh look. Forward grip and a flashlight? Come on!

Flash suppressors should be available as a barrel attachment. Again, something easy to do and already in-game, but not for our weapons.

I would love a higher velocity ammo selection for the scout rifles - the HA can get a battle rifle with HVA, but our nyx/HSR-1 can't?!?

What about a cert line to increase breath holding, reduce sway or use long range IR/NV or thermal optics in place of the cloak slot? A way to select a more "sniper" character from the "infiltrator" character without making two classes.

Don't get me started on nanoweave...

Anyways, while I'm glad SOE has us on the pending updates, I feel that the changes they are working on will be marginally useful and will ignore these other holes in the class design. Compared to the medic or HA class, infiltrator feels thrown together, and looking at the cert menu really makes it obvious.

As others have said, don't expect the most thoughtful discussion on the general boards - it's either people who agree with you or people who hate snipers and want to EZ mode from their AV turret without a care in the world... oh wait, nanoweave...

The worst are ignorant heavy assault players who expect you to enter their optimal range, with your 5 round, 1.5s rechamber single shot weapon against their 100 round fully automatic LMG before they consider infiltrators to be a "fair fight".

Anways, I digress. Great post, and I will have to keep an eye out for you on Mattherson!

We actually ran into each other. A few times. You kill me a lot. Nine times to date. I've gotten you five. C'est la vie.

Thanks for the support, fellow marksman.

Nicely written post, man!

First thing is they need to put the "infiltrator" back into the infiltrator. I'm still amazed that they can't hack enemy vehicles. Also it's too bad there isn't a 5 second window for an infiltrator or even team of them to hack enemy generators to sneak a vehicle(s) or player(s) into a base. Or for a hacked enemy turret to enable an npc AI mode. As you could see SOE could do so many cool things with the class.

As for the sniping aspect I find it worthless going with the push. However it's invaluable going against the push, meaning you are shooting the enemy from behind as your faction pushes into a base. It's very difficult and requires a lot of finesse to get yourself in that position though. And to top it off nanoweave makes the effort a total gamble since a headshot survivor that has half a brain will quickly hone in on your position.

Person's Health and shields is:

y = 500 HP + 500 HP-shield...
y = 1000 HP total.

W/ nanoweave, the following is true:

Yn = 1000 HP total + 250 HP = 1250 HP total.

You think it's OP because you can't get a 1-shot headshot kill... Lets look at the math from a VS Parallax. If we come to a scenario that the Mark or Target is standing still. It's a NC Heavy or TR Light Assault, it doesn't matter what it is truly, and you snipe it at the head at 200 m, the following occurs:

Target's health, M = 1000 HP.

You're shots Damage, D = (550 damage from the VS Parallax @ 200 m) x (twice the damage from the head-hit-box) = 1100 damage total.

So the waste in the shot is M - D = 1000 - 1100 = -100 damage; therefore the mark is a "One-shot, Headshot kill." The extra 100 points of damage is a waste, and thus is indicated by the negative sign (-).

What if the same target was wearing Nanoweave 5/5, and this gave his health 250 HP plus it's current health. So the following situation will wield the following:

Mn - D = 1250 HP - 1100 HP = + 150 HP left over.

The target or mark will still have 150 HP left after the shot to the head from the Bolt Action, VS Parallax. You don't get a "One-shot, Headshot kill" because there is still a 12% amount of life left in the target. So a 2nd shot would be needed to kill the same target...

So what I have listed up above is sort of the math behind it. It's not the real issue. The real issue is that the TTK or theoretical TTK of weapons versus Nanoweave is extremely high. In other words, the amount of time it takes to kill is a very large number, probably in units of seconds instead of milli-seconds.

A lot of your sniper-based players can't 1-shot a bodyshot kill. You can't do a follow up shot on the example I have listed above because you have a ridiculously long reload time, or input delay time in between shots. So you could never make the follow up shot.

On the other hand, if you actually use a Semi-auto, Faction based sniper rifle, you could do this. The only issue becomes how long you can hold your breath, how much of the sway is still left while holding your breath, and getting a headshot with a scope with a smaller magnification rifle. For example, the VS Spectre has a 12x scope like the Parallax, but the VS Ghost only has up to a 4x scope, and it's another no-bullet drop, VS, long-range Sniper Rifle. So by design, the SOE Devs of PS2 want Sniping to be gawd-awful, even when the TTK of it is probably extremely poor, and the magnitude is extremely high... If Theoretical TTK was 300 ms, and the input lag was another 300 ms, the total would be 600 ms or more... This would also mean that the actual TTK is higher... Probably more than 2.0 sec with the VS Parallax... Worst case, it's probably more than twice then 2.0 sec. Thus making it a poor weapon of choice.

If anyone has notice, playing a long range sniper, wields high average TTK... In other words, theres less time for shots to be made, and less 100% kills made in comparison to other weapons. It's not written in the book, but it's a given that you notice when you play one for a long time. 2 things need to change. Either the SOE devs of PS2 need to improve the average TTK, or increase the magnitude of the drop off damage and muzzle velocity, but drop the RPMS to make it that much more competitive and fun for players... I would also change Nanoweave to be a percentage base reduction in damage to all parts...

I love sniping in the game. I think all your wannabe super sniper are just fails when they still rely on a the VS Parallax, or it's faction Variants... Hell, Shotty are still more OP than Bolt Action Sniper Rifles, and the damage hasn't been nerfed... just the bloom at certain distances... I'll stop ranting...

As a TR Sniper I usually play two defined roles, with SMG, to cloak, and annoy the crap out of the enemy at CQ, it never lasts too long, but can take their focus away sometimes, which allows more mean to stream through undetected. Or from long range with the RAMS looking out for any HA with rockets aimed at any TR Tank platoon, or engineers stuck to MAX. A good infil can turn the tide of a cap on their own. I am a little bummed by how easy it is to be killed sometimes, but also understand why that is so. I wonder what will happen once they bring in the melee weapons

I'm not really sure what your point is. In some places you seem to be saying the design of sniping is bad, but at the end you seemed to attack me or other snipers for doing it badly, or... something?

This is a great post and covers some of the problems infiltrators face on a daily basis.

I absolutely love the concept of more xp awarded for distanced based kills.

Hopefully SOE reviews this thread, but just some other small suggestions I'd add.

-Silent call outs for spotting an enemy: (Not sure why a stealthy assassin is yelling in the first place).

-Different types of ammo: This could combat the nanoweave problems as well as giving a form of minimal damage to vehicles with an armor piercing type round.

-Sniping perks: As you mentioned certs to hold your breath, maybe a bi-pod, or change the forward grip (currently useless) to steady your aim for a longer duration.

-Shoot the driver of a vehicle: I don't care if the hit-box is the size of a pea I just want to have the chance to do it.