Big suprise...the update won't be till next week.

Double post

aslong as they put the magrider nerfs in this patch

I'd take bugs, they can fix it later

If they left the office for the weekend, then they would be taking a break. Looks like Higby confirmed the patch is deployed tonight!

with their idiotic and skiner box gameplay yes they ruined mmo's however they did get one thing right, they would never give a realease date on anything, only response ever given was soon, because soon is about the best you can get when dealing with code.

this,people need to calm down and take a chill pill,they are working on the stuff that needs to be fixed,if they didn't delay it,it would be hot fixing all day the day of the patch release,so take a chill pill.

There is no Magrider nerf in this patch man. There is a very slight nerf of the Saron but that won't change anything.

Let em think it got nerfed, might help.

To be fair, both rushing and delaying are bad

Delaying means something didn't go according to plan or the plan was bad, neither is a "good" thing.

I do prefer a delayed release over a rushed one myself, but I wouldn't go as far as to say that delaying stuff is good.

We can dream can't we?

Like maybe, a Dev's Mrs brought in a batch of fresh home-made Cakes and the Dev's y'know, couldn't NOT eat them, that would be downright rude. So they had to chill out for a while, eat those Rock Cakes, damn they would be delicious. They'd have to praise the tasty Rock Cakes, even though they might not personally like them, and y'know, they'd return to their Terminals and continue coding PS2 in Turbo Pascal.

I am enjoying PS2 for the record /No sarcasm

So you don't mind if for some inexplicable reason the game crashes every 5 minutes on a small percentage of machines, including yours?

Edit: Also the patch isn't delayed. It's on Sony Time.

I don't play on a taoster. Crashing is very rare for me.

looking forward to the spawnroom camping aren't you

those big nice shielded windows and 300XP kills... yummy

never leave the spawnrooms again... .its like having a legal wall hack

all it takes is 1 single misplaced " ; " in a code of 5 million lines, to cause a computer to crash.

And you have NO idea how hard it can be to find a mistake THAT simple in complex code, unless you have written programs.

Yes... for a change, it'll be the people INSIDE the spawn outhouse, camping the Tanks, libs, SF's OUTSIDE of the spawn out-house doing the camping..

Though, personally, you'll find me in the tunnels trying to 'defend' the place im actually trying to defend.

Actually something like a misplaced ";" will usually create an error code which can be viewed in a log that will show you where the problem is. Usually..... If it does it is easy to find.

The ones that are a pain in the *** is if you create some new code that contradicts some code 3 million lines up..... then you are gonna have a hair pulling problem.

True. but the ; is the easiest one to use in a quick explanation =) I had one that was a pain in the *** to find one day because it was missing from the end of a class... yet the compiler kept telling me it was missing form the END of the program.. so i had to manually go back and check every line of code to actually find it

The crying and whining that the patch is a few days late and might not be out until monday is unbelievable .......so you have to wait a few more days....................BOOOOOOOOOO f*****G HOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! Get a grip!! ffs

Just to start out this long post I would like to say thank you... I haven't had this hard of a laugh since Obama won office. Let me reiterate the original arguments for those following this several page post. Argument 3 was really the primary argument the other 2 are sub-set arguments. And really I would call them points instead of arguments but these individuals insist on breaking them down more for no reason and I am willing to play ball for laughs.

Argument 1.) Releasing products with tons of bugs is irresponsible regardless of who is to blame when those bugs are significant.

Argument 2.)It is feasible to reprimand and employee for quality of work.

Argument 3.) Setting deadlines that are not met is not a good idea (or irresponsible).

******** Poster #1

I'll make this simple on you because I'll just state the obvious and you can support it on other threads if you like.

1.) Reaver and Vanguard balancing and the Magrider lol... good ole Magrider all of which were clearly stated during beta as being ridiculously imbalanced and they launched the game anyway with it. Then after the Vanu domination (on any server I have been to, maybe not all, but even the UES showed ridiculous statistics in favor of Vanu server-wide) they kept it the same way instead of hot fixing something so they could be somewhat balanced. Here it is months later and the Vanu are so well fed they make Michael Moore look skinny. On top of that they have no way or plan to reverse it. Ridiculous. But this was out of the scope of the original argument which was "setting deadlines you cannot meet with software". Sticking to the original topic you should never set an expectation of 'fixing' something that is clearly messed up and then delay it. You get peoples hopes up and piss a lot of others off.

2.) Graphical problems. To this day almost any squad I join has intense, severe graphical problems across all platforms and systems. Ridiculous problems that often shut down whole squads when squad leaders get the bug. I get it so many times it's disgusting. At the very least keep the miss balancing and feeding of 1 faction but please dear god let people play the game. They had this problem in EQ2 when SOE released that, but I believe this is worse by far.

3.)I have huge problems I have to solve on a daily basis, often for someone titled "Governor" or "Director" and involve thousands of lives. And yes, I agree there are bugs with some of the projects I do, not all of them, but granted some of them. The argument was never that bugs do not exist nor was it that these projects get big and bugs will never exist or come as a result. Instead I was simply reiterating (probably to no avail) that if my boss had requested a balanced statistical report involving X from datasets Y Z Q and P by the time person L delivers a speech and I delivered something of this magnitude I would not be walking in to work on Monday. That does not declare that these programmers are incompetent but perhaps deadlines should not be granted to your customers (really your paycheck) with something like software when you have what seems to be guaranteed issues. This is the brunt of this statement, I could reference the other 2 arguments but I really think this was enough.

4.) I never said this was a sub-par product.... anywhere really. Again this is jumping to conclusions. I'll leave the rest for you to figure out because I have to reply to the 2 that followed you that are far less competent.

******** Poster #2

Alright this has a ton of points so I will do my cross-examination sparingly as to save the others from re-witnessing your fallacies and iterations over nothing.

1.) Since you implied or tried to supply a faulty inductive-leap I figured I would return the favor. And you fell for the trap and missed the joke, which is acceptable because it made me giggle. (I am referencing my high school quote... because I know that probably went over your head... ha did it again... and again... infinite regression... ahhhhh)

2.) Apparently having a resume makes you an expert, this is also a fallacious argument. (In case you are wondering appeal to authority. But please keep reading everything you have done and place it all over the web for others to care about)

3.) Not sure how you having and getting deadlines really has anything to do with this. Because from what I understand they set the deadlines themselves and make promises to the community. This is diagrammed like this. A>B then when they fail so "If ~A then not ~B" the community gets upset because they still have a product they released and promised to fix but did nothing for when they said they would do it. You on the other hand are given them from your boss or what have you. I am assuming (yes everything has an assumption somewhere, basic logical principle) this is ultimately determined by your customers. That would be B>A. This argument is derived from the source of the obligation set forth. Yours by your customers their deadlines clearly aren't from their customers because they can simply move it back any time they wish and customers may complain all they like but "them's da breaks" (and trust me SOE does this all the time across every game I have ever played or witnessed of theirs). So come up with something better please, this point was lacking in style.

4.) If SOE truly set the deadline on their developers and their developers did not follow through then yes it is logical or 'reasonable'. When you sign up for a job you have obligations set forth by that job. I am sure when they interviewed they were told of specific obligations, bug solving on a deadline not set by the community is probably one of them. So yes, they can be held accountable and yes they could be reprimanded because of it. Moreover I don't think 'logical' is the response you truly mean here... 'rational' or 'responsible' would be far more suitable. Logical is based on a structure and whether that structure is valid or not. This is more if the argument is 'sound' or how well the premises lead to the conclusions (this is deductive by the way not to be confused with inductive).

5.) Last the second argument was about bugs being released and why it is feasible for people to be punished quality of the game. The patch was the third argument detailing something along the lines of "don't make promises you can't keep on something that is already not working properly" I believe you are mixing the two to try and look cool... don't do it Mr. Aerospace.

6.) I actually tutored logic for several years. Granted that was many years ago at this point but most things I still retain. For instance did you know there is a difference between 'informal' and 'formal' logic? Perhaps you know of categorical logic? Don't make me take you to school, you might just learn something the second time around.

Of the 3 posters I found yours the most boring, really wish the troll community would offer better sacrifices to the bon fire.

1.) Emotion had nothing to do with any of this, not sure where my 'sympathy' comes into play at all. Honestly, I know the feeling of being pinned in the private sector... and it sucks. But, I also know the feeling a customer gets getting farmed over and over by a legion of Magriders in a game they are trying to enjoy playing. Moreover I know the feeling of someone saying "Hey, you won't be farmed any more, your faction might have a chance to counter that tank tomorrow" and then not seeing anything happen other than "oh we decided not to fix it afterwall... and the proposed patch won't drop for quite some time now". Never said I wanted their job, but I do want the results of their hard work (like any customer) and I really wanted the results before the product was given to me... not waiting 2 months+ after I received the product to be told "just wait a little longer".

2.) Who in the heck said I developed web pages? I have in the past but I haven't done that for years. Really should get back into it for a hobby now that you mention it... I wouldn't mind and it may take my mind off of VanuSide2 for a while. All these personal attacks over arguments, can't any of you kids just focus on something mature and off-the-person for once? (This is the logical fallacy of 'attack on the person').
3.) I actually don't get anything in a bunch when a patch is delayed. I get a little unnerved but really I just comment on what would happen in the real world (and actually probably is happening at SOE we just don't know it) when this stuff goes down. Your age is irrelevant, we are all kids at heart. Hug me... Valentine's day is coming up!
4.) Another attack on the person by a guy who is too lazy to type out "you" and insists on using 'U'. No, I am happy I went to college and learned to type out 3 letter words. Well that + all the beer I drank and college life in general. One more thing while I am thinking about it... I paid thousands? Heh, you get the grades you need to and impress the right people college is free. But keep the personal attacks coming, I really need something to do and it's been a long time since I had a decent back-and-forth with someone (not that this is decent but it occupied some time).
5.) In my closing I never denied there are games out there that cost more to make and had more bugs, this must just be you trying to be cool again. But keep with the personal attacks and trying to impress all the intro-webs people... I think it looks good on you. Perhaps mix in some pink next time.
I probably won't reply to this thread anymore because the fun has run its course. Enjoy, this is the only free lesson you will get (the next couple will cost you and I am not cheap).

i wouldn't mind that cause i only need 5 minutes to buy smg